DADGAD, hmm

[Doug Young]

Originally Posted by rick-slo

Doug, different tunings set you down different paths, especially when composing something entirely original.

Of course. And trying a new tuning is very useful for sparking the imagination, which is one reason I use lots of them. But if you just let the tuning dictate the path, you are almost guaranteed to end up sounding the same as everyone else who is letting the tuning drive. Same as in standard - how many times do we hear the same James Taylor D licks?. My guess is that for your taste, you just don't like Juber or Bensusan's style, and wouldn't no matter what tuning they use (Juber only uses DADGAD about half the time)

[rick-slo]

Originally Posted by Doug Young

Of course. And trying a new tuning is very useful for sparking the imagination, which is one reason I use lots of them. But if you just let the tuning dictate the path, you are almost guaranteed to end up sounding the same as everyone else who is letting the tuning drive. Same as in standard - how many times do we hear the same James Taylor D licks?. My guess is that for your taste, you just don't like Juber or Bensusan's style, and wouldn't no matter what tuning they use (Juber only uses DADGAD about half the time)

Mostly agree, but some tunings are more path dictating than others. Certain tunings (probably open tunings the most) do a lot of hand holding. There is a certain amount of drawback to that, especially for newer guitar players. DADGAD for example is so biased towards droning, infinitely long sustaining open strings, and the key of D that few composers escape - great for noodling though.

Exploring a variety of tunings can the thought provoking and sometimes inspirational. It's just where do you want to mainly hangout.

[Doug Young]

Originally Posted by rick-slo

Mostly agree, but some tunings are more path dictating than others. Certain tunings (probably open tunings the most) do a lot of hand holding. There is a certain amount of drawback to that, especially for newer guitar players. DADGAD for example is so biased towards droning, infinitely long sustaining open strings, and the key of D that few composers escape - great for noodling though.

Exploring a variety of tunings can the thought provoking and sometimes inspirational. It's just where do you want to mainly hangout.

I think one reason I prefer "sus" tunings is that they dictate less of a path than others. With Open D and Open G, for example, its harder (tho not impossible) to get away from the major sound of the obvious key+ a few related. DADGAD is more like standard in that it's a bit more flexible, you can play in virtually any key relatively easily and you're not restricted.

[JonPR]

Originally Posted by Earwitness

Wow. Those were not my cup of tea at all ! I guess I'm not a dadgad target audience.

Probably not. Not everybody can like everything! I'm no evangelist for DADGAD myself, it's just one among a few common alternatives (drop D, open D, open G) I use very occasionally. Most of the time, in fact, it's when I'm transcribing tunes for others that I'm not likely to play myself.

But just FYI (you don't have to like it! ), here's the guy that invented it, in order to make the guitar sound a bit more "Arabic", and to support his contention that folk musics around the world had more in common than was often thought:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hvpTVn_Ltzc
Plenty of modal-D noodling, you'll notice . It was others later that realised DADGAD was adaptable to pretty much any key. Almost as much as EADGBE.

[mesa]

I remember Martin Simpson saying his goal was to play the best sounding music in the easiest possible way. I've had a lot of sport related injuries to my fingers in my youth that have haunted me in my older days. So Martin Simpsons approach has been just what the Doctor ordered.

http://www.acousticguitar.com/How-To...Martin-Simpson

[Doug Young]

Originally Posted by mesa

I remember Martin Simpson saying his goal was to play the best sounding music in the easiest possible way. I've had a lot of sport related injuries to my fingers in my youth that have haunted me in my older days. So Martin Simpsons approach has been just what the Doctor ordered.

I attended a workshop with Martin years ago, and I don't recall much about it, except for this, which has really stuck with me, and had a huge impact on how I think. He talked about how you only have so much technique/strength/etc, no matter how good you are. Martin certainly has no shortage of technical ability, but he said he'd rather devote that technique to tone, phrasing, musical expression and so on than to expend it holding down barre chords and playing awkward fingerings. So he looks for ways to reduce that (alternate tunings), so he can focus on playing musically. He wasn't advocating any specific tuning, just finding a way to play as musically as possible. That definitely resonated with me.

[rick-slo]

Not a particular fan of Simpson's music (sight read through about thirty tabs of his tunes) probably in part due
a lot of techniques he avoids. One thing I do like (among others such as moving around to different keys) about
the use of barres is the increased availability of controlling note (or whole chord) durations and string damping.

[JonPR]

Originally Posted by rick-slo

Not a particular fan of Simpson's music (sight read through about thirty tabs of his tunes)

You do that when you're not a fan?
I haven't heard much of Simpson's music, but I like what I've heard. But I've never read any of his tabs! (Let alone sight-read them....)

Originally Posted by rick-slo

probably in part due a lot of techniques he avoids.
One thing I do like (among others such as moving around to different keys) about the use of barres is the increased availability of controlling note (or whole chord) durations and string damping.

On that point, I think the use of open strings and notes ringing across each other is a quite deliberate choice for the sound of certain folk guitar tunes. (I've heard it called "harp guitar".) Alternative tunings tend to allow a lot more of that.
A recent workshop I attended (on DADGAD, not surprisingly ) gave us scale exercises based on allowing notes to ring across one another as much as possible. It's not something I've made much use of before myself, but I can see the appeal. I certainly don't dislike it, it's an attractive effect.
At the same time, I see the appeal of preventing that (in other kinds of music), by using fret muting techniques as you say.

[rick-slo]

Originally Posted by JonPR

You do that when you're not a fan?
I haven't heard much of Simpson's music, but I like what I've heard. But I've never read any of his tabs! (Let alone sight-read them....)

Don't really know one way or another about how much I might like compositions unless I check them out by playing through them and/or listening to audios. I'm pretty good at sight reading things.

Originally Posted by JonPR

On that point, I think the use of open strings and notes ringing across each other is a quite deliberate choice for the sound of certain folk guitar tunes. (I've heard it called "harp guitar".) Alternative tunings tend to allow a lot more of that.

Certainly that is a valid and useful style. I play and write music in different tunings and some times make use of just letting open strings ring out until they die of their own volition. Include that among a broader palette of choices.

[JonPR]

Originally Posted by rick-slo

Don't really know one way or another about how much I might like compositions unless I check them out by playing through them and/or listening to audios. I'm pretty good at sight reading things.

Right. Listening first for me.
I can't sight-read tabs (I mean, I can read them, but not sight-read), and if I like a tune I'll probably transcribe it myself, notation as well as tab. Sometimes notation only if it's EADGBE, but for alt tunings probably tab too. I'd use internet tab as maybe a starting point, but I'd never rely on it.
Of course, I'm lazy, and if the tune was complicated and the tab looked good (or was from a reputable source), I'd just copy it into my software and check it later.

[jemartin]

That was the same reaction that I have had with DADGAD in the past. But now...I have to say that Doug Young's DADGAD Christmas digital book and cd has really helped me to use my 12 string in a way that I haven't done in the past. With the dropped tunings of 3 strings, I can get incredible tones from the old Guild F512! Doug has arranged them in such a way that they are new and fresh ideas for Christmas music... with an incredible 12 string twist. I know most of the songs on the 6 string, strumming and fingerstyle, but the DADGAD on 6 or 12 string is just what the dr. ordered for me! Thank you Doug Young....

[Doug Young]

Glad to hear those were helpful, Joe! 12-string in DADGAD is amazing, tho I never tried those tunes on a 12, so I'm happy to hear it works well.

[TBman]

Originally Posted by jemartin

That was the same reaction that I have had with DADGAD in the past. But now...I have to say that Doug Young's DADGAD Christmas digital book and cd has really helped me to use my 12 string in a way that I haven't done in the past. With the dropped tunings of 3 strings, I can get incredible tones from the old Guild F512! Doug has arranged them in such a way that they are new and fresh ideas for Christmas music... with an incredible 12 string twist. I know most of the songs on the 6 string, strumming and fingerstyle, but the DADGAD on 6 or 12 string is just what the dr. ordered for me! Thank you Doug Young....

I just bought that but I haven't had time to sit with it due to the holiday and getting various things done around here. It's funny how you can go from DADGAD to DADF#AD and get a different feel and flavor to things.

[Doug Young]

Originally Posted by TBman

I just bought that but I haven't had time to sit with it due to the holiday and getting various things done around here. It's funny how you can go from DADGAD to DADF#AD and get a different feel and flavor to things.

I agree, I find different tunings fascinating. Lower that 3rd string to F#, F, or even E,and you get very different sounds, even tho you still have the same 12 notes. Or lower the A string to G (DGDGAD) and then lower the 6th to C for another marvelous tuning (CGDGAD), and then raise the 2nd up to C for yet another (CGDGCD). Or start in DADGAD and raise bottom and top two strings and get EADGBE, another cool tuning! In a lot of ways, you can do anything in any tuning, but each one also opens up new doors. I just enjoy them all.

P.S. let me know if you have any questions about the book!

[Gitfiddlemann]

In a lot of ways, you can do anything in any tuning, but each one also opens up new doors. I just enjoy them all.

And it provides good justification for having more than just one guitar around to play.