Fret-buzz after setup - technique or bad luthier?

[nikpearson]

Whilst it can be very informative to learn how to do your own setups, I’d suggest you find a different luthier/tech who knows what they are doing. It shouldn’t be this difficult to get your guitar playing nicely, unless there is a serious issue with the neck/body geometry. The person who did the work either doesn’t know what they are doing, or cannot be bothered to do the job properly.

Good playability depends on getting neck relief, nut slots and saddle height adjusted properly. Probably not such a good idea to be learning about this by experimenting on a quality instrument. It is worth having some basic tools for assessing setups though.

In my experience you should aiming for an action at the 12th fret of 2.2-2.5mm on the low E, 1.7-2.0 on the high E. Any higher requires extra effort to fret, any lower than the bottom end of the range will result in buzzing if you play with a heavier attack. Desirable setup is partly down to personal taste but these numbers cover the vast majority of instruments and playing styles.

Good luck with getting this resolved.

[ozgolath]

Thanks for all the valued and varied opinions!

I ended the drama this morning. The paper shims gave me roughly 2.5mm under the 12th fret low E. I called the guy this morning and had a very heated argument lol. Summarising here for entertainment:

He maintained it was my ****ty playing and that i needed an instructor if i was getting buzz at his action of ~2mm (maybe even less, i can barely slide 2 0.8mm picks underneath).

Tech: An analogy from your profession (doc) is - what do you do to a patient who has a disease but denies having it?

Me: Well its a poor analogy - disease is a 'yes' / 'no' binary situation you're applying to a guitar setup that varies from player-to-player. You've set it up to your liking and are now convincing me that I should like it to.

Tech: Well I disagree it is a binary situation - i have 10 years of experience, have worked with Whitesnake, session musicians etc etc and im insulted you're calling my skill into question here. Its no problem for me to raise it by .5 by placing a shim under it but i dont want to encourage bad technique for you.

Me: Ok lets agree to disagree - would you please raise it by just 0.5mm and make my life easier?

Tech: Well actually no! Its my reputation at stake if some other luthier sees i've set it this high it'll reflect poorly on me. I'm getting annoyed that i've already given you half an hour of my time to convince you that its not the setup but the player. Please you must understand.

Me (blew my lid): I f*&king travelled 2 hours just to get to you based on reviews on google, specified that I dont want any buzz, and you set the guitar such that the strings are just barely hanging off the frets and tell me to deal with it!! You know what - i've given you a fivestar review and i'll keep it like that. But i'll get a second opinion and if the tech agrees with me i'll give you such a trash review noone else will be fooled into taking you as someone competent.

Tech rants on and by now the conversation is pointless.

Me: Hey sorry I have to cut you off I have to get back to work.

************************************************** **

For now perfectly happy with my home-job and will use it another 6 months maybe then have it set up properly

[mirwa]

You should avoid this person as they are talking rubbish.

A guitar is set to an arbitary set of figures from the factory, a setup done at a shop is done to suit your playing style, typically most setups will lower an action from the manufacturers figures.

2mm under string clearance at the 12th fret is a nice low action but it does not suit all players, a 2mm understring action height requires the rest of the frets to be level and truss rod adjusted correctly to play nicely

Under string action heights of 2.5mm at the 12th fret or higher are way more forgiving on truss rod position / condition of the frets etc.

It is irrelevant if your a newbie or professional or somewhere inbetween, a setup is done to suit you, not you should adjust your technique to suit the guitar. He does not want to encourage your bad technique, what the, who is he to say your technique is no good.

Who cares if someone has worked for xx or yy, their fame does not suddenly wash of onto you because you repaired their guitar or washed their toes for them.

Take it to another person, explain to them what you need, ask for a report

Steve

[dnottis]

This is the reason most guys doing setups with use a "safe setup spec" and set the relief to .010" and action of 3/32 (low e) and 2/32 (high e).

[ArchtopLover]

Originally Posted by mirwa

You should avoid this person as they are talking rubbish.

Take it to another person, explain to them what you need, ask for a report

Steve

Yeah, exactly what Steve said.

Then, keep tinkering and learning how to do your own set up and basic repairs. Also, just making a suggestion, LMI sells bone shim material that is 0.040" thick and reasonably priced for such a great convenience. This real bone shim material glues up nicely with CA glue, sands and cuts clean with a fine tooth saw. Way better than paper or wood shims for a more permanent saddle height adjustment and a lot less expensive and much less work than making a new compensated saddle. I'm not a purist in this regard. A well done shim under a saddle or nut is OK with me, I can't hear any difference .

[John Arnold]

I cant notice any change in intonation from paper shims (is that a myth?)

What myth are you referring to?
Raising the action will tend to make intonation go sharp, but it takes a lot of action change to make a noticeable difference.
Stacking multiple shims is not a good idea, even if the saddle still has sufficient immersion in the bridge.
The best way to shim a saddle is to use one hardwood shim that is glued to the bottom of the saddle with CA.