Scales and how they work...

[sully151]

SO I don't have much knowledge in theory so this may be a dumb question.
IF you are playing in the key of G, say Roll in My Sweet Baby's Arms, will all of the breaks and or runs be within a G scale? or does it depend where you are in the song?

For instance, if you are playing a C chord or the IV position will the breaks be within a C scale?

Does that make sense?

[bluesbassdad]

Originally Posted by sully151

SO I don't have much knowledge in theory so this may be a dumb question.
IF you are playing in the key of G, say Roll in My Sweet Baby's Arms, will all of the breaks and or runs be within a G scale? or does it depend where you are in the song?

For instance, if you are playing a C chord or the IV position will the breaks be within a C scale?

Does that make sense?

In reverse order:

Yes, the questions make sense.

No, you would not normally play a C (major) scale over a C (major) chord while playing in the key of G (major). The reason is that one of the notes in the C scale is F natural, which isn't present in the G scale (where F is sharped).

You can play the C chord while playing in the key of G because it consists of the notes C, E and G, all of which are notes in the G scale.

Yes, in general you will stick to the scale that is defined by the key signature of the song. However, now and then a scale note will be made sharp or flat (a so-called "accidental"), which is the musical equivalent of a bit of oregano or red pepper in food. Use sparingly as an accent.

Oh, and when the C chord is called for, you may tend to use the notes that make up that chord more than the other notes in the G scale -- or maybe not.

I hope I got all that right and that it makes sense.

[DupleMeter]

For a song like "Roll In My Sweet Baby's Arms" - yes - stay in G Major the whole time.

here's where it gets a little complicated: As long as the chords are diatonic (natural in key) to the key, you stay with the scale of the key. If chords are non-diatonic (secondary or substitute dominants, modal interchange, dominant chords from the pentatonic or blues scales (i.e. I7, V7), et al) then you have the option (sometimes need) of playing off of the chord scale.

A lot of that depends on the chord and the musical style.

As a reference chords in a major key are (the minus (-) means minor, the 7s are all optional):

Imaj7 II-7 III-7 IVmaj7 V7 VI-7 VII-7(b5)

In a minor key they are:

I-7 II-7(b5) bIIImaj7 IV-7 V-7 bVImaj7 bVII7

often in minor key the V-7 chord is altered to make it a dominant. This is known as Harmonic Minor:

I-7 II-7(b5) bIIImaj7 IV-7 V7 bVImaj7 bVII7

Hope that makes sense.

[cward]

Could someone maybe post a tab sheet of a simple song using a major scale, say in the Key of G and explain how it works. Just something real simple. ?? Thanks.

[sully151]

Thanks guys. Between you and the folks at UMGF am learning a lot.

By the way cward, that is great idea.

[Turtle]

Originally Posted by cward

Could someone maybe post a tab sheet of a simple song using a major scale, say in the Key of G and explain how it works. Just something real simple. ?? Thanks.

I'll take a crack. But sorry, I don't know how to write tabs. The song is Mary had a Little Lamb. You know the melody.

The song is eight bars long and the chord progressions in Key of G are: G G D G G G D G. G and D are the I and V chords in G. The melody played over the top of these chords is comprised of the notes G, A, B and D - the G major scale contains these notes (plus C, E, F#). G (G, B, D) and D (D, F#, A) chords are comprised of components of the G major scale as well.

If you transpose to another key - such as D - the principle is the same. The I and V chords are D and A and the melody notes are D, E, F# and A, from the D major scale.

[cward]

Thanks. It's SLOWLY making sense to me. Real slowly!

[markIvan]

I think how i would explain this one is that you have something called the Chromatic scale which includes all the notes you will ever need to know ( veriations of them only to come ) .

So look up Chromatic scale

From every note of the chromatic scale comes all your Major and minor scales OF WHICH THE C SCALE is the mother of all scales ( because even the chromatic scale comes from the C Major scale .

All these scales are worked out with intervals of steps ( step step halfstep etc )

Look up the formulas for building scales on the net ( sometimes called modes ).


each step in a scale has a roman numeral attatched to it and also a degree name ( Major/relative minor 6th /dominant 7th and so on and so on )


There are charts you can get online with them all included but working them out for yourself is invaluable .


When to change key ( modulating ) is said to be useful to create tension and stress and vice versa so when you would change would be inpreferance for your desire in the musical direction .

Dont get mixed up with chord progressions and scales although chords are built from scales ,scales have no minor degrees as such ........only chord families have Major and minor as they progress through the ossilation of music returning back to its root/tonic or first degree .


I wrote this as a test to see if i could explain things simpler .....i see i havent

never mind .

[Bryan T]

Originally Posted by Zelator

From every note of the chromatic scale comes all your Major and minor scales OF WHICH THE C SCALE is the mother of all scales ( because even the chromatic scale comes from the C Major scale .

You've got that a little turned around.

[Allman_Fan]

Well, let me tell you what happened to me a LONG time ago. I met this woman named Maria, although some folks called her Julie, and some old hag called her “a clown.” Actually, she was “a girl” and she made me wonder if I could hold moonbeams in my hand, but I digress. One day she sang me a song about a deer; a female deer, to be precise.

I went to bed singing that song and woke up doing the same. I went to school, and it was “learning to count” day and Me and Ray and the others got turned into numbers somehow. Since then, things ain’t NEVER been the same.

[markIvan]

Originally Posted by Bryan T

You've got that a little turned around.

Yes the C major scale comes first but i was trying to make it simple to understand by saying it the way i was ......because it was a little confusing to me when i first learned how the accidentals came from no where to make a chromatic from a C Mamjor scale ...........i was albeit badly tying to give the whole range first including accidentals .......but your right i never made it simple that way and may have confused ...................but isnt it a wonderment when your learning and have to know why everything is the way it is ........its very hard to just accept FOR now .....its a need to know basis .

If i had to understand everything before i used it in music ...i would of hardly played anything ............its been very much a use first and learn afterwards for me .........dont know how it is for most .

[markIvan]

To be honest if i was learning again i would want to know the chromatic scale first because you have all the information in one scale without the need for step formulas for to convert .

If you give a new player the C major scale and say now build everything else .....he will be lost ...

But with the chromatic ......you have all the formulas included in the scale .

So from a structure point of view yes you are clinicaly correct .
But from a learning point of view i would want to know the chromatic scale first i think as you can see from it the step formulas for builing .Not so if you only have the C major and nothing else .

So i retract my correction and stand by how i would show a new player

even though you are right of course .....but for the purpose of explaining

[Allman_Fan]

Thanks for clearing that up!

[markIvan]

Originally Posted by Allman_Fan

Thanks for clearing that up!

Hope i didnt come accross contradictory as i am not saying i am right ....just how i would do it .

as i am no expert as i kinda get lost in scales when you talk about minor scales playing notes not chords ........i am not sure how that works as i mainly play in chords ......in fact mostly

just explaining my reasoning for saying it how i did ......i meant no offence ,i am also a learner ....it just helps to write it out now and again .

like i say no offence