Martin or Eastman?

[67goat]

Originally Posted by Bluenose

I understand brand loyalty but that's not really what we are talking about here. What I'm saying is that if you wouldn't even consider buying an Eastman guitar because of Chinas' human rights record for example take a look at all the other things in your home that are made in China.

The only reason the Chevy/Ford in his driveway isn't from China is the 27.5% import tax on vehicles from China. Both Ford and Chevy are heavily invested in China and build a lot of vehicles there. the new Lincoln Navigator will be imported from China. A lot of the parts and raw materials for both manufacturers come from China.

The only way to avoid any of your money going to China is to stop spending money and become fully self sufficient. And as far as human rights, I'm not going to say that China doesn't have serious issues, but it's not like they have cornered the market on that kind of stuff.

Most of the countries we get cheap labor from all have these issues to varying degrees. Heck, we just had a huge rash of factories in the South getting popped for having 12 and 13 years olds on dangerous line equipment without safety equipment. We're certainly not China, but it's not like we have a squeaky clean record.

[SFCRetired]

Originally Posted by Bluenose

I understand brand loyalty but that's not really what we are talking about here. What I'm saying is that if you wouldn't even consider buying an Eastman guitar because of Chinas' human rights record for example take a look at all the other things in your home that are made in China.

If given a choice I wouldn't have them either. Look, its pretty hard for us consumers to dictate anything on where its made. We were sold out many years ago by people who were more interested in their pocket book than common sense or in many cases our future. But I do what I can where I can. Where Eastman is made is of no concern to me, I just would not buy one over a Martin. I understand why people do and that's their business not mine.

I think this thread is getting into dark territory and I wish everyone well.

[Johnny_lzl]

Originally Posted by Bluenose

I understand brand loyalty but that's not really what we are talking about here. What I'm saying is that if you wouldn't even consider buying an Eastman guitar because of Chinas' human rights record for example take a look at all the other things in your home that are made in China.

Being a Chinese member here, I totally understand that people choose not to spend their money on Chinese-made products because of whatever matters to them. Here we avoid getting the Indian-made iPhone 15 as well. It's your money, you get to choose whatever pleases you. I also noticed that in a more developed society, people tend to focus more on aspects other than the product itself. Like a guitar, nearly all Chinese players care only about sound, durability, playability, and everything about the instrument itself. But here, I found a certain amount of members tend to care not only about the product itself, but also about how the manufacturers play their roles from a moral perspective, like how they treat their employees, or how the wood is logged. This actually matches Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs.

Regarding all those non-product-related factors that people care about, I would suggest visiting China or trying to view something from a different media. You may find how the facts are different from what the media says or what you initially thought.

I am surprised at how different people think about Eastman in China. From what I see on most of the Chinese social platforms, people don't see Eastman as a Chinese brand, it was founded in the US by a Chinese American, like Bluerigde. Apparently, the advertising strategy is different in the Chinese market.

[Zissou Intern]

Originally Posted by jimmy bookout

Well, that's a new one....
Eastman guitars with build/fit/finish issues...
Never heard that before. Tone not to one's liking? That's preference. But every Eastman I've ever seen (including my Pagelli) was spotless.

I have liked Eastman guitars from the beginning. (My wife still has Serial Number 007.) But is is true that Eastman flat-tops often had issues a dozen years ago. All of that was resolved around 2014-15.

[Brent Hutto]

Originally Posted by Johnny_lzl

Being a Chinese member here, I totally understand that people choose not to spend their money on Chinese-made products because of whatever matters to them. Here we avoid getting the Indian-made iPhone 15 as well. It's your money, you get to choose whatever pleases you. I also noticed that in a more developed society, people tend to focus more on aspects other than the product itself. Like a guitar, nearly all Chinese players care only about sound, durability, playability, and everything about the instrument itself. But here, I found a certain amount of members tend to care not only about the product itself, but also about how the manufacturers play their roles from a moral perspective, like how they treat their employees, or how the wood is logged. This actually matches Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs.

Regarding all those non-product-related factors that people care about, I would suggest visiting China or trying to view something from a different media. You may find how the facts are different from what the media says or what you initially thought.

I am surprised at how different people think about Eastman in China. From what I see on most of the Chinese social platforms, people don't see Eastman as a Chinese brand, it was founded in the US by a Chinese American, like Bluerigde. Apparently, the advertising strategy is different in the Chinese market.

Thanks for providing a different perspective on the topic!

[PineMarten]

Originally Posted by Johnny_lzl

I am surprised at how different people think about Eastman in China. From what I see on most of the Chinese social platforms, people don't see Eastman as a Chinese brand, it was founded in the US by a Chinese American, like Bluerigde. Apparently, the advertising strategy is different in the Chinese market.

I suppose I do think about Eastman differently from many other Chinese made guitars, not because they're somehow "less Chinese", but because they're made in a specific factory and not outsourced. A lot of Asian-made guitars wear old American company names that have changed hands many times, spec'd up in an office somewhere by some huge parent business and contracted out to the lowest priced factory without much clarity on who actually makes them. I think I prefer the Eastman model for manufacturing guitars in China.

[Bluenose]

Originally Posted by Zissou Intern

I have liked Eastman guitars from the beginning. (My wife still has Serial Number 007.) But is is true that Eastman flat-tops often had issues a dozen years ago. All of that was resolved around 2014-15.

My 2011 E10SS has a soft finish that wears off easily and is easily dinged but the guitar itself is well constructed with I think, better than average Red Spruce and Mahogany. I know tone is subjective and confirmation bias is a real thing but it does sound exceptional to me played with a flatpick.

[Zissou Intern]

Originally Posted by Bluenose

My 2011 E10SS has a soft finish that wears off easily and is easily dinged but the guitar itself is well constructed with I think, better than average Red Spruce and Mahogany. I know tone is subjective and confirmation bias is a real thing but it does sound exceptional to me played with a flatpick.

I am sure it’s a great guitar. Scott Memmer has my old E10SS. I had instant regret in selling it. I much prefer the Eastman tone from back in 2011. To my ear, it was warmer and rounder and more open. The current iteration is tight and bright. But the builds today are more consistent in fit and finish.