Am I being unreasonable ?

[Portland Bill]

Not too long ago I had some repairs done to a rare and handmade guitar that I own, it’s not hugely valuable as the maker isn’t that well known.

This consisted of a neck reset, re fret and some repairs to the bridge and bridge plate, all of these have been done extremely well, however all is not well.

The first thing I noticed was that the guitar had been shipped back to me with the strings at full tension, not very professional IMO.
Also the handmade label had suffered substantial water damage, the nut had been shimmed and glued in to place.
There was substantial lacquer cracking to the top that was not there before and I’d requested that the instrument be given a buff and polish to just freshen it up, I was quite happy to pay for this and said so.
It clearly hasn’t been done and moreover, the area of the neck joint has been over sprayed has not been cut back at all and has that rippling effect which looks a mess.

I aired my griefs with him and didn’t get a satisfactory or helpful response.

I’d be interested to know your opinions on this, I’m very aware that you can’t make an omelette without breaking eggs up to a point ?

Best Regards Anthony.

[Silly Moustache]

Originally Posted by Portland Bill

Not too long ago I had some repairs done to a rare and handmade guitar that I own, it’s not hugely valuable as the maker isn’t that well known.

This consisted of a neck reset, re fret and some repairs to the bridge and bridge plate, all of these have been done extremely well, however all is not well.

The first thing I noticed was that the guitar had been shipped back to me with the strings at full tension, not very professional IMO.
Also the handmade label had suffered substantial water damage, the nut had been shimmed and glued in to place.
There was substantial lacquer cracking to the top that was not there before and I’d requested that the instrument be given a buff and polish to just freshen it up, I was quite happy to pay for this and said so.
It clearly hasn’t been done and moreover, the area of the neck joint has been over sprayed has not been cut back at all and has that rippling effect which looks a mess.

I aired my griefs with him and didn’t get a satisfactory or helpful response.

I’d be interested to know your opinions on this, I’m very aware that you can’t make an omelette without breaking eggs up to a point ?

Best Regards Anthony.

Hi, there are conflicting opinions about loosening strings in transit.

I bought my last two guitars online one was shipped to me from London and the other from the Netherlands (so across the sea!) and both were to tension on arrival - no issues. If a guitar is likely to be subjected to below freezing for a significant period, it may be wiser to loosen tension.

Neck resets often require steaming for a long period. This is probably why the label got wet. Clumsy I guess, but that process may have taken overnight or longer depending on the original join.

Bridge and bridge plate work is fiddly and difficult depending on the glues used originally. I imagine it requires some brute force. Who can say what the top finish was like -as you say it is an older instrument.

Maybe buffing it up was unwise? I have an archtop which was stored for a long time in extreme temperatures and my tech advised me that the finish was vulnerable. More crazing than my similar guitar built in 1934! I hand polish my guitars mostly every string change. Try some "Regency Gold - its the best I've ever found.

The shimmed nut is also a common practice to retain your string spacing. If it looks ugly have a new one made.

The neck join - always difficult. I've had similr issues.

I think that when radical work like this is done on an older guitar it should be agreed in advance whether the criteria is play-ability or looks/restoration.

However, you now have a fully playable AND reliced guitar!

[Malcolm Kindnes]

Originally Posted by Silly Moustache

Hi, there are conflicting opinions about loosening strings in transit.

I bought my last two guitars online one was shipped to me from London and the other from the Netherlands (so across the sea!) and both were to tension on arrival - no issues. If a guitar is likely to be subjected to below freezing for a significant period, it may be wiser to loosen tension.

Neck resets often require steaming for a long period. This is probably why the label got wet. Clumsy I guess, but that process may have taken overnight or longer depending on the original join.

Bridge and bridge plate work is fiddly and difficult depending on the glues used originally. I imagine it requires some brute force. Who can say what the top finish was like -as you say it is an older instrument.

Maybe buffing it up was unwise? I have an archtop which was stored for a long time in extreme temperatures and my tech advised me that the finish was vulnerable. More crazing than my similar guitar built in 1934! I hand polish my guitars mostly every string change. Try some "Regency Gold - its the best I've ever found.

The shimmed nut is also a common practice to retain your string spacing. If it looks ugly have a new one made.

The neck join - always difficult. I've had similr issues.

I think that when radical work like this is done on an older guitar it should be agreed in advance whether the criteria is play-ability or looks/restoration.

However, you now have a fully playable AND reliced guitar!

Excellent answer Andy.

[Rogerblair]

SM made some valid points, but I would expect that an experienced and competent repair person would have cautioned you in advance that these things sometimes happen. You would have had the option to proceed or not, based on this risk factor.

I would be upset also.

Roger

[beatcomber]

Originally Posted by Rogerblair

SM made some valid points, but I would expect that an experienced and competent repair person would have cautioned you in advance that these things sometimes happen. You would have had the option to proceed or not, based on this risk factor.

I would be upset also.

Roger

That is the real issue here, it would appear... the luthier's failure to manage the customer's expectations and not providing unfront the information necessary for the customer to make a decision on the best course of action.

[Portland Bill]

Thanks for the input guys, it’s really the label that bothers me the most, the guy that made the guitar died young and it bears his signature and date, and it would surely have been so easy to protect I would have thought or am I wrong in this ?

[stephenT]

Originally Posted by Portland Bill

Thanks for the input guys, it’s really the label that bothers me the most, the guy that made the guitar died young and it bears his signature and date, and it would surely have been so easy to protect I would have thought or am I wrong in this ?

Let me post an alternate viewpoint,.. Since the label holds sentimental value to you, maybe you should have taken the time to cover it to protect it.

But the other issues you mention, sloppy work.

[godfreydaniel]

Originally Posted by Portland Bill

It clearly hasn’t been done and moreover, the area of the neck joint has been over sprayed has not been cut back at all and has that rippling effect which looks a mess.

Can you clarify what you mean by “has not been cut back at all”?

Also, it sounds like this repair person did the overspray, correct?

[SRL]

Originally Posted by Portland Bill

Thanks for the input guys, it’s really the label that bothers me the most, the guy that made the guitar died young and it bears his signature and date, and it would surely have been so easy to protect I would have thought or am I wrong in this ?

No, you're not wrong. Protecting a label is easy.

That, combined with poor communication before (should have asked if you wanted a new nut or shims, should have explained risks) and after (should have explained what happened), indicates someone who likely doesn't care very much about what they're doing.

I haven't seen your guitar, but I *have* seen plenty of neck resets where the work is very clean. I kind of wonder if it had been a Martin D45 or some other well-known, valuable guitar, he would have done a better job...

I'm not going to throw blame on you, since you're not the one hanging a shingle and calling yourself a luthier. But how much due diligence did you do on this guy before hiring him?

[Portland Bill]

Originally Posted by SRL

No, you're not wrong. Protecting a label is easy.

That, combined with poor communication before (should have asked if you wanted a new nut or shims, should have explained risks) and after (should have explained what happened), indicates someone who likely doesn't care very much about what they're doing.

I haven't seen your guitar, but I *have* seen plenty of neck resets where the work is very clean. I kind of wonder if it had been a Martin D45 or some other well-known, valuable guitar, he would have done a better job...

I'm not going to throw blame on you, since you're not the one hanging a shingle and calling yourself a luthier. But how much due diligence did you do on this guy before hiring him?

The guy came highly recommended, by a number of sources.

[Portland Bill]

Originally Posted by stephenT

Let me post an alternate viewpoint,.. Since the label holds sentimental value to you, maybe you should have taken the time to cover it to protect it.

But the other issues you mention, sloppy work.

I find this response rather odd, I’m paying the guy to do the work yet I have to carry out precautionary protection on his behalf, if I thought I needed to do that I wouldn’t have hired him.

[Portland Bill]

Originally Posted by godfreydaniel

Can you clarify what you mean by “has not been cut back at all”?

Also, it sounds like this repair person did the overspray, correct?

Yes the overspray was done by him, if you look at finish when it’s been freshly sprayed on, it has an uneven rippled appearance until it’s cut back and polished, this has that uneven rippled appearance.

[blindboyjimi]

Shipping at full tension is no big deal, nor is the nut. Most people are used to their guitar feel and a shim will raise the nut to the new fret height without changing the feel. But the other stuff, especially the overspray I’d be upset about. The label is easy to protect and should’ve been. My tech is excellent even amazing at set-ups and re-frets but does no lutherie. My luthier does my neck re-sets, bridge, and bridge plate work and he communicates with me every opportunity when something unforeseen comes up and lets me be the judge whether to overspray or shellac an area where the finish gets affected by steam or bridge plate work. This sounds like a tech tried to be a luthier, yet you said he’s well known. So the question is: well known as a tech or a luthier?

[stephenT]

Originally Posted by Portland Bill

I find this response rather odd, I’m paying the guy to do the work yet I have to carry out precautionary protection on his behalf, if I thought I needed to do that I wouldn’t have hired him.

I find it odd you suggest it's for the benefit of the repair guy and not you the owner,.. the person who has the attachment to the instrument and label.

[davenumber2]

Originally Posted by stephenT

I find it odd you suggest it's for the benefit of the repair guy and not you the owner,.. the person who has the attachment to the instrument and label.

Bottom line, the owner shouldn't have to do anything. When you take a guitar in for work do you expect to get it back with the label ruined? Care should have been taken by the "luthier" to protect it, plain and simple.