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  #16  
Old 05-23-2018, 01:28 PM
Herb Hunter Herb Hunter is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ntotoro View Post
So the lesson learned is a 114 sounds almost the same as a new 814...
You may have been joking but no, that is not the lesson based on the opening post. Vindibona1 said that compared to the 114, "the 814 had more bass response and was fuller with obviously more sophisticated harmonics."
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  #17  
Old 05-23-2018, 01:38 PM
ntotoro ntotoro is offline
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Originally Posted by Herb Hunter View Post
You may have been joking but no, that is not the lesson based on the opening post. Vindibona1 said that compared to the 114, "the 814 had more bass response and was fuller with obviously more sophisticated harmonics."
I was joking. The harmonics on the 814 were obviously more "sophisticated" than my attempt at humor.

Nick
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  #18  
Old 05-23-2018, 01:48 PM
blakey blakey is offline
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Originally Posted by Herb Hunter View Post
The so-called opening up process is a natural quality of wood and not a function of guitar brand.

I would never buy a guitar whose tone didn’t fully satisfy me in hopes that its sound would improve sufficiently over time.

I buy guitars on the basis of how they sound at the time of purchase. If I like the sound, it might improve a bit over time but never worsen. If the sound doesn’t fully satisfy me, I’m confident that it will not improve over time to a degree that will compensate for what I find wanting.
This.

I had a 114ce that was always disappointing to play. Nice action, great intonation, great build but ultimately toneless. A bit like an e-type jaguar with a ford fiesta engine.
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  #19  
Old 05-23-2018, 02:24 PM
N+1 N+1 is offline
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I've played several V-braced Taylors now, and I find my impression doesn't altogether match with what others are hearing.

1. I hear the sustain. I'm not sure how important it is, but I hear it.

2. I hear the 'musicality' of the notes played high up the fret board. (I use the term 'musicality' advisedly, trying to avoid getting bogged down in the intonation debate.) Not terribly important to me personally, as I rarely venture into such unknown territory.

3. What I also hear - which no one has mentioned, so maybe it's just me - what I also hear is a sort of flabbiness in the bass when the strings are hit hard. Playing delicately everything is fine. But I can be quite a heavy-handed player, and if I do go for it, I hear a sort of uncontrolled boominess that I don't like. Comparing a 914V with a 914X, for instance, leads me to prefer the 914X because it seems so much firmer when played with enthusiasm. On the other hand, I own a 2011 914X and adore it, so I'm more accustomed to, and indeed in love with, its sound.

Anyone else hearing this?
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  #20  
Old 05-23-2018, 03:07 PM
Rip VanWinkle Rip VanWinkle is offline
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I have waited awhile to weigh in on this subject. I first heard the new Taylor V-Class guitars at NAMM this January. I really couldn't make any judgments because the ambient noise was overwhelming. Ted and Helene mentioned that they had the new guitars on order and would let me know when they came in so I could play a 914ce x braced and the new V Class 914ce and make some assessments. I should say that I first played a Taylor guitar in 2014 (long time electric guitar player). My initial impression was that they were too bright for me. Fast forward to playing the newly re-voiced 814ce in 2015. I couldn't believe the difference! It sounded like a grand piano sitting in my lap. Had to own one! I have subsequently bought a re-voiced 612ce 12 fret, a 752 LE 12 fret 12 string, and a couple of used BTO"S. I remember well reading many old time Taylor fans complaining on the AGF that they really liked the "traditional" Taylor sound and thought the Andy Powers re-voiced guitars were not an improvement. The reason I bring this up is only to say that I now understand their concerns. There is a difference between the new V-Class bracing and the previous re-voiced models. I don't like it myself, I think the OP was very gracious in offering that different strings, etc would solve the problem. With a designer as talented as Andy, I hesitate to say that his re-voiced line up will stand as the ultimate in Taylor sound. But they sure are for me! But I think I'm comfortable saying that the re-voiced Taylors were the ultimate in "X braced" Taylors. Without some unaffordable, really tweeky expensive changes I don't think Andy could make them sound better. How good will the V Class become? Don't know...we'll have to wait and see. What I have learned though this whole roll out is that Bob Taylor really loves planned obsolescence. He doesn't want to celebrate his history. The newest Taylor is the best guitar he has ever put his name on. Okay....but I'm not playing along.
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Rip VanWinkle.....
Some Martins, OO-18CS, 00-28 CS, 000-28 EC, 0000-28H LSH CS, D-18 CS, D-14 CS VTS Spruce over Morado, OM CS VTS Adi over Guatemalen, D-35 CS
Some Gibson's,
Keb Mo 00, J-35 Collectors Edition, 12-Fret AJ,
Some Taylors, 612-CE 12 Fret, Custom 12-Fret Walnut, 814CE, Custom 2015 Engleman over Ovangkol GA,752ce LTD 12x12
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  #21  
Old 05-23-2018, 05:23 PM
vindibona1 vindibona1 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Herb Hunter View Post
The so-called opening up process is a natural quality of wood and not a function of guitar brand.

I would never buy a guitar whose tone didn’t fully satisfy me in hopes that its sound would improve sufficiently over time.
You're right. It's about the wood. Maple, for instance, will open up tons while rosewood (in the short term) not as much. And there are two ways they open: Vibration and loosening of the fibers, and then aging and drying of the lignin (polymers). You can do the former artificially with a Tonerite device (or play it every day for years). The latter just happens over time, though some tops are now "torrified" to artificially dry the lignin. But it must be noted that the torrification process must be hit or miss because it appears to be very selectively done.

So, while you may not like a Taylor 614ce or a Gibson SJ-200 out of the box, these two guitar have significantly more potential in time after significant playing a guitar like an 814 or Martin D28/35 will take years to find age properly to it's full potential. So if you don't want to wait or do anything to encourage aging you're right in picking a guitar that will only change incrementally over time.
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  #22  
Old 05-29-2018, 07:59 PM
vindibona1 vindibona1 is offline
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Default Took a 2nd crack at a comparison

I had to go back before one of these guitars is sold so I could do another comparison. I brought a camera along but the input was just so over-modulated and distorted that it's not worth posting.

This trip confirmed my first analysis and then added a few more thoughts.
It seems that I'm not a fan of the V-bracing on the 814ceDLX (though some would like it.

What bothered me were two things: The high harmonics were too much, so the guitar sounded jangly and brighter than I prefer. I won't go as far as to say the high harmonics were out of control, but I thought on the edge. But because of excess highs I felt that the sound started to break up when I strummed too hard. It reminded me of a 714ce/cedar. I thought the regular 814ceDLX was more controlled an more refined and could be pounded harder and still hold its ground. Would different string help? Maybe. If it were my guitar I'd defintely have 13 and 17 on strings 1 and 2 to help tamp down the highs. Perhaps the Elixir HD lights if one was to stay with Elixir.

If you think about this particular model, (older 814ceDLX) what set it apart from the 814ce was the adirondack bracking in that particular bracing pattern. The V-class bracing was supposed to change everything... and it did on this model. But I'll leave it up to you whether or not it is a good change.
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Assuming is not knowing. Knowing is NOT the same as understanding. There is a difference between compassion and wisdom, however compassion cannot supplant wisdom, and wisdom can not occur without understanding. facts don't care about your feelings and FEELINGS ALONE MAKE FOR TERRIBLE, often irreversible DECISIONS
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