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Old 02-13-2021, 01:28 AM
raybklyn raybklyn is offline
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Default Pressured to buy

Has anyone here experienced pressure from a luthier to purchase a guitar? For example - “there is only one day left to get into this years build slot” or “we can’t hold up production for you to make a decision”?

Is this a normal tactic with any of the high end luthiers? Almost every luthier I have spoken to has been extremely gracious and honest in every way. Just wanted to know if anyone has been pressured to make a decision in an awkward way for a $12-18K guitar?
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Old 02-13-2021, 07:32 AM
runamuck runamuck is offline
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Can you describe your behavior leading up to the luthier giving you an ultimatum?
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Old 02-13-2021, 07:34 AM
Olburns Olburns is offline
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Perhaps they are being as direct and honest as they can. If they have a waiting list and you're up but undecided on specs, there is a chance that they have their build schedule process so tightly plotted out that they need to have it worked out.
I have visited shops of many colleagues and one particular who has what I consider a shockingly high production number for a single maker. His pricing would be at the top end of what you have quoted. It is quite clear to me that any lax in his process of building and he simply wouldn't be able to hit the production numbers he does. As he builds in batches, one mishap can tie-up the completion of six instruments.

Due to the manner at which I underwent my own path in lutherie, I can honestly recognize that I inherited some manners which make me seem a curmudgeon.
Maybe you're just dealing with an extremely tightly scheduled builder that's a bit of a curmudgeon such as myself.

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Old 02-13-2021, 07:59 AM
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In my admittedly limited experience, it seems that busy single luthiers tend to be very gracious and friendly. I don’t think any would try to pressure you just for additional sales bookings. They have a client schedule they have to keep on track and if a build slot is available, that luthier may have others waiting based on your decision whether you are going to take it. If you’ve done your research on the luthier and the build you want before you reach that point, it should be a quick decision on your part rather than being non-committal to any degree.
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Old 02-13-2021, 08:26 AM
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The actual tone of the conversation matters as much if not more than the words you quoted. I can imagine those words being said in an informative manner, and I can imagine them being said in an obnoxious, high-pressured way. The OP hasn't given us the context of the quotes, but stepping back from it, I can definitely hear them being said to a prospective customer who has been hemming and hawing for a while with no sign of getting off of the fence...
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Old 02-13-2021, 08:58 AM
raybklyn raybklyn is offline
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It was cordial and respectful. I agree that all luthiers I have spoke with are accessible and friendly as heck. The ultimatum had to do with meeting time constraints for a build slot as materials need to be in shop before starting.

It ft a bit odd to have an ultimatum with minutes to confirm in order to get the build slot. I confirmed 20 minutes later yet lost the build slot anyway.

Not an angry word was ever shared and I am not upset but just wanted to know if this is unique, as every conversation with luthiers had been easy going until that moment.
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Old 02-13-2021, 09:08 AM
H165 H165 is offline
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I tend to take forever to do a custom build, so I make sure people know that in advance. OTOH I build very few, and they're barter rather than cash, so these are very informal transactions almost akin to favors.
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Old 02-13-2021, 09:19 AM
Olburns Olburns is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by raybklyn View Post
It was cordial and respectful. I agree that all luthiers I have spoke with are accessible and friendly as heck. The ultimatum had to do with meeting time constraints for a build slot as materials need to be in shop before starting.



It ft a bit odd to have an ultimatum with minutes to confirm in order to get the build slot. I confirmed 20 minutes later yet lost the build slot anyway.



Not an angry word was ever shared and I am not upset but just wanted to know if this is unique, as every conversation with luthiers had been easy going until that moment.
The other thing I was going to mention was material acquisition, if needed. If perhaps the builder has reserved materials (that include yours) that are in reserved quantities from a supplier and is getting heat from said supplier who may have another buyer and thus extends the impatience to you...they simply may have no alternative.
It seems as though you were quite respectful in the process and I'm just trying to example one scenario where the choice may indeed have been as dire as it seemed. The materials will need to acclimate to the builders shop so...

Hopefully you still manage to get a fine instrument in due time. Best of luck...

Doc
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Old 02-13-2021, 09:27 AM
virob virob is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by raybklyn View Post

It ft a bit odd to have an ultimatum with minutes to confirm in order to get the build slot. I confirmed 20 minutes later yet lost the build slot anyway.
.
That might be your answer right there.
Sounds more like a frank assessment that build slots for the year were filling up fast, then a pressure tactic.
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Old 02-14-2021, 12:04 PM
tadol tadol is offline
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The timing could well have been to order materials - if a supplier is closing in a few minutes, or, if there’s a special set of material that they have put on hold, and the supplier calls them and says they have someone else who wants that set and will pay for it immediately, and can’t hold it indefinitely, so pay now or we’ll sell to someone else, then yes, 10 or 15 minutes may make a difference. Or if the material is already on hand, and another buyer really wants it and has cash in hand ready to go but needs to know if it’s theirs or not, then asking you if you are committing or not is extremely reasonable. Indecision, if this has been a ongoing discussion for some time up to this, might raise some very serious doubts in the builders mind whether an inability to commit or make decisions is going to affect or delay the timing and process while the build is ongoing, and lead to regrets and an unhappy customer after the build is done - especially if it might affect other buyers who are eager and anxious to get their builds going sooner than later.

Or - they need the money to handle a cash flow problem - hard call -
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Old 02-14-2021, 08:12 PM
pianissimo pianissimo is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by runamuck View Post
Can you describe your behavior leading up to the luthier giving you an ultimatum?
Wow. .....
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Old 02-14-2021, 08:51 PM
M Sarad M Sarad is offline
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Two different luthiers let me know I had the last slot. Both were given up by another individual and they let me know.
I canceled one and let the other go.
The luthiers were honest and forthright.
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Old 02-21-2021, 04:15 PM
Crash-VR Crash-VR is offline
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Yeah if it was no longer available 20 minutes later, then it sounds like he was just being upfront. If it was a form of manipulation, then it would have still been available. Personally I would have asked him why.
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Old 02-21-2021, 05:24 PM
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At the end of the day a person has to make a living. If a slot is open now and you have two people wanting it with the one person waving cash at you and saying take me or I have an opportunity with another luthier right now, he may have done the honorable thing and called you before confirming him. So maybe he was being pressured, you don't know what is driving the call. I hope he would in turn offer a spot in the future for you.
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Old 02-22-2021, 11:34 AM
carmona_nostra carmona_nostra is offline
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Totally agree here. The builder may have a number of commitments from other clients that would like to move forward with a build and he is doing the honorable thing and offering you the slot one last time. If you are holding him up for one of those slots or a material order, I get the extra pressure as it is unfair to the builder. I would not be offended.

The fact of the matter is that when you started this conversation you likely had an idea of the cost. It is your propagative to move forward or not, and at some point you have to make a decision. Think of it this way, he is helping you make that decision.
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