How long before a brand new cedar top opens up?

[Dracorex0]

Sounded great on YouTube. Doesn’t make sense to me that it would sound so different irl. It’s the cort ga5f bw ns. Y’all are right though. Gonna stick it out for a couple of weeks, then get a refund if it hasn’t improved [emoji18]

[roylor4]

Cedar sounds good from jump-street as others have stated. IMO, if it doesn't, don't keep it. Every new Cedar topped guitar I have owned and played were quieter and MUCH warmer and slightly darker sounding than Spruce without any spikey highs. They do "open up" a tad, but nothing like Spruce IME.

[Dracorex0]

To my ears this one actually sounds brighter than the sitka spruce top I tested before it. I’m looking for a warm guitar for fingerstyle mostly.

[Bob from Brooklyn]

Maybe you should be looking at hog top guitars.

[drplayer]

Originally Posted by paulzoom

I never heard of cedar being a wood that needs to open up. Mine sounded great from the get-go.

I tend to agree with this. I'm sure cedar does open up, but those I've owned and played have sounded open and warm right from the start. In fact, I've never purchased or kept a guitar (regardless of tone wood) that didn't sound great to my ear right from the start. I simply don't understand the concept of buying a mediocre sounding guitar and hoping that at some point it will sound as you had anticipated. Life's too short and there are too many great guitar to wait for magic to happen with one that is just so-so...

[SleepyAudi]

Takes about 8 hours for a music speaker or guitar speaker to break in. Pretty accepted fact in the hifi states. Given the top of an acoustic guitar is like a speaker snd the backs are like the box/cabinet I do believe it will break in. But it’s a lot bigger and stiffer so I’d imagine it takes a LONG bit of playing for a stiffer wood to break in.

[ljguitar]

Originally Posted by Dracorex0

Ordered it online. Sounds much stiffer than I expected. I heard cedar opens up quickly. How quick can I expect when I play it an hour a day?

Hi Drac-etc

I own an Olson Dreadnought (1993-94) East Indian Rosewood/Cedar which sounded amazing when it arrived, and noticeably opened up for about 20 years before I'd say it's not continued maturing. (It's still an amazing sounding and highly responsive guitar at 28 years of age).

I had a Martin D-28 which I owned for 17 years (Spruce top) and it continued to improve/mature and improved in responsiveness noticeably for at least 15 of those years.

I think responsiveness and projection and other desirable qualities are a result of the builder, not necessarily the wood. I've played many Western Red Cedar topped guitars and they are darker, and richer toned than their Spruce, or Mahogany contemporaries. The Mahogany ones tended to start a bit harsher and then mellow out over the years whereas the Cedar started dark toned and continued down that path.

I've played less expensive Cedar Topped guitars (like Seagulls) which I never perceived a tonal improvement over a period of 5-6 years. My perceptions were, it isn't Western Red Cedar, and over compared to my other guitars…and I didn't expect a $400 instrument to respond to aging the same as upscale guitars.

I have played many other upscale and handuilt guitars with Cedar tops.

They sounded warmer up front (not necessarily that much more responsive) than Spruce.

These are just my perceptions, and I expect them to be everyone's experiences.

[Mandobart]

Originally Posted by ljguitar

....I own an Olson Dreadnought (1993-94) East Indian Rosewood/Cedar which sounded amazing when it arrived, and noticeably opened up for about 20 years before I'd say it's not continued maturing. (It's still an amazing sounding and highly responsive guitar at 28 years of age).

I had a Martin D-28 which I owned for 17 years (Spruce top) and it continued to improve/mature and improved in responsiveness noticeably for at least 15 of those years.

Do most of us even know how our ears change over 15, 17, 20, 28 years? I do, only because my job requires an annual audiogram to measure my actual hearing loss (I work in a power plant with lots of heavy rotating machinery and water/steam piping). If anyone says "I heard it change" over a period of 10 years or more I'm certain a portion of what you "heard" was due to changes in you, not just the guitar.

Originally Posted by ljguitar

...I think responsiveness and projection and other desirable qualities are a result of the builder, not necessarily the wood.

This cannot be overemphasized. The builder is the single largest contributor to the final sound.

Originally Posted by ljguitar

...I've played many Western Red Cedar topped guitars and they are darker, and richer toned than their Spruce, or Mahogany contemporaries. The Mahogany ones tended to start a bit harsher and then mellow out over the years whereas the Cedar started dark toned and continued down that path.

I've played less expensive Cedar Topped guitars (like Seagulls) which I never perceived a tonal improvement over a period of 5-6 years. My perceptions were, it isn't Western Red Cedar, and over compared to my other guitars…and I didn't expect a $400 instrument to respond to aging the same as upscale guitars.

Where "cedar" can mean a lot of different species (Port Oroford, eastern red, western red, spanish, etc.) I'm pretty sure that Seagull guitars, being built in Canada, which is the principal source of western red cedar used around the world - do in fact use western red cedar. I think the difference you hear is once again attributable to the builder.

[LakewoodM32Fan]

Originally Posted by Mandobart

[/B]

Do most of us even know how our ears change over 15, 17, 20, 28 years? I do, only because my job requires an annual audiogram to measure my actual hearing loss (I work in a power plant with lots of heavy rotating machinery and water/steam piping). If anyone says "I heard it change" over a period of 10 years or more I'm certain a portion of what you "heard" was due to changes in you, not just the guitar

This is a great point. Actually the other day I wondered about that myself and put on my best pair of headphones, connected to a headphone amp, and hit the test tones. Right now I can still hear reliably up to about 18khz. I couldn't reliably hear the 20khz test tone (there were times I thought I might have heard it, but that could have been imagination).

Still, I'm glad to know I can still hear up to at least 18khz. In my late forties, so hopefully I still continue to take care of my hearing and have it last a while longer.

[EZYPIKINS]

Originally Posted by Dracorex0

Sounded great on YouTube. Doesn’t make sense to me that it would sound so different irl. It’s the cort ga5f bw ns. Y’all are right though. Gonna stick it out for a couple of weeks, then get a refund if it hasn’t improved [emoji18]

You are kidding right? You can't compare what a computer will do to sound, with a real instrument. People have been blinded in the last 30 years as to what music is supposed to sound like.
This is why you'll not hear my music on a computer. I refuse. One album I converted to MP3 the original warm sound of the analogue recording went right in the crapper. If you want to hear a guitar properly. You have to be in the room with it.

[AndrewG]

Originally Posted by EZYPIKINS

You are kidding right? You can't compare what a computer will do to sound, with a real instrument. People have been blinded in the last 30 years as to what music is supposed to sound like.
This is why you'll not hear my music on a computer. I refuse. One album I converted to MP3 the original warm sound of the analogue recording went right in the crapper. If you want to hear a guitar properly. You have to be in the room with it.

Hear, hear! Once that signal has been played through some nondescript microphone, compressed and processed, and finally emerges via laptop speakers and headphones it loses any semblance of its true, uncoloured, self.

[leew3]

I'm with those saying their cedar topped guitars sounded great new and got better. A cedar top is going to sound different, but in my experience should have that 'warmth' you say you're looking for. By 'warmth' I mean balanced highs and mids that decay a bit more quickly than spruce and predominant but not 'boomy' bass. My Larrivee has all of this and has only improved over the years but I use it mostly as a strummer, not finger style. I should note that there is the possibility that some of my sense of the warm trebles can be attributed to my high frequency hearing loss as well! (though I typically wear my hearing aids when playing)

[FingahPickah]

Originally Posted by Brooklyn Bob

My Eastman sounded good as soon as I picked it up.

Yup... mine too. The E2OM-CD was a good addition.

[Doxyshusband]

Originally Posted by Dracorex0

Oh that seems doable

Best get started then.

[donlyn]

How long before a brand new cedar top opens up?

Originally Posted by jim1960

There's no formula for how long it takes for any top to open up nor is there any real evidence that such a thing happens.

This is one of those "your mileage may vary" things. I do believe that not only does your hearing change, but also a given guitar's output. In my experience you won't notice it changing at all on a short term, day-by-day, basis. And it's possible that after getting familiar with a specific guitar, you may be playing to its strengths and deceiving yourself. That said, I do believe this happens to all guitars when they are well cared for.

For example, I have an essentially NOS Taylor 412e-R Grand Concert which I tested out on least 3 separate occasions before purchasing. I just wasn't sure, but some hand issues got me looking for a short scale guitar and I ended up getting this one. A year or so back, I realized just how good this instrument is, and it is a keeper. While I think part of that was myself adjusting to the guitar, it also sounds incredibly good and a big improvement over when I got it. But somehow I just noticed that one day, thinking, "Wow; this has never sounded better, and is not like it sounded when I bought it." I think it just had to change a little bit at a time, and I never noticed it, especially since I played it almost every day, until it just sounded like a different, better instrument.

Don
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