Alternating picking w/ thumb pick help

[crobi027]

Been finger picking for a long time and it’s easy for me to play a lot of John Hurt’s stuff but I can’t nail some of the Gary Davis runs I want to. I really don’t want to use a thumb pick but I might have to unless I change the runs into something more manageable. Ideas?!
Using a thumb pick is like starting all over with my right hand

[NormanKliman]

What parts of what Gary Davis tunes? It would help if you uploaded a file or at least pointed out a YouTube video and the minutes and seconds.

I've got nothing against thumb picks, but I'll never play with one. Some of those eighth-note runs work with alternating thumb and index. Slurs and open strings are another way to get around the harder parts.

[J.DrewPetersen]

A thumb pick let's you make up and down strokes that don't really work bare handed. I play both ways depending on the piece. I use the Herco thumbpick and it makes it easy to switch from finger to a more flat pick style and back again.

[crobi027]

Originally Posted by NormanKliman

What parts of what Gary Davis tunes? It would help if you uploaded a file or at least pointed out a YouTube video and the minutes and seconds.

I've got nothing against thumb picks, but I'll never play with one. Some of those eighth-note runs work with alternating thumb and index. Slurs and open strings are another way to get around the harder parts.

Take 12 Sticks for example, that run he does after the E7, A7, D7 in G, open position starting from the 1st string. I can’t play it without hammering on which doesn’t sound good. The banjo rolls are easy for me but I can’t hit that ruN

[NormanKliman]

Originally Posted by crobi027

Take 12 Sticks for example, that run he does after the E7, A7, D7 in G, open position starting from the 1st string. I can’t play it without hammering on which doesn’t sound good. The banjo rolls are easy for me but I can’t hit that ruN

I don't play Twelve Sticks but I'll give it a shot. Like I said, you're going to have to upload a file or point out a YouTube video/audio, the minutes and the seconds.

I just had a look at YouTube and saw three videos of people playing Twelve Sticks (two of them with thumbpicks).

[crobi027]

Originally Posted by NormanKliman

What parts of what Gary Davis tunes? It would help if you uploaded a file or at least pointed out a YouTube video and the minutes and seconds.

I've got nothing against thumb picks, but I'll never play with one. Some of those eighth-note runs work with alternating thumb and index. Slurs and open strings are another way to get around the harder parts.

26 seconds in:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=1hqML-b84EM

[NormanKliman]

Originally Posted by crobi027

26 seconds in:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=1hqML-b84EM

Hey, that was fast! I mean your response, and that run, too. Okay, I've recorded it with Audacity and have slowed it down. Give me some time to work it out on the git-fiddle and I'll post something here.

By the way, as J.DrewPetersen suggested, if you want it sound just like him, you'll have to play it with a thumb pick, and you know Gary Davis is playing a 12 string there, right? Since I don't have either, I just do things my own way when I can't get his sound exactly.

[crobi027]

Originally Posted by NormanKliman

Hey, that was fast! I mean your response, and that run, too. Okay, I've recorded it with Audacity and have slowed it down. Give me some time to work it out on the git-fiddle and I'll post something here.

By the way, as J.DrewPetersen suggested, if you want it sound just like him, you'll have to play it with a thumb pick, and you know Gary Davis is playing a 12 string there, right? Since I don't have either, I just do things my own way when I can't get his sound exactly.

Yeah I know he does, but playing with one is very foreign to me so I’m trying to get by without it. The run is probably 3,2,0 on the first string, 3,1,0 on the second string, etc (G scale). If I really get warmed up I can kind of hit it.
I can position my thumb and index finger on one string to play a triplet or my index and middle but not quickly.

[crobi027]

Originally Posted by J.DrewPetersen

A thumb pick let's you make up and down strokes that don't really work bare handed. I play both ways depending on the piece. I use the Herco thumbpick and it makes it easy to switch from finger to a more flat pick style and back again.

Thanks, do you know any good exercises for alternate picking with a thumb pick? Would love some direction

[NormanKliman]

Yeah, it's all in first position in the Stefan Grossman video:

https://youtu.be/nqyGM36lXiU?t=43

I'm getting reasonable results doing it there with index and middle (picado technique, alternating the two fingers), but much more interesting results up high on the neck and with open strings. I don't have it tabbed and I don't think it'll line up with a "text" tab in one of these posts, but just to give you an idea:

It starts G-F-E, and you can play the G on the second string, the F on the third string and the open E string. See what I mean? I don't know if it'll work at that speed, though.

Edited to add: Okay, I would probably play that run

G-F-E-D-Bb-B-Bb-A-G-F-E-D-Bb-B-D

But I’m not hearing the first Bb (he plays a G#) or the last Bb (he plays a B natural and then the open first string), so the last three notes are B, high E and D.

Also, the G natural in the middle of the run sounds like a high G but I think that's just because of the double strings.

I'd have to play around with it a lot more to get it up to speed, so that's all for now. Let me know if you want more details on that workaround.

[crobi027]

Originally Posted by NormanKliman

Yeah, it's all in first position in the Stefan Grossman video:

https://youtu.be/nqyGM36lXiU?t=43

I'm getting reasonable results doing it there with index and middle (picado technique, alternating the two fingers), but much more interesting results up high on the neck and with open strings. I don't have it tabbed and I don't think it'll line up with a "text" tab in one of these posts, but just to give you an idea:

It starts G-F-E, and you can play the G on the second string, the F on the third string and the open E string. See what I mean? I don't know if it'll work at that speed, though.

Yeah that lick is right. He slows it down more than I’m willing to.

[NormanKliman]

Here you go, starting with index.

[Jimi2]

Ok, I started using Fred Kelly Bumblee jazz picks when I needed to play my 12 string with a thumbpick- I use my fingernails for picking my six strings, so I’m used to contacting the string with the tip of my thumb and having my thumbnail out nearly horizontally. I could never transition to the totally different feel of a thumbpick extending out below the thumb, but with the bumblebees, I can rotate the pick so that the tip sticks out more toward the tip of my thumb, where contact would be made with my nail. This has made all the difference for me, and it’s a lot easier to switch back and forth between using a thumbpick and using my thumbnail. Might be worth a try.