Microphones For ToneDexter

[Cuki79]

I agree with James.

In my own IR experiments, I usually do one recording with one mic position and then spend a lot of time in signal processing (a recipe including, number of samples, IR size, EQ, shaping the tail, multiband blending...).

It can be very tricky and it does not seem to give better results that what people have come to with Tonedexter just playing with the mic position.

I think everyone is trying to achieve a certain sound.

Cuki

PS: However I really wished Tonedexter enabled to export/import the wavmaps as wav or aif files and let people apply whatever plugins to their IR files. But I understand the DIY audio tweaker is not a valuable market target for Tonedexter.

PS2: The main advantage you have in tweaking yourself is the FFT windowing which seems to be quite strong in Tonedexter (from the samples I heard: I don't have a Tonedexter)... Making the IR a bit dark with a high end loss (to my taste).

Originally Posted by James May

No drawback and no latency problem, it's just more complicated that's all.

You can run the mic through a mixer/EQ if you want to sculpt the tonal balance and ToneDexter will make it sound like that when it trains. Just make sure whatever device you use has it's output reduced to mic level and can tolerate 48V phantom power.

[guitaniac]

Originally Posted by James May

No drawback and no latency problem, it's just more complicated that's all.

You can run the mic through a mixer/EQ if you want to sculpt the tonal balance and ToneDexter will make it sound like that when it trains. Just make sure whatever device you use has it's output reduced to mic level and can tolerate 48V phantom power.

Much thanks for this info, James. as well as for the good advice on mics and for even providing a feedback resistant SBT option for those who're inclined toward that pickup type.

[guitaniac]

Originally Posted by James May

We've tried low cost measurement mics, which are omnis that have very flat response. They work well. The cheapies, like the Dayton Audio EMM-6 ($50) have a high noise floor level which makes them unsuitable for recording, but they work fine with ToneDexter because Dexter ignores the noise during training. The TC20 would surely work.

The omnidirectional pickup pattern WILL affect the sound that the mic perceives of your instrument. Sometimes for the better, sometimes not. In our experience so far, it has been very usable at least and sometimes excellent. One thing to point out is that you need not worry about capturing more room sound with an omni., because Dexter limits how much of that is captured anyway, regardless of whether omni or cardioid pickup pattern.

I've taken the advice here and have started using a cheap omni-directional condenser mic (Behringer ECM8000) for training. So far so good, although I'll likely opt for the Slate ML-2 at some point.

[Br1ck]

One of the very best investments I made for my home studio was a pair of SM 81s.

[varmonter]

Originally Posted by loco gringo

If a person were wanting to purchase one mic for the purpose of Dexterizing guitars, lets say $400.00 max, what would be a good choice? Maybe discuss lesser priced mics as well. Would a mic in the $400 range give you a better dual purpose mic, say Dexterizing as well as a recording mic, than say a $150 mic?

Let's assume said person has no mics and can't experiment with several that they have on hand.

The worlds best kept secret .. the MXL 604 small
Condensor mic. ... shhh ..

You can buy these on eBay cheap and they sound really good.
I don't think you'll notice a huge difference in what
ToneDexter does with a lesser mic then it will do
With a 500 dollar mic in a live setting anyway.

Shame you can't rent a high end mic for this purpose.
As it's a one time use and your done.

[loco gringo]

Originally Posted by varmonter

The worlds best kept secret .. the MXL 604 small
Condensor mic. ... shhh ..

You can buy these on eBay cheap and they sound really good.
I don't think you'll notice a huge difference in what
ToneDexter does with a lesser mic then it will do
With a 500 dollar mic in a live setting anyway.

Shame you can't rent a high end mic for this purpose.
As it's a one time use and your done.

I keep waiting for the ML2, but it hasn't showed up yet. I have an MXL4000 LDC as well as numerous dynamic mics, Shures and Sennheisers. I am finally going to have time this weekend to play with the TD and the mics I have on hand.

I can get a new SM81 for $299.00. I may pull the trigger on it.

[varmonter]

Originally Posted by loco gringo

I keep waiting for the ML2, but it hasn't showed up yet. I have an MXL4000 LDC as well as numerous dynamic mics, Shures and Sennheisers. I am finally going to have time this weekend to play with the TD and the mics I have on hand.

I can get a new SM81 for $299.00. I may pull the trigger on it.

Again you may be totally happy with the ToneDexter results you get with
The mics you already have.

[pieterh]

Originally Posted by loco gringo

I keep waiting for the ML2, but it hasn't showed up yet. I have an MXL4000 LDC as well as numerous dynamic mics, Shures and Sennheisers. I am finally going to have time this weekend to play with the TD and the mics I have on hand.



I can get a new SM81 for $299.00. I may pull the trigger on it.

The SM 81 is a great mic and I would think you’ll get use out of it once the Tone Dexter is set up to your liking - it’s a great hi hat mic for example and very good as an instrument overhead for violin, flute etc.

[pieterh]

Originally Posted by LookerBob

I have tried an AKG C414 XLII, and I liked what I got with other mics better, it had a harsher top end... I think those may be the same capsule, though they do sound different.



My favorite so far when training TD has been an Ear Trumpet Myrtle.

The 214 is based on the 414 range but has one diaphragm whereas the 414s have two. As a result the 214 is a cardioid, the 414s have a choice of patterns. Not that it is immediately relevant here but I use 214s a lot to mike up jazz drum kits or when I can’t close mike rock kits. Great value for money and way better than the equivalent Perception series mics.

James can probably chip in here with the science etc but small diaphragm mikes are more likely to give an even response - the smaller diaphragm is easier to move by high and low frequencies whereas large diaphragm mics tend to be better at capturing detail and “air” but not necessarily “good at everything”!

[stevecuss]

Has anyone used the ADK A6 large diaphragm mic with the tone dexter?