mac or pc

[selectedout]

bang for buck go PC..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=7S4YS0_d-nE

[bobby b]

Originally Posted by Joseph Hanna

Bobby,

What does this mean?

Simply a response to the OP's thread title "mac or pc"?

.......

I am a recording/mixing engineer.
I ventured from recording and mixing music ( all types ), into the world of sound for Film and TV where I have worked as a foley, walla/ADR recordist and SFX re-recording mixer.
I also instruct Film and TV post audio recording and mixing at a Film School.

Not sooo long ago..............I used to record music completely in the analogue realm, to open reel tape via outboard preamps , comps' , eq's etc etc... loved it........ lotta work....... lotta cables... lotta tape...... lotta fun....
I still know of a few places that will also track to tape, just for that fat tape saturation, and then dump to Protools for final mix

Nowadays I have many places I can use to record, home, work, and various other studios in town.
All are Protools rigs and all running on mac's ....some just an m-box, some full blown PT HD rigs.
I my experience mac is ubiquitous in the world of sound for digital media, Music and Film.

[KevWind]

Just to clarify, the Mac vs PC price discussion has been going on for a good long time. The idea that a Mac is significantly more expensive, while true in the past is only partially correct today. Over all the price for an entry level PC is going to be less than an entry level Mac... BUT the entry level Mac is usually going spec out at a higher level of performance and or offer more features.
However in todays market, in a direct comparison of price per equal performance, specification,features and quality of components, with the major name brand PCs, there is actually a much closer parity of price as opposed to the past . The one caveat to that is with Mac you have fewer options, Mac has their basic models line up with some upgrade options and can include features that perhaps some consumers dont want or need for their specific usage. With PC you have much more configuration options and in cases where that falls in between Mac models, you can have equal performance for less money with the elimination of unwanted features but generally more in the 10 to 20 percent less range and not in the the 30 to 40 percent range of 4 or 5 years ago. (if you are knowledgeable enough to build from scratch you can of course increase the price to performance ratio)

[him]

Well that's the theory anyway.

First let me get this out of the way: Get a mac. It allows you to skip far closer to the desired end result in most cases. That's worth something, and justifies a higher price. And you'll probably never even recognize the limits it imposes. It's like how if you want music you buy a CD (download MP3s, whatever) instead of trying to make your own.

Now abou that high end machines are about the sme price argument.... I thought the same thing. Then a few months ago I was in the market for a new laptop. I decided to settle for a 15" class machine. The obvious choice was a MBP.

Unfortunately, with a little shopping I realized I could get a 15.4" 1920x1080 display, quad core i7 (2.5ghz 2860), 500g 7200rpm hd, 120gb ssd, the fanciest wifi option, built in color calibration for the display, 16g ram, slick gpu, 9hr batery life and so on from Lenovo for almost $1000 less than a similarly equipped MBP, or a similarly equipped HP or Dell for about $700 less. Obviously those are dated specs now but the point is that my bubble popped and I own (and am quite happy with) a lenovo. I've also got decades of PC experience.

[KevWind]

Humm ? Not trying to be argumentative honestly BUT you must have received one heck of deal cause I was curious if my dated info was no longer current, so I just went to Lenovos and Mac web store and priced up comparable units and came up with this..

I included the top anti virus, bluethooth,the top graphics, top wifi and the least expensive photo software. for the Lenovo. Which if I am not off base or mistaken would be for parity or apples to lenos not to mention when you call apple support, you get a 28 yr old california computer wiz kid to talk to.

I did the 3 yr warrenty for both and the antiglare display for both Result the Mac was aprox. $300 more ... 300 diff in a $3000 unit is aprox 10 % so If you were able to accomplish for another $700

[him]

Originally Posted by KevWind

I did the 3 yr warrenty for both and the antiglare display for both Result the Mac was aprox. $300 more ... 300 diff in a $3000 unit is aprox 10 % so If you were able to accomplish for another $700

The difference is that Lenovo regularly runs promos. Apple doesn't.

I have a w520.

The closest equivalent to what I own that Apple sells comes in at $2849 but is lacking in a number of areas:
1) RAM is half (8gb vs. 16gb)
2) HD is slightly higher capacity (750g) but slower (the 120g flash + 500g 7200rpm combo is pretty nice)
3) Display is not full res. (1680x1050 vs 1920x1080)
4) No display color calibration

I paid a little over 2K for mine, after easily-available-to-everyone promotional discounts were applied, but if you cut the specs down (ram, omit the color sensor, etc) the price difference grew. I can't say it was exactly $1000 (this was back in October and I don't recall the precise numbers) but it was closer to $1000 than to $900.

[PorkPieGuy]

I recorded my first project on a 5-year old Dell using a $25 recording program; the computer was probably worth about $150 at the time.

I recorded my second and third projects on a 4-year old Dell laptop using the same $25 program. This computer was probably worth about $150 at the time as well.

I recorded my fourth project on a $300 Compaq I bought from Walmart. I was able to record my entire project using Reaper during the free 30-day trial period. I record using a matched pair of Behringer C2 mics (less than $50 for both mics), a small Mackie board (cost about $100, used), and an M-Audio interface ($65 used Craigslist). I thought that if I completely wear out this computer recording this one project, as long as I get completely through with the CD, I'm fine. $300 wouldn't buy a weekend in a decent studio.

So far, I've had 4 write-ups/reviews in an international magazine, had 4 songs featured on their compilation CDs, received a decent review in Downbeat magazine, been in a few local newspapers, have over 23k hits on one of my youtube videos, been featured in a video promoting a local general store, was picked up by a public radio station in Wisconsin and was featured on its Christmas radio program, have been played on various other local radio stations, etc.

Through my CD sales on my sub-par equipment that most would turn up their nose at, I have bought my family patio furniture and a cover for the back porch. I bought a Taylor GC8 last year...in cash. This year, my family is finishing our basement...all funded with money from my CD sales. I've also been able to take my family out to eat, go on vacations, etc. mostly funded by my projects. The thing is, I don't play out but maybe once a month and do a wedding here or there.

I didn't say all of this to brag; I said all of this to say that the public does not care what kind of computer you record on. All they care about is good music.

Practice hard.

Make good music.

People will be happy and buy your CDs.

[KevWind]

Originally Posted by PorkPieGuy

I recorded my first project on a 5-year old Dell using a $25 recording program; the computer was probably worth about $150 at the time.

I recorded my second and third projects on a 4-year old Dell laptop using the same $25 program. This computer was probably worth about $150 at the time as well.

I recorded my fourth project on a $300 Compaq I bought from Walmart. I was able to record my entire project using Reaper during the free 30-day trial period. I record using a matched pair of Behringer C2 mics (less than $50 for both mics), a small Mackie board (cost about $100, used), and an M-Audio interface ($65 used Craigslist). I thought that if I completely wear out this computer recording this one project, as long as I get completely through with the CD, I'm fine. $300 wouldn't buy a weekend in a decent studio.

So far, I've had 4 write-ups/reviews in an international magazine, had 4 songs featured on their compilation CDs, received a decent review in Downbeat magazine, been in a few local newspapers, have over 23k hits on one of my youtube videos, been featured in a video promoting a local general store, was picked up by a public radio station in Wisconsin and was featured on its Christmas radio program, have been played on various other local radio stations, etc.

Through my CD sales on my sub-par equipment that most would turn up their nose at, I have bought my family patio furniture and a cover for the back porch. I bought a Taylor GC8 last year...in cash. This year, my family is finishing our basement...all funded with money from my CD sales. I've also been able to take my family out to eat, go on vacations, etc. mostly funded by my projects. The thing is, I don't play out but maybe once a month and do a wedding here or there.

I didn't say all of this to brag; I said all of this to say that the public does not care what kind of computer you record on. All they care about is good music.

Practice hard.

Make good music.

People will be happy and buy your CDs.

. Good point and
congrats on your success. And of course the same success could be enjoyed sans a computer altogether by using a direct to CD all in device. Which is a different subject than the OP which was simply asking " Mac or Pc " thus the ensuing discussion.

[KevWind]

Originally Posted by him

The difference is that Lenovo regularly runs promos. Apple doesn't.

I have a w520.

The closest equivalent to what I own that Apple sells comes in at $2849 but is lacking in a number of areas:
1) RAM is half (8gb vs. 16gb)
2) HD is slightly higher capacity (750g) but slower (the 120g flash + 500g 7200rpm combo is pretty nice)
3) Display is not full res. (1680x1050 vs 1920x1080)
4) No display color calibration

I paid a little over 2K for mine, after easily-available-to-everyone promotional discounts were applied, but if you cut the specs down (ram, omit the color sensor, etc) the price difference grew. I can't say it was exactly $1000 (this was back in October and I don't recall the precise numbers) but it was closer to $1000 than to $900.

Still. The screen shots above are pretty clear and telling and the computers are almost identical spec wise as per my my original post . Both have the same RAM the same SSHD. And the same anti glare hi res screens and both have an additional 3 year warranty . However the Lenovo is claiming to be already over a thousand dollars discounted off of list price while the Mac is list price and barring any additional special discounts the " theory" appears substantiated.
And as you stated not to mention ease of use etc. All in all both will do the job it comes down to preference.

[him]

Originally Posted by KevWind

... the " theory" appears substantiated.

I think what this whole discussion really shows is that what we want to be true, appears true to us.

After all, even your numbers showed a 10%/$300 advantage to the Lenovo. All we're quibbling about is how wrong the theory of price parity really is.

Originally Posted by KevWind

All in all both will do the job it comes down to preference.

For recording, yes.

[KevWind]

Originally Posted by him

I think what this whole discussion really shows is that what we want to be true, appears true to us.

After all, even your numbers showed a 10%/$300 advantage to the Lenovo. All we're quibbling about is how wrong the theory of price parity really is.



For recording, yes.

Fair enough

[PorkPieGuy]

Originally Posted by KevWind

. Good point and
congrats on your success. And of course the same success could be enjoyed sans a computer altogether by using a direct to CD all in device. Which is a different subject than the OP which was simply asking " Mac or Pc " thus the ensuing discussion.

Thanks. I feel very blessed to be able to do what I do. I played for years in rock bands and whatnot with very limited amounts of success, but still got to do some pretty cool stuff. I have lots of stories to tell the grandkids. I have finally found my niche, and I really enjoy what I do.

It's really true that you don't have to have the best recording equipment to record good music. Some of my favorite recordings/songs were done on tape.

Best of luck to the OP! I hope that everything works out, and let us know what you decide to do.

[Yoder]

Originally Posted by moon

The only downside of macs is the price, if that's an issue. Personally I'd rather build my own PC, run linux, and put the money I save into better mics.

I do agree though: Mac & Apogee is one of the best options you can get for a home studio (but be aware that there seem to be some Lion driver problems right now although I'm sure that'll get sorted out).

I have done a lot of research over the years and the argument that Mac's cost more is an invalid argument. If you just look at raw specs then you may be able to get a cheaper Windows box. The argument that one could build a cheaper one may be true, but not everyone wants to build a computer and Windows and Linux cannot run a lot of the software out there that is available for OS X. I build my own audio components, and can build a system for far less than most people can buy a mediocre one...but, DIY is not for everyone.

If a person were to pack a computer with the same quality of components that you would get with a Mac, then both machines will cost about the same and sometimes the Mac will be cheaper. There are a couple of things that you cannot get with a stock Windows computer: 1) a trackpad second to none, 2) TOSLINK capabilities via the headphone jack, 3) native 64-bit UNIX kernel, 4) screen resolutions and colors, 5) simple built in audio capabilities, 6) FW800 and/or Thunderbolt, 7) hardware that is built like a military component, 8) Mac's do not depreciate much in value, etc.

Please don't get me wrong, I am not trying to start a flame war...but, you do get what you pay for. Finally, most of the Lion driver issues can be traced to the second party vendors. Some, like Creative, just do not want to upgrade the drivers. You can run into the same problems if you run Snow Leopard in 64-bit mode.