Schatten HFN (New Design)

[Petty1818]

I just tried installing the HFN with the tape and I think I prefer this method. It killed the high end that was a bit harsh with the putty. The pickup is definitely piezo sounding but it does sound quite nice.

[GuitarLuva]

Originally Posted by Petty1818

I just tried installing the HFN with the tape and I think I prefer this method. It killed the high end that was a bit harsh with the putty. The pickup is definitely piezo sounding but it does sound quite nice.

Interesting on both accounts like opposite of my experience. What guitar did you install it in? I found the putty to be well balanced and I certainly don't hear any piezo sound at all.

[Petty1818]

Originally Posted by GuitarLuva

Interesting on both accounts like opposite of my experience. What guitar did you install it in? I found the putty to be well balanced and I certainly don't hear any piezo sound at all.

It's a Taylor 310. The manual states that the tape gives a much more balanced tone where as the putty adds some clarity. I find that to be true after trying both methods. Don't get me wrong, the putty sounded great as well, I think I just prefer the tape.

In terms of the piezo tone, it's definitely there, just like with the K&K or Amulet M. Definitely more noticeable when strummed though. Oddly enough, I tried the HFN through my spectrum di and with a bit of image blended in, the piezo tone was gone and it sounded really good.

[GuitarLuva]

Originally Posted by Petty1818

It's a Taylor 310. The manual states that the tape gives a much more balanced tone where as the putty adds some clarity. I find that to be true after trying both methods. Don't get me wrong, the putty sounded great as well, I think I just prefer the tape.

In terms of the piezo tone, it's definitely there, just like with the K&K or Amulet M. Definitely more noticeable when strummed though. Oddly enough, I tried the HFN through my spectrum di and with a bit of image blended in, the piezo tone was gone and it sounded really good.

Yeah I guess it's true what they say "every guitar is different". I still don't hear any piezo tone though hopefully it sounds true when I eventually get a video done.

[Petty1818]

Originally Posted by GuitarLuva

Yeah I guess it's true what they say "every guitar is different". I still don't hear any piezo tone though hopefully it sounds true when I eventually get a video done.

Admittedly, I put way too much putty on the first install I did. I do feel that impacted the tone quite a bit, even after pressing hard. I did confirm that I have the newer abs version so I was happy to see that.

With that said, I am kind of kicking myself that I did not go for the active version. The passive is great but it would be great to have a hotter signal with the ability to eq the tone a bit without an external preamp.

[GuitarLuva]

Originally Posted by Petty1818

With that said, I am kind of kicking myself that I did not go for the active version. The passive is great but it would be great to have a hotter signal with the ability to eq the tone a bit without an external preamp.

Really? I'm getting pretty decent signal strength from the passive. I'm pretty content with being passive now, no more batteries for one but if I ever did go active again I think I would try their version that can be phantom powered. If you were dead set on going active there's no reason why you couldn't de-solder
from the end pin jack and go into an onboard preamp of your choosing. Something like the old fishman sonitone preamp would be rather cheap and easy to do.

[DownUpDave]

Originally Posted by GuitarLuva

Yeah I guess it's true what they say "every guitar is different". I still don't hear any piezo tone though hopefully it sounds true when I eventually get a video done.

I am curious now about the guitar you have the Schatten in, what is the make and model. As has been stated different guitars can get different results with different pick ups.

[guitaniac]

Originally Posted by GuitarLuva

Really? I'm getting pretty decent signal strength from the passive. I'm pretty content with being passive now, no more batteries for one but if I ever did go active again I think I would try their version that can be phantom powered. If you were dead set on going active there's no reason why you couldn't de-solder
from the end pin jack and go into an onboard preamp of your choosing. Something like the old fishman sonitone preamp would be rather cheap and easy to do.

On the subject of endpin preamps, I really like the fact that you can adjust the gain on the Schatten Design endpin preamps. That makes them adaptable to a wide spectrum of pickups, though they might not have an ideal input impedance for some pickups. If I recall correctly, the input impedance of the Schatten Design endpin preamps is in the range of two to three Mohms. That might not be enough to get the strongest possible bass end from some of the passive undersaddle pickups.

[Petty1818]

I quite like the sound I am getting with the HFN/Spectrum di set up. I think the big thing with any SBT is that there's always this want to experiment with placement, especially the HFN which really doesn't give any type of jig to use. I am going to try pairing the spectrum with my session align pedal. Right now the HFN sounds great with a bit of imaging but a bit more warmth and body would help and I am hopeful that the session will provide that.

At the end of the day though, after trying numerous pickups; Anthem SL, Lyric, K&K (in another guitar), Amulet M & Fishman Matrix w/spectrum, I have come to the conclusion that the HFN is up there with the best. Other than maybe the Lyric, it's the easiest pickup to install and experiment with and it just provides a well rounded tone. The only negative that I fear is feedback. I can see it becoming my pickup of choice.

[Monsum]

Originally Posted by Petty1818

I quite like the sound I am getting with the HFN/Spectrum di set up. I think the big thing with any SBT is that there's always this want to experiment with placement, especially the HFN which really doesn't give any type of jig to use. I am going to try pairing the spectrum with my session align pedal. Right now the HFN sounds great with a bit of imaging but a bit more warmth and body would help and I am hopeful that the session will provide that.

At the end of the day though, after trying numerous pickups; Anthem SL, Lyric, K&K (in another guitar), Amulet M & Fishman Matrix w/spectrum, I have come to the conclusion that the HFN is up there with the best. Other than maybe the Lyric, it's the easiest pickup to install and experiment with and it just provides a well rounded tone. The only negative that I fear is feedback. I can see it becoming my pickup of choice.

Thanks Petty1818 for sharing your experience with the HFN Shatten pickup. Right now I'm thinking about changing a LR Baggs Element PU with... something more natural sounding.
For simplicity reasons I'll go for either a K&K or a passive Shatten pickup. I've had the pure mini in two guitars, one was attached with the double-sided tape and the other with superglue. I haven't tried putty.
What I noticed is that the one with superglue sounds less-natural, harsh but is completely feedback free, even at louder volumes.
On the other hand, the one which I used tape sounded better but it was very tricky to use it live.

[GuitarLuva]

Originally Posted by DownUpDave

I am curious now about the guitar you have the Schatten in, what is the make and model. As has been stated different guitars can get different results with different pick ups.

I mentioned the guitar I put it in when I did the install (post #55). I realize information can get buried easily enough. I put it in an Emerald X30 guitar.

[IMG][/IMG]

[stevecuss]

Originally Posted by Petty1818

I quite like the sound I am getting with the HFN/Spectrum di set up. I think the big thing with any SBT is that there's always this want to experiment with placement, especially the HFN which really doesn't give any type of jig to use. I am going to try pairing the spectrum with my session align pedal. Right now the HFN sounds great with a bit of imaging but a bit more warmth and body would help and I am hopeful that the session will provide that.

At the end of the day though, after trying numerous pickups; Anthem SL, Lyric, K&K (in another guitar), Amulet M & Fishman Matrix w/spectrum, I have come to the conclusion that the HFN is up there with the best. Other than maybe the Lyric, it's the easiest pickup to install and experiment with and it just provides a well rounded tone. The only negative that I fear is feedback. I can see it becoming my pickup of choice.

This is really helpful, thanks. Mine will arrive next week and I ordered both putty and tape from Schatten. Do you prefer it over the Trance now days? I am very happy with my Trance and have a K&K in another guitar. I'll either switch out thre k&K or more likely lend the Schatten to a friend who is currently having pickup woes.

[guitaniac]

Originally Posted by Petty1818

I quite like the sound I am getting with the HFN/Spectrum di set up. I think the big thing with any SBT is that there's always this want to experiment with placement, especially the HFN which really doesn't give any type of jig to use. I am going to try pairing the spectrum with my session align pedal. Right now the HFN sounds great with a bit of imaging but a bit more warmth and body would help and I am hopeful that the session will provide that.

At the end of the day though, after trying numerous pickups; Anthem SL, Lyric, K&K (in another guitar), Amulet M & Fishman Matrix w/spectrum, I have come to the conclusion that the HFN is up there with the best. Other than maybe the Lyric, it's the easiest pickup to install and experiment with and it just provides a well rounded tone. The only negative that I fear is feedback. I can see it becoming my pickup of choice.

Please let us know how the HFN/Session combo works out for you.

With respect to the "a bit of imaging" reference, I presume you're referring to ToneDexter? What blend are you favoring for the HFN/ToneDexter combo?

[Petty1818]

Originally Posted by guitaniac

Please let us know how the HFN/Session combo works out for you.

With respect to the "a bit of imaging" reference, I presume you're referring to ToneDexter? What blend are you favoring for the HFN/ToneDexter combo?

Oh sorry, just to clarify, I am actually using the Fishman Spectrum DI. It was a bit of a random pairing but I found that a bit of imaging blended in really made the HFN sound just about perfect. The problem with the Tonedexter is that I can only go as low as 30% blend and even then I find the wavemap to be a bit too overpowering.

[Petty1818]

Originally Posted by stevecuss

This is really helpful, thanks. Mine will arrive next week and I ordered both putty and tape from Schatten. Do you prefer it over the Trance now days? I am very happy with my Trance and have a K&K in another guitar. I'll either switch out thre k&K or more likely lend the Schatten to a friend who is currently having pickup woes.

Schatten actually ships the HFN with the putty and tape so it's pretty easy to experiment. They also give quite a bit of both.

I personally could never get the Amulet M to sound right. I got compliments on my sound but it was too hi-fi for me. The HFN on the other hand sounds more balanced and the feel is just awesome. I definitely prefer it. With that said, I do think the Amulet M is a pro piece of gear and I am confident that if I ever install it in another guitar, I will get a good tone.