Help withwith my Lowden 40th Anniversary wood combination!

[Portland Bill]

Wouldn't the best people to ask be Lowden ?

[Marcus Wong]

There seems to be a consensus with Spruce/Rosewood being the ideal choice from rogthefrog, JoeCharter and of course Simon Fay.

Simon, where would you place Alpine among those you have stated? As Sitka, Alpine and Adirondack seem to be the only options available in a Lowden. I do appreciate the lush sound of cedar/redwood but have also experienced the lack of versatility you have pointed out. Do you include Ziricote under rosewood when you say Spruce/Rosewood? Or strictly Dalbergia?

I have had bad experiences with Koa and as much as I want to love it, I just can't afford to take that risk with commissioning it :/

[Simon Fay]

Both Ziricote and Ebony sound "edgier" and harsher than your typical Rosewood which sounds warmer and mellower in contrast. I believe this has something to do with the overtone signature of the trebles. For Ziricote and Ebony, I always recommend Engelmann or possibly German if someone really wants a harder sound.

Lowden's generally have an airy, reverb heavy sound -- so the Ziricote and Ebony might be a good combination with them. However, my advice is to just stick with a Rosewood. I am unfamiliar with Alpine Spruce.

[Marcus Wong]

Originally Posted by ChuckS

Even though you've got questions and decisions yet to be made, I think you are actually quite far along since you have selected your builder and the body size/style. In my mind, those are the biggest factors in what you will end up with for tone and playability.

I'd select the top next, and I was wondering if your soft/medium fingerstyle attack would be a significant factor in that choice. I don't have the knowledge of Lowden's to know how responsive their jumbos are to a light playing style. The guitar's responsiveness and your playing style may be a significant factor is choosing the top wood.

Only you can decide what is, and isn't, an acceptable and desireable aesthetic. There are some walnuts (claro) which can have great figure and color. Also, some woods that don't have a striking visual appeal from a distance may have have a wonderful texture to the grain when viewed closely (i.e. mahogany).

Regarding Cuban Mahogany, I really like it. Cuban is typically more dense than Honduran mahogany, and my set happens to be an extremely dense set. Tonally, I think Cuban is a bit different than Honduran, but not too much different. I think it has a bass that is a bit more focused, yet a bit more complex. The bass may move towards a rosewood tone, but not into the 'dark' sound nor the reverby sound of some rosewood guitars. There may be a bit less damping of treble overtones compared to Honduran, but in general the trebles have the characteristics of a mahogany guitar. I don't hear the metalic/crystalline/zingy trebles that some rosewoods exhibit.

From what I remember of the 'old salvaged' Cuban mahogany that Lowden has, there doesn't seem to be a lot of figure seen from a distance. However, it may look fantastic close up. Also, not all Cuban mahogany is boring:

I know! So close...yet so far! >< But I suppose it is better than having nothing to work on. I am leaning more towards the Spruce/Rosewood now due to the responses. I somehow just don't find Mahogany aesthetically pleasing...unless we are talking about "The Tree"!

Originally Posted by islandguitar

There was a recent thread in the Custom section here on AGF about Redwood and it's various properties which you may find interesting if you hadn't seen it. While I'm no expert, if finances allow, you might explore Lucky Strike Redwood....and that thread touches on this top wood as well.
There are some great videos on UTube from George Lowden describing various wood combinations and tones......you may have seen them?
George's personal favorite combo is Redwood/ African Blackwood.
Good luck with your custom!

Hi islandguitar, any possibility of the link to that specific thread? I don't think finances allow it, and I'm not sure if Lowden currently has any LS. I think I've asked them about it already. I have watched almost every possible Lowden video on the Tube but it still makes deciding difficult :S ABW is most definitely out of the question, I have no way to justify that spending!

Originally Posted by rogthefrog

I'm actually intrigued by your choice of Lowden for the style you play. I love Lowdens, and a couple of guys in that style play them (Leeb, Hedges, and a great young player from Taiwan I met last year), but the Lowden sound (and it's distinctive regardless of wood, the same way a Martin has a Martin sound, a Wingert sounds like a Wingert, etc) is not typically associated with that style of playing.

Well, the Lowden appealed to my style for several reasons!

Firstly, they are one of the few brands to have such an abundance of Jumbo sized guitars which they are well known for which is IMO ideal for percussion, and the fact that Lowden Jumbos are reputed for excelling in finger style is just an added bonus!

Secondly, they offered a wider neck width as a standard which I feel is more comfortable for finger style to be played cleanly.

Thirdly, it also helps that Lowdens are braced to accommodate dropped/altered tunings excellently which is what I play in majority of the time.

Fourth reason is that they had a Fanned Fret option which I was very intrigued by and combined with the above reasons, sealed the deal.

If I were to force myself to find a fifth reason, I would have to say the 5 piece laminate neck makes the neck "stiffer" than a 1 piece and therefore would be less prone to warping when jumping around different tunings.

[Marcus Wong]

Originally Posted by Simon Fay

Both Ziricote and Ebony sound "edgier" and harsher than your typical Rosewood which sounds warmer and mellower in contrast. I believe this has something to do with the overtone signature of the trebles. For Ziricote and Ebony, I always recommend Engelmann or possibly German if someone really wants a harder sound.

Lowden's generally have an airy, reverb heavy sound -- so the Ziricote and Ebony might be a good combination with them. However, my advice is to just stick with a Rosewood. I am unfamiliar with Alpine Spruce.

I will have to ask Lowden if they happen to have any Engelmann or German if that is the case. Unless Alpine happens to lie within that region. Now I am torn between playing safe with the Cocobolo or going exotic with the Ziricote. I will have to give that some thought... Thank you so much Simon for your insight. It has really helped shape my thoughts on this particular build

[islandguitar]

Hi Marcus,
Here's the most recent one among many on AGF. I found this thread very helpful and informative.

http://www.acousticguitarforum.com/f...d.php?t=353956

[Marcus Wong]

Originally Posted by islandguitar

Hi Marcus,
Here's the most recent one among many on AGF. I found this thread very helpful and informative.

http://www.acousticguitarforum.com/f...d.php?t=353956

Thanks for the link! Just finished reading it, and boy must I say, I'm more confused than ever about Redwood. So many contrasting views! Haha but a good read nonetheless.

[mcduffnw]

Originally Posted by Marcus Wong

Thanks for the link! Just finished reading it, and boy must I say, I'm more confused than ever about Redwood. So many contrasting views! Haha but a good read nonetheless.

Marcus...

I think you are starting to over think the "wheel" here...which can really increase the stress level over the build process, and can lead to disappointment with the finished guitar.

Take to heart and believe strongly, in what Simon Fay told you in his first reply to you...about not dwelling on the nuances of tone...and then contact Lowden and talk to them about the tone you want, and trust in their recommendation thusly...

Best Regards
duff

PS...THANK YOU Simon...for true words of wisdom:
My main advice is to not dwell on nuances of tone -- it is a meaningless quest, especially since these "tonal descriptions" are highly subjective. Understand the basic generalities that accompany the various tonewood species and go for what you think you will most like tonally and that will appeal to you visually.

^^^Read...Learn...Live^^^
duff

[JoeCharter]

Originally Posted by Marcus Wong

There seems to be a consensus with Spruce/Rosewood being the ideal choice from rogthefrog, JoeCharter and of course Simon Fay.

I wouldn't say spruce/rosewood is "ideal" but "most popular", "most versatile" or "safest" if you will. This is coming from a guy whose main guitars have cedar tops...

FWIW when I compared a cedar/walnut Lowden F to its redwood counterpart in Toronto a few years ago, I didn't notice much difference tonally.

Another aspect to consider is that Lowdens have a very thin finish. Of spruce, redwood and cedar, spruce is hardest and most resistant. Depending on your own playing style, this may be relevant (or not).

[drplayer]

Originally Posted by Portland Bill

Wouldn't the best people to ask be Lowden ?

+1 to this! There are some excellent builders and excellent players responding to this, but at the end of the day, none of us know what a Lowden will sound like with different tonewood combinations better than George and the others at Lowden. If you're trusting them with the build, then trust them to help guide you through these choices...

[iim7V7IM7]

You have received some good advice...

Your new guitar's sound will be influenced by 1) the builder, 2) top wood choice and then 3) choice of back and sides in that order.

I hope that it turns out to be everything that you hope for...

[royd]

Originally Posted by rogthefrog

I'm actually intrigued by your choice of Lowden for the style you play. I love Lowdens, and a couple of guys in that style play them (Leeb, Hedges, and a great young player from Taiwan I met last year), but the Lowden sound (and it's distinctive regardless of wood, the same way a Martin has a Martin sound, a Wingert sounds like a Wingert, etc) is not typically associated with that style of playing.

hmmm... there are tons of players who play that style on Lowdens, probably more than any other single make of guitar. Virtually everybody on the candyrat label has played a Lowden at some point in their career.

back to the OP. Last year at NAMM George told me that his favorite wood combo these days is redwood/African blackwood.

[rogthefrog]

Originally Posted by Marcus Wong

I know! So close...yet so far! >< But I suppose it is better than having nothing to work on. I am leaning more towards the Spruce/Rosewood now due to the responses. I somehow just don't find Mahogany aesthetically pleasing...unless we are talking about "The Tree"!



Hi islandguitar, any possibility of the link to that specific thread? I don't think finances allow it, and I'm not sure if Lowden currently has any LS. I think I've asked them about it already. I have watched almost every possible Lowden video on the Tube but it still makes deciding difficult :S ABW is most definitely out of the question, I have no way to justify that spending!



Well, the Lowden appealed to my style for several reasons!

Firstly, they are one of the few brands to have such an abundance of Jumbo sized guitars which they are well known for which is IMO ideal for percussion, and the fact that Lowden Jumbos are reputed for excelling in finger style is just an added bonus!

Secondly, they offered a wider neck width as a standard which I feel is more comfortable for finger style to be played cleanly.

Thirdly, it also helps that Lowdens are braced to accommodate dropped/altered tunings excellently which is what I play in majority of the time.

Fourth reason is that they had a Fanned Fret option which I was very intrigued by and combined with the above reasons, sealed the deal.

If I were to force myself to find a fifth reason, I would have to say the 5 piece laminate neck makes the neck "stiffer" than a 1 piece and therefore would be less prone to warping when jumping around different tunings.

You might be overthinking it

My 19-year old Taylor's non laminated neck has been subjected to a lot of retuning. All of my songs are in a different tuning, and the neck had never ever needed an adjustment. Not once. And its one size fits all bracing sounds just fine with altered tunings.

Many builders worth their salt will do custom neck widths, large bodies and fan frets.

Not trying to argue--I think a Lowden is a fine choice--I just find it interesting your initial set of very principled, thought out choices (Lowden, redwood, ziricote) are pretty much the opposite of what the vast majority of "modern technique" players would have picked.

I agree with Simon that picking the right builder and working with them on wood and other choices is really what will determine the guitar that comes out.

[rogthefrog]

Originally Posted by royd

hmmm... there are tons of players who play that style on Lowdens, probably more than any other single make of guitar. Virtually everybody on the candyrat label has played a Lowden at some point in their career.

back to the OP. Last year at NAMM George told me that his favorite wood combo these days is redwood/African blackwood.

None of them uses a Lowden most of the time. I've played a Lowden too but it doesn't make me a Lowden player

[philjs]

Originally Posted by rogthefrog

I'm actually intrigued by your choice of Lowden for the style you play. I love Lowdens, and a couple of guys in that style play them (Leeb, Hedges, and a great young player from Taiwan I met last year), but the Lowden sound (and it's distinctive regardless of wood, the same way a Martin has a Martin sound, a Wingert sounds like a Wingert, etc) is not typically associated with that style of playing.

More than a couple, I think. Don Ross' first 3 recordings were done with an O10 (cedar/Mahogany). Eric Roche is (was) also a great proponent of Lowden guitars playing an O10, 023 (cedar/walnut) and O25 (redwood/rosewood). Other players of Lowdens, not all as bombastic as Leeb but all players that "stretch" the boundaries, include Alex de Grassi, Jon Gomm, Andy McKee, Gilles le Bigot, Soig Siberil, Ben Lapps, Paul McSherry, Richard Thompson, Eric Clapton and, of course, Pierre Bensusan.

To the OP: Listen to Simon, redwood and walnut are an awesome combination...

Phil