The Acoustic Guitar Forum

Go Back   The Acoustic Guitar Forum > General Acoustic Guitar and Amplification Discussion > Custom Shop

View Poll Results: Which guitar is made of mahogany/cedar?
Guitar #1 21 21.21%
Guitar #2 46 46.46%
Guitar #3 25 25.25%
Guitar #4 7 7.07%
Voters: 99. You may not vote on this poll

Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #106  
Old 03-10-2013, 09:55 AM
JoeCharter JoeCharter is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 8,549
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruce Sexauer View Post
I too thought #3 the odd one out tonally, and #4 too weak to be cedar, which despite its peculiarities is almost always loud. #1 and #2 both sounded very good to me, and I am happy to hear that they should do so.
I didn't like #3 either -- not on this recording at least.

As for the lack of loudness of #4, I would attribute it to the imperfect player rather than to the guitar.
Reply With Quote
  #107  
Old 03-10-2013, 10:29 AM
Bruce Sexauer's Avatar
Bruce Sexauer Bruce Sexauer is offline
AGF Sponsor
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Petaluma, CA, USA
Posts: 7,525
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeCharter View Post

As for the lack of loudness of #4, I would attribute it to the imperfect player rather than to the guitar.
This surprises me as I assumed you did everything you could to level the playing field, by which I mean not changing the recording setting, proximity to the mics, or playing style, all to the best of your ability. The playing sounds much the same on each guitar to my ear.
__________________
Bruce
http://www.sexauerluthier.com/
Reply With Quote
  #108  
Old 03-10-2013, 10:36 AM
JoeCharter JoeCharter is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 8,549
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruce Sexauer View Post
This surprises me as I assumed you did everything you could to level the playing field, by which I mean not changing the recording setting, proximity to the mics, or playing style, all to the best of your ability. The playing sounds much the same on each guitar to my ear.
I did my best but I'm only human...

Same setup exactly -- I didn't even move my chair -- but there's so much more to it.

Was I leaning the exact same way? Did I pluck the strings exactly the same?

In any case, thanks for noticing I did a fairly consistent job. I tried...
Reply With Quote
  #109  
Old 03-10-2013, 10:40 AM
fitness1's Avatar
fitness1 fitness1 is offline
Musical minimalist
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Central Lower Michigan
Posts: 22,130
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeCharter View Post
My thoughts exactly.

My own experience is that cedar sounds "trebley" and "compressed" (nothing like #2), with a sharp attack.

But there's a number of qualified folks who associate cedar with "muted" -- so there has to be some truth to that as well.
I wouldn't call it muted, but normally Cedar topped guitars have a certain upper midrange quality that isn't to my ears liking. This comes into play especially after the strings get past "played in". Compressed is a good word for the overall tonal picture, I think.
__________________
"One small heart, and a great big soul that's driving"

Reply With Quote
  #110  
Old 03-10-2013, 10:42 AM
geordie geordie is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: this side of heaven
Posts: 2,604
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeCharter View Post
Based on this recording, are you able to tell which guitar is the one made with the "different" wood combination, i.e. mahogany/cedar?
No.

They all sound like good steel strung guitars with that 'clean' separation fingerpickers like but in a full flight playing / gigging situation the differences would be imperceptible. One guitar stands out to my ears in these fairly clinical recordings, No. 2 has the lest attractive voice to my ears - maybe too clean and precise, a bit thinner = less character and possibly why many thought it was cedar topped. Much the same effect as achieved by the modern classical guitar design on steroids - more power and projection but at what cost ?
Reply With Quote
  #111  
Old 03-10-2013, 10:49 AM
cedarkoa599 cedarkoa599 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 709
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by fitness1 View Post
He's already posted the answers....



Originally Posted by JoeCharter
Guitar #1: Bourgeois SJ (Madagascar rosewood + Alpine spruce)
Guitar #2: Kraut OM (Brazilian rosewood + Alpine spruce)
Guitar #3: Martin OM-21 Special (East Indian rosewood + Sitka spruce)
Guitar #4: Olson SJ (Mahogany + Cedar)
Thanks!
I was way off!
I did not like the first as much as the others !
Reply With Quote
  #112  
Old 03-10-2013, 01:45 PM
KevinLPederson KevinLPederson is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 827
Default

I can't vote because I know the results. I take a couple things away from this 'test'. One is that 'what people hear', 'what they like to hear' - varies as much as the types of guitars that are out there, and the styles of the players.

Its hard to control the variable of 'subjectivness' (if thats a word). I think more people respond to hearing a great guitar played "greatly". The woods incorporated in the build are only an "ingredient" in the final tone outcome. Much of it has to do with the player/player style/hands etc. So that produces a tone/song, people hear that, like it, and want their guitar to sound like that. Then they go buy from that maker.

So many variables. In the end all we can really do is enjoy the fruits of our labor. Whether that is getting good at playing the guitar, or getting good at making the guitar.

If you own one of these great guitars - ENJOY IT! No need whatsoever to compare it. Its subjective. Be thankful you have the means to possess it.

Hope you all have a SUPER great day!!

Kevin.
Reply With Quote
  #113  
Old 03-11-2013, 09:48 PM
joeld joeld is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 345
Default

I would have said #2, with #4 being my second guess. As with a lot of others, I was keying off the warmer sound with less sparkle. I did get to play a mahogany/cedar guitar a while back, and it had a creamy smooth sound. I liked it a lot!

I know from hanging around the music store that the maker or brand usually has a bigger impact than the woods. But within a brand, wood is a big part of the picture. Thanks for the fun poll! /jd
Reply With Quote
  #114  
Old 03-11-2013, 10:39 PM
Fsgeek Fsgeek is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 586
Default

Got it all wrong lol... 2nd choices were right...
Reply With Quote
  #115  
Old 03-12-2013, 12:09 AM
MBE MBE is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 3,283
Default

This was fascinating, and thank you for all the effort.

Personally, I haven't played any of those builders except for Martin. I'm quite comfortable discerning woods within the same maker (like trying a dozen Taylors in a row or a dozen Webbers), but agree that it's not as easy when comparing between makers.

I find that with fingerstyle, one of the greatest differences with cedar is how the guitar feels and responds to my touch - the dynamic response is always different compared to spruce (by the same builder). Also, I find that cedar guitars project more tone backward to the player while spruce is more "unidirectional" in projecting forward. I've never owned a guitar with a soundport, but in retrospect, maybe some of my preference for cedar has come from this low-tech "soundport" action. My cedar guitars have the most enjoyable tone to me from the player's perspective.
__________________
Some might call me a "Webber Guitars enthusiast".
Reply With Quote
  #116  
Old 03-12-2013, 09:10 AM
Dr Mike Dr Mike is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 19
Default Gorgeous Borgeois!

I just simply FELT the Borgeois more than the others. The Olson was a close 2nd but did not have the definition and lower articulation that the Borgeois did.
IM-very-HO!! GREAT thread and lets us all realize how subjective this wonder of guitars really is! It's NOT how much you spend!!
Reply With Quote
Reply

  The Acoustic Guitar Forum > General Acoustic Guitar and Amplification Discussion > Custom Shop

Thread Tools





All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:27 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, The Acoustic Guitar Forum
vB Ad Management by =RedTyger=