Resonators biscuits vs spider

[Bob Womack]

Originally Posted by neilca

I did read your page and saw the Beard cone replacement, thanks for that info. Is there a reason you chose the Beard over the National?

The Beard came highly recommended and the National was an unknown to me.

Bob

[Robin, Wales]

I returned the Gretsch and started thinking perhaps a cone change on the Rogue would help that sound a bit clearer. Did some research and the National cones appear to be the crowd favorite.

Any thoughts on cone preferences?

Your Rogue may well be fitted with a Continental cone. They are not bad at all. But often the biscuit/saddle and its fit to the top of the cone leave a lot to be desired.

The National hot rod cone is "better". But the big improvement is going to come from the maple National biscuit. The Chinese guitars like Rogue tend to fit the saddle into a slot in the biscuit (often a rosewood or similar biscuit). The tight saddle fit can cause the bottom of the biscuit to bend slightly so the fit on to the top of the cone is not perfectly flat. Even the smallest of gaps will give you "banjo" rather than "reso". So the very first thing I would try on your Rogue is simply taking the biscuit off the cone, sanding the bottom of it flat, and then refitting it. Remember to mark with a pencil the alignment of the cone in the cone well and the alignment of the biscuit on the cone top. If you rotate the cone or the biscuit on re-assembly then you could throw out both the action and the string alignment. The top of those Continental cones are rarely perfectly parallel to the bottoms, so any rotation may change your action.

The second option is to buy a National biscuit/bridge and fit that. However, simply fitting a maple saddle into the Chinese rosewood biscuit is a great option - assuming your Rogue has an ebony topped saddle at present? Be aware however that you will be setting the action with the coverplate off. On some guitars the tailpiece rests on the coverplate (and the coverplate lifts the tailpiece slightly) this reduces your break angle and downpressure and can mess up your action when you put the guitar back together. I had an old coverplate with the strap sawn off for set-ups. Additionally, those cheap Rogue guitars do not always have the neck to cone well perfectly centred and in line with the tailpiece. You need to check that alignment when doing a set-up and may need to move the tailpiece.

Be aware that the National hotrod cone is a different overall height to the (most likely) Continental cone you have fitted. This is usually not a problem but can cause issues during the setup. And is confusing!!!

One more thing - the cone is held in place simply by the downpressure of the strings. And the cone depresses under string tension by up to 5mm. So you must undertake the set-up for the saddle height with the strings at full playing tension.

I think that I have probably done around 800 set-ups on reso guitars, and never want to see another!!!!

[neilca]

Thanks guys, I just ordered the National cone and biscuit combo from Elderly. I can do the setup, thanks for the heads up.

[neilca]

I was installing the National cone and biscuit into the Rogue today and I was about to report it sounded dead like the original cone. Then I discovered the biscuit was riding against the cone cover.

I had cut the string slots in the biscuit to match the biscuit I had removed and that was the origin of my problem. I should had marked where the strings wanted to be with the biscuit centered in the cone cover hole. I cut new slots and the guitar now sounds like a resonator.

Signed,
Learning from my mistakes

[Robin, Wales]

That's great that you have your guitar up and working again. It is difficult to line everything up during a biscuit bridge set-up. It is much easier with a spare cover plate without the strap. It is why National Reso Phonic switched to screw on coverplate straps a few years back.