Bit of a bash to Taylors system

[Doubleneck]

https://www.goacousticaudio.com/prod...acement-system

[Bob Womack]

Bash? It is simply a replacement system. Bravo to the company for creating an alternative. Note that it is right-handed only and only contains the parts to replace an existing ES system.

Bob

[conecaster]

Originally Posted by Bob Womack

Bash? It is simply a replacement system. Bravo to the company for creating an alternative. Note that it is right-handed only and only contains the parts to replace an existing ES system.

Bob

Thank you Bob,

The text needs to be updated on our site. . We have a new saddle that is reversible for left handed guitars.

Yes, the installation requires the original hardware, nuts, spacer and knobs.

We have reasonably capable clients who install this version themselves. It requires drilling 2 holes in the saddle slot and we provide a drill guide and drill bit to execute that task. Other wise its all plug and play. The pickup is pre cut to original saddle specs.

The controls are Vol, mic Vol and treble sweep.

Like all of our systems, the advantage is feedback suppression, touch sensitivity to a players technique, high output without gain, and dynamic range that can not be matched. Total distortion is -85%

We also make a few others application specific models.

1) for those with any type of installation featuring non intrusive sound hole mounted controls, we have a mounted sound hole control version.

https://www.goacousticaudio.com/prod...e-mount-system

2) we make a alternate preamp combined with Graphtech pickups to replace the RMC Polydrive used for years in Godin models with Midi.

https://www.goacousticaudio.com/prod...-godin-multiac

3) our latest application specific product, the Presonic preamp, is so new it is not yet listed on our site. The Presonic side mount preamps are offered in 2 versions to replace the Fisherman Prefix pro and Presys applications used by Martin and Cordoba.




The battery is removed to access the 6 string vol pots to perfectly balance strings.



We have a side mounted system for guitar makers that is more elegant and can also be installed with Midi.





We are also completing our new ukulele system currently.

[jimmy bookout]

I think the ES2 is brighter, but I feel both systems suffer from "piezo quack" (especially the bass).
The Go system sounds richer (IMO) by a LITTLE BIT, but neither sounds "acoustic"...both need some help...IR maybe? Neither is unpleasant, they just sound more or less like "piezo" pickups.

PS. I listened to the 2 sound samples with headphones, FWIW.

[conecaster]

Originally Posted by jimmy bookout

I think the ES2 is brighter, but I feel both systems suffer from "piezo quack" (especially the bass).
The Go system sounds richer (IMO) by a LITTLE BIT, but neither sounds "acoustic"...both need some help...IR maybe? Neither is unpleasant, they just sound more or less like "piezo" pickups.

PS. I listened to the 2 sound samples with headphones, FWIW.

Thank you for your opinion. Interesting perception of the low end, you can run the Taylor system through a graphic and see the signal. I have had clients do this. You will see a Bump around 100hz. So the bass is being boosted in the lower hz.

Our design does not compress the elements and I do not experience the tonality as being Piezo quack as a result. But then the ES does not use overwhelming compression either. Its just a very brittle sound that produces a lot of nail noise. If you saw the vol settings you would realized the ES is a far weaker out put requiring a lot more gain. GoAA is a very strong signal right around unity gain.

We have some of the greatest guitarist in the world using GoAA now, We have done Taylor installations for Jonathan Butler and one Taylor for Metheny, although he mostly plays his Manzer guitars with GoAA. Jonathan plays Nylon. Its not a direct comparison but then USTs Quack in nylon guitars too.

This is an Example of low frequency sound. This is GoAA combined with a Ribbon mike. Does the pickup add Quack? Why would a major artist use a pickup at all in a recording? , much less a feature solo acoustic project.



Next is Jonathan, exploiting GoAA live. He loves the fatter, richer, sound of Klugh whch I think this video demonstrates.



Here is Jonathan the night I met him back stage at a Shed venue outside of Atlanta, Mablehouse Barnes? ,when he was performing on the same bill as Peter White. Jonathan's guitar was a struggle that night. Peter introduced us and I took Jonathan's Taylor home with me and installed GoAA after the show. He walked onstage to feedback and the engineers adjusted vol. down so you can hear how much weaker the signal is. He was dissatisfied that night. He relied more on his electric guitar.

[GunR]

Hi,
I have installed GoAA replacement system in my Taylor 414-CE and I’m very satisfied! I was so disappointed with Taylor's ES-2 when I first plugged it in. It sounded really bad. Hard, bright, quacky and brittle. Lack of body.

Replacing the ES-2 wasn't very complicated. Took a couple of hours in my kitchen. I'm pretty handy, but you don't have to be a pro luthier to do this. Of course, I was a little nervous about drilling into a new $3000 Taylor, but the accessories and the instruction that come with it to support the installation made it easy. I though had to spend some time fine-tuning and filing the saddle – height and intonation. If you are unsure here, it might be a good idea to consult a luthier.

Now the guitar sounds fantastic. Warm, deep and full body tone, but the clarity remains. Plugged in it sounds close to the acoustic sound, both live and on recording. No tendencies at all to piezo quacky. And it's actually not very sensitive to feedback either when playing live and being dependent on monitors at stage. As I said – I am very pleased.

[ljguitar]

Originally Posted by GunR

Hi,
I have installed GoAA replacement system in my Taylor 414-CE and I’m very satisfied! I was so disappointed with Taylor's ES-2 when I first plugged it in. It sounded really bad. Hard, bright, quacky and brittle. Lack of body.

Replacing the ES-2 wasn't very complicated. Took a couple of hours in my kitchen. I'm pretty handy, but you don't have to be a pro luthier to do this. Of course, I was a little nervous about drilling into a new $3000 Taylor, but the accessories and the instruction that come with it to support the installation made it easy. I though had to spend some time fine-tuning and filing the saddle – height and intonation. If you are unsure here, it might be a good idea to consult a luthier.

Now the guitar sounds fantastic. Warm, deep and full body tone, but the clarity remains. Plugged in it sounds close to the acoustic sound, both live and on recording. No tendencies at all to piezo quacky. And it's actually not very sensitive to feedback either when playing live and being dependent on monitors at stage. As I said – I am very pleased.

Hi GunR…
First of all Hello and Welcome to the Forum! Glad to have you aboard…

I help with the Worship Teams at our church, and the Taylors which 'survive' without us throwing preamp-interdiction at them are the higher end 12 string acoustics.

Humans are amazingly attracted to the sound of the amplified 12s in the mix, and we just point the tone pots at noon, and turn it half-way up and it does nicely on it's own.

Others we have found better success with players who have installed alternate pickups in them (mostly K&K Pure Mini) and we have a Baggs Venue, and an older UltraSound preamp - either of which nicely improve the tone of them for mass consumption (and sound tech tolerance).

In band situations we're already doing a low cut at either 80hz or 100hz (depending on the acoustic in question). Doesn't matter if they are playing through simple or sophisticated rigs. We're not going for studio sound…

[KevWind]

Originally Posted by conecaster

Thank you for your opinion. Interesting perception of the low end, you can run the Taylor system through a graphic and see the signal. I have had clients do this. You will see a Bump around 100hz. So the bass is being boosted in the lower hz.

Not to worry, expectation bias is a strong influence at times, and we the AGF are a funny and peculiar lot at times .
I would not characterize either sample as particularly quack-ie sounding
Now for certain the ES is the more bright which can be addressed to some extent with EQ However the Go sample IMO has a smoother overall sound yet with more presence and more full sounding the mids and lows. Congrats on you product

My one criticism (or suggestion) is do not use the two live YT video being most likely filmed and recorded on a smart phone, and the sound is pretty awful.
Not a good promo at all ---just sayin '

[conecaster]

Originally Posted by KevWind

Not to worry, expectation bias is a strong influence at times, and we the AGF are a funny and peculiar lot at times .
I would not characterize either sample as particularly quack-ie sounding
Now for certain the ES is the more bright which can be addressed to some extent with EQ However the Go sample IMO has a smoother overall sound yet with more presence and more full sounding the mids and lows. Congrats on you product

My one criticism (or suggestion) is do not use the two live YT video being most likely filmed and recorded on a smart phone, and the sound is pretty awful.
Not a good promo at all ---just sayin '

My intent was to demonstrate overall capability, competing on a loud stage, not so much the pure sound.

The Metheny track demonstrates tone in a recording setting.

Most of the time people want brightness to cut through a band, high hat tonality.

In our system we do not have to go crazy cutting bass with high pass filters. After all, the distinctive character of the acoustic guitar is the low end response. Usually high pass is applied to kill feed back producing low hz. When gain is applied it becomes even more of an issue.

As I explained in my post, Jonathan was fighting feedback that night. He just watched Peter White play against a sax in his face at higher vol with no feedback.

He switched to GoAA as a result. His next gig was a stressful situation. Airline issues caused him to arrive in time to play. He had no sound check. He walked on stage not knowing what to expect. The engineers just set everything flat and did a rough estimate of vol. Jonathan was amazed there were not issues and he could just perform. Its about the confidence and expression of the guitarist. Once you experience that you can better understand what is offered. Doing comparisons with recordings is not very broad, it is too unidimensional.

But we do videos anyway, to offer some comparison.

You are not going to take a UST, top transducer, internal un phased mic of even a soundhole pickup onto a loud stage and survive the energy affecting an acoustic guitar.

This is why I put up those videos.

Thank you for your cudos

[Rick Shepherd]

Personally, if there were an ES system replacement out there for the ES 1.0 that doesn’t require drilling more holes or putting plugs in empty holes in the guitar, I would be very interested. So far, I am unaware of anything.

[Gutch]

Originally Posted by Rick Shepherd

Personally, if there were an ES system replacement out there for the ES 1.0 that doesn’t require drilling more holes or putting plugs in empty holes in the guitar, I would be very interested. So far, I am unaware of anything.

Ditto here, Rick. I have two first gen (2002, 2003) ES equipped Taylors that the pickups died years ago. I've replaced them with Baggs Anthem pickups but would really like to utilize the upper bout control position of the ES system.

I'm sure we aren't the only ones out there. Great opportunity for whoever wants to venture there!

[conecaster]

Originally Posted by Gutch

Ditto here, Rick. I have two first gen (2002, 2003) ES equipped Taylors that the pickups died years ago. I've replaced them with Baggs Anthem pickups but would really like to utilize the upper bout control position of the ES system.

I'm sure we aren't the only ones out there. Great opportunity for whoever wants to venture there!

https://www.goacousticaudio.com/prod...acement-system



Stephen has 2 Taylor guitars he uses in the pit for the theater productions he works in.

You can move on from the standard under saddle tonality.

[IraDuncan]

I am so glad I wandered in here tonight.

My biggest gripe with the ES/ES2 was the absence of an internal microphone. As a player, I've had an internal mic on all my live performance guitars since 2000. I cannot reproduce what I do with an ES system, and thus I have shunned ES equipped Taylors for many many years.

My last phone call to Taylor was last April, and I ordered the NT neck reset package then. I told Taylor they should find a way to incorporate a microphone into their ES system.

This product makes that unnecessary now, and if I end up playing an ES equipped Taylor that I cannot get away from, one of these systems will be installed.

[Petty1818]

I don't believe it's available now, but the tru-plug system was awesome. I have it in my Taylor. It covers up the holes for the ES controls beautifully and even comes with an endpin piece that fits in perfectly and allows for a new system to be installed.

On a side note, I have grown to very much dislike the tone of Taylor guitars so that's my main issue for skipping them but their obsession with fitting every guitar with a pickup is just crazy to me. I can't wrap my head around a brand that offers guitars in the boutique price range, but then sticks ugly control knobs and a huge endpin jack section on the guitar.

[conecaster]

Originally Posted by IraDuncan

I am so glad I wandered in here tonight.

My biggest gripe with the ES/ES2 was the absence of an internal microphone. As a player, I've had an internal mic on all my live performance guitars since 2000. I cannot reproduce what I do with an ES system, and thus I have shunned ES equipped Taylors for many many years.

My last phone call to Taylor was last April, and I ordered the NT neck reset package then. I told Taylor they should find a way to incorporate a microphone into their ES system.

This product makes that unnecessary now, and if I end up playing an ES equipped Taylor that I cannot get away from, one of these systems will be installed.