Am I being too Fussy? NGD.

[Martin_F]

Originally Posted by TheMicster

Hi sorry maybe you misunderstood my comment, i actually have measured the overall width of the lower bout and confirmed that the soundboard join is in the middle in fact its dead on to the millimeter. What i have not measured is if the neck is in perfect certer line alignment with the body and that's why they put the bridge off center. Because the neck may not be straight. See if the neck was straight and the bridge was off center the strings would not run evenly central up the neck but would slightly slant to one side so to speak. However when i look at the strings they appear to be running fairly central to the neck which leads me to believe the neck is not straight in center line with the body of the guitar.
Hope this helps.

Cheers Mic.

It’s very hard to tell things from pictures. Is the sound hole centred and in-line with the seam?

Anyways, hopefully you will get some satisfaction from the dealer. You shouldn’t have to stress over this. It definitely doesn’t feel good when you believe you got a “second” for the price of a premier.

As I noted previously, I think you might want to have a chat with Gibson over their representation in Australia if they don’t offer to make things right. This is also their reputation on the line here.

Best of luck!
Martin

[TheMicster]

Hi everyone, I'm really just bringing this thread back to life to let those who were interested and following this thread know what has occurred. The retail dealer who sold me the guitar has now accepted the return of the instrument (after much deliberation) and has refunded my money less shipping costs. I did contact the Gibson Agency in Australia with my concerns but was told that the guitar was an acceptable build standard and being a hand made instrument being built a little "off" so to speak was part of the vintage vibe. I sent them another photo which I've put down below of the rear of the guitar highlighting the misalignment of the neck and body joint, but have not heard a word back since.
Anyway, i am very relieved to have my money back, I will probably now start looking for a Martin D28 Authentic and will probably never buy another Gibson guitar ever again.
Cheers Mic.

[Cool555]

Originally Posted by TheMicster

Hi everyone, I'm really just bringing this thread back to life to let those who were interested and following this thread know what has occurred. The retail dealer who sold me the guitar has now accepted the return of the instrument (after much deliberation) and has refunded my money less shipping costs. I did contact the Gibson Agency in Australia with my concerns but was told that the guitar was an acceptable build standard and being a hand made instrument being built a little "off" so to speak was part of the vintage vibe. I sent them another photo which I've put down below of the rear of the guitar highlighting the misalignment of the neck and body joint, but have not heard a word back since.
Anyway, i am very relieved to have my money back, I will probably now start looking for a Martin D28 Authentic and will probably never buy another Gibson guitar ever again.
Cheers Mic.

Congrats! That’s a great outcome! Glad you got your money back!

[Brucebubs]

That's a real pity but I can totally understand you feeling that way.
I know how much these guitars cost here.

My new SJ-200 had a rather poorly made truss rod cover - I received a much better replacement last week.

[usb_chord]

Generally speaking, buying a Gibson is kinda like buying a Rickenbacker. That is the say, they aren't Collings. There will almost always be some imperfections with the fit and finish of a gibson. You simply have to weigh your comfort with the specific issues and your like (or dislike) of the guitar as a tool to make music and make the call for yourself.

[Big-E]

Originally Posted by TheMicster

Hi everyone, I'm really just bringing this thread back to life to let those who were interested and following this thread know what has occurred. The retail dealer who sold me the guitar has now accepted the return of the instrument (after much deliberation) and has refunded my money less shipping costs. I did contact the Gibson Agency in Australia with my concerns but was told that the guitar was an acceptable build standard and being a hand made instrument being built a little "off" so to speak was part of the vintage vibe. I sent them another photo which I've put down below of the rear of the guitar highlighting the misalignment of the neck and body joint, but have not heard a word back since.
Anyway, i am very relieved to have my money back, I will probably now start looking for a Martin D28 Authentic and will probably never buy another Gibson guitar ever again.
Cheers Mic.

So glad you got it sorted and refunded. Personally I think the Gibson Agency is talking BS. It's a £5 grand guitar for heavens sake. Just my opinion you understand...........

[Silly Moustache]

Originally Posted by richard1

Sadly, I think that when we buy a Gibson we have to accept that there will be flaws. I have flaws in my J45, and although they were an annoyance when I first bought the guitar, I am used to them now. As I have added my own dings over the years the initial flaws are less important.
I agree that at the Gibson price point we should not have to accept imperfections on a new guitar, but then, if we want a Gibson....
I am no expert but looking at your pics I would not be particularly worried about the fretboard at the first fret, it looks stable enough in the photo.
One bridge pin head looks a smidgen smaller than the others, but that is no big deal, you can always replace the set if it bothers you.
The case does look a little short of the mark. In my experience cases only get shabbier over the years, though if you are going to keep the guitar at home and want to keep the case pristine, I would ask the seller to replace the case for you.
Personally, if I liked the sound and the feel of that guitar then I would keep it. We always second guess ourselves after a major purchase. Give it time and you might well gel with the guitar, the caveat is that if you don't like it after a few months it will be too late to act on it.

I'm afraid that I agree with Richard the 1st.

Perhaps my eye for quality has been spoilt by owning Collings guitars since 1999, but twice since that time I have resolved to buy a Gibson, first when I searched for a "Jackson Browne" 12 fret jumbo around 2013 and again in 2016 when I decided I needed an l-00.

I have two largish guitar shops each about forty miles (maybe 90 -120 minutes) from my home. I visited both, and each time the guitars that they offered were simply not of the quality I would expect.

I believe that the emergence of Collings. Bourgeois and maybe Santa Cruz, most of the corporate guitar builders raised their game, but Gibson, under a procession of geographic moves and dubious CEOs have not, at least not since I last looked at them.

I have to say that not all Gibson guitars in my experience have been poorly built/presented, and in fact for a while I was the sideman of a young lady singer-songwriter who played a Montana built SJ100 which was a dream and perfect as it should have been.

Incidentally I've seen poorly finished cases like that on the other "boutique" make who supplies their guitars in yellow tweed finishes.

To us.our guitars and cases are things of treasure, pleasure and admiration. To the businesses that build them, especially the larger ones - they are merely "units".

[Picker1]

Thanks for the update. I have been wondering how you made out on this issue. I completely agree with you and I'm happy it all worked out. Now it's time to buy a new guitar. How great is that?

[SkipII]

Whatever someone's allegiance to Gibson might be, consider how ludicrous it is for a company to say that defects are part of its brand's "vibe."

Talk about rationalizing your lack of commitment to quality. I'm sure that "vibe" has made it way down to the production floor.

[TRose]

Originally Posted by SkipII

Whatever someone's allegiance to Gibson might be, consider how ludicrous it is for a company to say that defects are part of its brand's "vibe."



Talk about rationalizing your lack of commitment to quality. I'm sure that "vibe" has made it way down to the production floor.

Yes.
Ludicrous is the word I also would use to describe the use of “Vintage vibe” to cover for poor quality control and a subpar product. It’s insulting, actually.

[phavriluk]

We, as consumers, need to hold onto the idea that any manufacturer isn't so much in the business of making guitars as making money...

[Brucebubs]

For me the really, really frustrating thing is Gibson, Martin and Guild all have policy in place now preventing US dealers selling new guitars to countries outside the USA with existing dealers...

... and this is a prime example of the dealers here they are protecting!!

Here in Australia we pay a premium for US made guitars from dealers with poor product knowledge and sub-standard customer service.

The last new guitar I bought from a USA dealer was my Rickenbacker bass - it was delivered to my doorstep, seller double boxed it, arrived in perfect condition with an amazing set-up and saved me around $1500 on the price here.

[BluesKing777]

Originally Posted by TheMicster

Hi everyone, I'm really just bringing this thread back to life to let those who were interested and following this thread know what has occurred. The retail dealer who sold me the guitar has now accepted the return of the instrument (after much deliberation) and has refunded my money less shipping costs. I did contact the Gibson Agency in Australia with my concerns but was told that the guitar was an acceptable build standard and being a hand made instrument being built a little "off" so to speak was part of the vintage vibe. I sent them another photo which I've put down below of the rear of the guitar highlighting the misalignment of the neck and body joint, but have not heard a word back since.
Anyway, i am very relieved to have my money back, I will probably now start looking for a Martin D28 Authentic and will probably never buy another Gibson guitar ever again.
Cheers Mic.

The Martin D28 Authentic is a very, very different guitar from a Gibson SJ200! The only thing the same is they have strings?

So, the local option: In my houseful of guitars, I have 3 locally made (Box Hill, Melbourne) Maton 808s (the 00 size I prefer). They are faultless and came setup ready to play beautifully. I am sure they can also make clunkers, but not mine.

For the same money as the SJ200, you could have 3 top of the line factory made Maton Messiah Jumbos (EM100J) - one just sold at AC for about $4200 new):

(videos from Artisan guitars):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yNksE3blvPc


Here are 2 more Messiahs - the first is the 808 smaller model and the next is the Messiah Dread. (there is a used Messiah dread at the Acoustic Centre Melbourne - no affiliation!!!)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0uz83EYObfc


BluesKing777.

[TheMicster]

Originally Posted by BluesKing777

The Martin D28 Authentic is a very, very different guitar from a Gibson SJ200! The only thing the same is they have strings?

So, the local option: In my houseful of guitars, I have 3 locally made (Box Hill, Melbourne) Maton 808s (the 00 size I prefer). They are faultless and came setup ready to play beautifully. I am sure they can also make clunkers, but not mine.

For the same money as the SJ200, you could have 3 top of the line factory made Maton Messiah Jumbos (EM100J) - one just sold at AC for about $4200 new):

(videos from Artisan guitars):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yNksE3blvPc


Here are 2 more Messiahs - the first is the 808 smaller model and the next is the Messiah Dread. (there is a used Messiah dread at the Acoustic Centre Melbourne - no affiliation!!!)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0uz83EYObfc


BluesKing777.

Yeah cheers mate, understand exactly what you're saying and know the Maton range well, i do actually own a Maton 70th anniversary dread and its actually the guitar i play every day, take to partys etc. My HD28V was for me my High end guitar that i played sparingly, recorded on and generally kept as new, this i sold to buy the SJ200. I mean i just wanted to try something different.

[edward993]

Originally Posted by TheMicster

...I did contact the Gibson Agency in Australia with my concerns but was told that the guitar was an acceptable build standard and being a hand made instrument being built a little "off" so to speak was part of the vintage vibe....

That, friends, is the mark of genuine hubris. For Gibson to use "vintage" as a mask for shoddy work, "hand made" as if poor tolerances are normal, then call it a "vibe" as if to suggest this makes for a more special instrument is all pure and absolute garbage. Moreover, that it comes from an official arm of the company is sadly indicative of how they view themselves as the purveyor of history and we lowly serfs should treasure the scraps that fall from their lofty table. Yes, I own three fine Gibsons ...electrics. This company line is utterly inexcusable.

Sorry to you, Mic, as the excitement for acquiring a fine instrument was marred not only by poor workmanship but also by arrogant management. I know the feeling of being let down when anticipating a fine piece of gear. Move on and find the guitar --and the companies-- that deliver high quality by any standard, as well as genuinely value the customers on whom they depend. They are out there; few, but they exist. Vote with your wallet and loyalty

Edward