'Open pore' finishes?

[charles Tauber]

Originally Posted by mercy

The top is never filled, gloss or not...

It often is on open-pored woods, such as mahogany and Koa. Closed-pore conifers, such as spruce, pine, fir, cedar and redwood, don't need filling, nor do closed-pore hardwoods, such as maple, cherry, birch...

Originally Posted by micahwc

... but in my mind leaving the pores open makes more sense to me as far as tone is concerned. Why wouldn't a thick finish effect the tone?

Sounds plausible ("sensible"), but there is no evidence to actually support that conjecture. People used to believe that heavy objects fall faster than lighter ones, since it seemed to make sense, but that didn't make it true.

Don't confuse a "thick" finish with a "filled" finish. One of the thinnest finishes is French polish which, on open-pored woods, is almost always filled.

[nikpearson]

Originally Posted by fazool

I prefer very thin satin finish. Lowden's french polish is my favorite. I love the durability of my Taylor's UV cured polyester but it does feel thick to me.

I don't mind my Ibanez's OP finish but it definitely feels cheaper

Lowden use nitrocellulose finish and pore-filler. The satin feel is obtained by hand rubbing with very fine wire wool. If you look very closely you can see the lines left by the wire wool. This is also one of my favourite finishes and so much better than the satin finishes offered by most other companies.

[gitarro]

Another type of open pore finish is the oil rubbed type, such as that used by Jakob Poljakoff or Kinkead Guitars, which shouldn't be mistaken for being cheap as it is painstakingly applied.

[AndrewG]

Originally Posted by nikpearson

Lowden use nitrocellulose finish and pore-filler. The satin feel is obtained by hand rubbing with very fine wire wool. If you look very closely you can see the lines left by the wire wool. This is also one of my favourite finishes and so much better than the satin finishes offered by most other companies.

Yamaha use the same wire wool technique on the figured maple tops of the Revstar electric range. It feels absolutely lovely.

[The Bard Rocks]

To me, a satin finish just looks cheap (as well as often being cheaper to manufacture). But that doesn't mean a guitar using it sounds better or "feels' better. It's aesthetics.

I noticed how smooth my neck was on my Goodall. It is satin while the rest of it is glossy, then noticed that glossy necks on others I had at the time felt a bit sticky, especially in certain weather, so on subsequent builds asked for satin necks. And was told by the builders not to do it, that their necks would be as slippery as I'd like. And sure enough, they were right.

[Mr. Jelly]

I don't like, no, hate thick finishes. Especially poly finishes. I prefer thinner open poor finishes. It's a preference that each of us chooses. As far as feel and tone a varnish finish is my favorite.

[Paddy1951]

I think truly open pore finishes have no fillers applied to the wood to smooth it out and thin coats of finish. Some so-called open pore finishes are little more than finishes that lack a "sheen."
They may still be fairly thick and a poly of some type.

So, the term, open pore, can be misleading. But many folks don't like shiny guitars. For me, it depends on which guitar. Fiddle like finishes can look very nice on some guitars.

[lowrider]

I just saw another video of the new Sheeran guitar. Man, that things got craters, even in the headstock!

[JTFoote]

A funny thing: I have a (relatively) inexpensive 00 Martin with an open-pore finish. I like it a lot - but it does look kinda cheap, like a beginners guitar. More than once, I've gone out to play with it, and actually heard some (supposed inaudible) comments about how one shouldn't expect much from the older guy with the cheap guitar that looks like it came from Sears. Just be kind and grin and bare it stuff. That makes me smile.

Then I play it, and jaws drop. Can't always judge a book ...

Ah, life is good.

... JT

[Brucebubs]

'Open Pore' is a clever marketing term used after detailed surveys revealed potential buyers found the alternative description 'Nasty Cheap' unattractive.

[JTFoote]

Originally Posted by Brucebubs

'Open Pore' is a clever marketing term used after detailed surveys revealed potential buyers found the alternative description 'Nasty Cheap' unattractive.

Hey, I resemble that remark!


... JT

I love glossy, flawless, smooth finishes -- on other people's guitars. On mine, I prefer the less "produced" look and feel of open pores and a matte finish -- it's beautiful to my eyes and comfortable to my hands. But I'm more of a player than a polisher by nature.

[island texan]

Originally Posted by Willie Voltaire

I love glossy, flawless, smooth finishes -- on other people's guitars. On mine, I prefer the less "produced" look and feel of open pores and a matte finish -- it's beautiful to my eyes and comfortable to my hands. But I'm more of a player than a polisher by nature.

Would someone help me understand what open pore really means. I've never heard of it. I never considered that the finish on a guitar first had the "pores" filled in. Sounds like a Clearasil ad. Maybe I have a guitar with open pores and didn't know it.

Originally Posted by island texan

Would someone help me understand what open pore really means. I've never heard of it. I never considered that the finish on a guitar first had the "pores" filled in. Sounds like a Clearasil ad. Maybe I have a guitar with open pores and didn't know it.

Luthiers and other woodworkers routinely fill a wood's natural pores with a grain filler. It achieves a more uniform, smoother surface on which to apply the finishing coat, which is usually glossy.

This is what an open pore finish often looks like:



Here's a video of the basic process (not on a guitar):

[charles Tauber]

Originally Posted by island texan

Would someone help me understand what open pore really means.

Just to expand on Willie's good answer...

Woods can be classified as "open-pore" or "closed-pore". The classification has to do with how large are the pores of a particular wood. Some woods, such as white oak, rosewood and mahogany, have very large pores and are "open-pore" woods. Some woods, such as most conifers (spruce, pine, fir) and many deciduous woods, such as maple, cherry and birch, have small pores and are "closed-pore" woods.

Wood finishes can, generally, be classified as surface finishes - those that sit on the surface of the wood - or penetrating finishes - those that absorb into the fibres of the wood. Most higher-gloss/shiny finishes are surface finishes. A satin and matte finish can be either a surface or penetrating finish, depending upon the application and process.

On a higher gloss surface, all irregularities in the surface are visually more obvious due to how the reflected light scatters from the imperfections in the surface. If one wants a "piano finish" - one that is a dead-flat mirror gloss, any pores in the wood must be filled to eliminate the "pits" in the surface that the pores create. This is done by filling the pores of open-pored woods. The video Wille posted is a traditional method of doing so. Modern methods can vary considerably, as can the materials used to fill the pores.

In some woodworking, open pores are part of the "character" of the finished piece and are purposely left un-filled, such as oak bar tops. The finish over the filled pores can be satin, matte or gloss. The finisher decides what "look" he or she wants.

40 years ago, you almost couldn't give someone an acoustic guitar with a matte or satin finish. It simply wasn't the accepted fashion. Fast-forward and these days matte and stain finishes are popular with many guitar buyers.

Generally, penetrating finishes - typically oils - are left with pores un-filled. For many penetrating finishes, that makes for a quick and easy matte or satin finish. Surface finishes can have the pores filled or not, to achieve the look one wants. Some surface finishes can be applied more thinly if one leaves out the pore-filling steps, though not filling the pores doesn't dictate that the finish is thinner.

The photo, below, shows filled and un-filled mahogany: