Acoustic guitar, not resonator, for "high" open G tuning

[Gnappo]

Hi everybody.
This is Pier Luigi from Italy.
This is my first post here. I searched for this topic in the older posts but i did not find anything related. Thus, this is the matter.

I recently tried the "high" open G tuning G-B-D-G-B-D. I really liked the sound but unfortunately, as we all know, it is not recommended on standard acoustics due of its high tension.
However I like the mellow sound of a real acoustic and I would like to use it not only on resonators.
Weissenborn models cannot stand that string tension as well, and could be seriously damaged.

So the question is:
is there an acoustic flat top model that can be played with an high open G tuning with no risk of damage?

Pier

https://pierluigiauddino.bandcamp.com
_________________
Mossman Golden Wheat (1987)
Yairi DY76 12 String (1982)
Fender American Deluxe Stratocaster (2008) - Van Zandt Vintage Plus pickups
Fender Vintage '62 reissue (1997) - Lollar Blackface pickups

[maxtheaxe]

I couldn't say if there are guitars specifically designed for this, although one could specify almost anything in a custom build. They do however have 'High-strung' sets of strings, for things like 'Nashville tuning'; basically just a very light set of strings for tuning an octave up, and you would probably need to adjust the neck relief to accommodate them. I know that some players like to 'double' a guitar part in a recording using this method.

I actually bought a set of these a while back that I haven't tried yet; I was thinking that my mid-90's vintage Taylor 412K might be a good candidate. I may have to get around to trying it out.

[frankmcr]

From

EADGBE

to

GBDGBD

No need to change the top 4 strings.
Switch in a lighter string where the low E was - say, from 56 go to 48.
Likewise where the A string was - go from 45 to maybe 42.

Shouldn't cause any damage to an ordinary acoustic.

Reso guitars have a lot of tension cause the strings need to drive the cone. But no cone = no need for a high tension GBDGBD.

[jschmitz54]

I’ve been learning a song in open G tuning. I have a Martin GP35E that I string with mediums. I’ve been leaving the guitar in open G. Am I potentially harming my guitar?

[Gnappo]

"Reso guitars have a lot of tension cause the strings need to drive the cone. But no cone = no need for a high tension GBDGBD."

You're right!
How could I have not realized that before? How stupid am I?
In Italy we say "the solution was right under my nose" or "The egg of Columbus", it's a funny story
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Egg_of_Columbus

Thank you so much.

[Misifus]

My general rule of thumb is, “Tune down, not up.” Tuning down, you won’t damage anything. Tuning up, you might.

[frankmcr]

Originally Posted by Gnappo

Thank you so much.

Prego!
.
.
.

[Lefty MacGuffin]

I did exactly this with an early 1900 parlor guitar. It was quite happy with extra light stings in standard tuning. I used a sting tension calculator and tuning down to FACfac was close to the same total tension. I also calculated using a .044 and .034 for the two low stings would let me tune it in G. I will try that on my next string change.

[ljguitar]

Originally Posted by frankmcr

From

EADGBE

to

GBDGBD

No need to change the top 4 strings..

Hi frank…

Did you mean the bottom 4 strings (the bass side of a guitar is the bottom strings). It's based on pitch not gravity/elevation above the floor.

If you approach the strings in the same order as you listed Standard Tuning (EADGBE), then the 6th string would bring tension up, as would the 5th, but the 1st would bring tension down.

It makes me wonder at Pier's order of string tunings as well.

[ljguitar]

Originally Posted by Misifus

My general rule of thumb is, “Tune down, not up.” Tuning down, you won’t damage anything. Tuning up, you might.

Hi Misifus
There are several tunings which tune strings in opposite directions from standard…

CGCGCD lowers tension on 4 strings, raises it on one string.

EADGBE re-tuned to CGCGCD
E - down - major third to C
A - down - full step to G
D - down - full step to C
G - unchanged
B - up - half step to C
D - down - full step to D

I've also seen C tuning altered to CGCGCE (C major chord)
and to C-G-C-G-C-Eb (c minor chord).

Stretching the 2nd string to C is not a big deal when the bottom three strings were tuned downward.

It's still mostly about overall string tension…which in this case is substantially lower than standard tuning.

I was in the room when someone decided to take the top string up to 'G', and people were ducking and evacuating the area close to the bridge right before it reached pitch and broke…twice in a row.

I forget the tuning they were going for (and hope they did too!!)

[frankmcr]

Originally Posted by ljguitar

Hi frank…

Did you mean the bottom 4 strings (the bass side of a guitar is the bottom strings). It's based on pitch not gravity/elevation above the floor.

If you approach the strings in the same order as you listed Standard Tuning (EADGBE), then the 6th string would bring tension up, as would the 5th, but the 1st would bring tension down.

It makes me wonder at Pier's order of string tunings as well.

Hi,
The existing DGBE strings can stay as they are, aside from tuning the high E down a full step to D, which shouldn't cause any problems.
To avoid putting undue strain on the guitar the low E needs to be replaced by a lighter string that can be tuned up three half-steps to G, and the existing A replaced by a lighter string that can be tuned up a full step to B.
I've been assuming that Gnappo wants to play a regular acoustic in dobro style with a bar, in which case the guitar wouldn't need to be adjusted to eliminate any potential intonation problems caused by the string changes. If the idea is to play in regular position, pressing the strings against the frets, the guitar would probably need a setup to adjust for the lighter strings.

[Gnappo]

Yes, it was taken for granted that I was asking about lap steel playing.
Dobro tuning doesn't work so well in fingerstyle.

Something like that.
Ben Harper Inland Empire
Unfortunately I do not have a personal luthier to fulfil my own desires.

[Mycroft]

Originally Posted by jschmitz54

I’ve been learning a song in open G tuning. I have a Martin GP35E that I string with mediums. I’ve been leaving the guitar in open G. Am I potentially harming my guitar?

There are actually two Open G tunings, differentiated by how the 5th and6th strings are tuned. You are probably using what may be termed as "low bass" Open G, the turning being from 6 to 1 DGDGBD. What they are discussing in this thread is often termed "High-Bass" Open G, and is tuned GBDGBD. Low bass has the 1st, 5th and 6h strings tuned down a step, and so actually has less tension than a standard tuning does, and so unlikely to harm your instrument.

High-bass is also often referred to as "Dobro-tuning." as the 5th and 6th strings are tuned UP a step and a step and a half respectively, it puts much more tension on that side of the neck. Dobro-style instruments have big, solid square necks designed to deal with that tension without damage. It is used primarily on square-neck resonator instruments played lap-style using a steel bar to fret it. Slide players like it because it gives you two thirds to work with, while Low-Bass only gives one. (As does Open D and Open C)

[Mycroft]

Originally Posted by Gnappo

Yes, it was taken for granted that I was asking about lap steel playing.
Dobro tuning doesn't work so well in fingerstyle.

Something like that.
Ben Harper Inland Empire
Unfortunately I do not have a personal luthier to fulfil my own desires.

According to an interview in Acoustic Guitar, Harper says that all the pieces on "Winter is for Lovers" were done in Open D, DADF#AD.