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  #1  
Old 10-16-2019, 07:22 PM
Drumsalot Drumsalot is offline
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Default Global / Dove Lawsuit Acoustic Guitar / Information Needed!

Hello all,
I have acquired a Global acoustic guitar with two doves on the pick guards and mother of pearl inlays. It has a sticker on the back of the head stock that reads 8066D. Also the Global sticker inside the guitar. I have been told this may be a "lawsuit guitar" but would like to find out more information on when it was made and possible value. Ant information would be greatly appreciated.
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Old 10-17-2019, 12:43 PM
NotALuth NotALuth is offline
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Global was the brand name used by a Chicago based importer of budget instruments from Asia from 70’s to early 80’s.

All Global guitars were made in Korea. Despite some sellers claims, there is no evidence for them being made in Japan.

From my understanding, technically the only true “lawsuit” guitars are those made by Hoshino Gakki ( who own the Ibanez and Tama brands) which led to the then owners of Gibson guitars filing a lawsuit in 1977 referring solely to the use of their “open book” headstock design. This was settled out of court with Ibanez changing the headstocks on their guitars thereafter.

“Lawsuit-era” is a more tenuous term, but is generally used to describe instruments manufactured in Japan in the mid-late 70’s by a variety of manufacturers, and under numerous brands, which closely copied the appearance of the best-known US manufacturers products (Gibson/Fender/Martin). Possibly other legal representations may have been made regarding some of these instruments but no other lawsuits were actually filed to my knowledge.

So, your Global is definitely not a “lawsuit” or even a “lawsuit-era” guitar as far as I can determine. As to value, I have no idea, prices seem to be all over the place for even the better known and respected Japanese instruments from this period.

As long as you are happy with what you paid then just enjoy it!
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Old 10-17-2019, 02:31 PM
Wade Hampton Wade Hampton is offline
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Just to add to NotALuth’s information, “lawsuit” as a descriptive adjective has become commonplace among some players to describe any Asian-made copy of an American guitar design. It’s gotten used so much that what little meaning it once had has become completely diluted.


whm
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Old 10-17-2019, 02:37 PM
Brucebubs Brucebubs is offline
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I think Takamine might have received 'cease & desist' notices from Martin AND Guild.

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Old 10-17-2019, 02:48 PM
Wade Hampton Wade Hampton is offline
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They definitely got one from Martin, so it wouldn’t be surprising if Guild sent one, too.


whm
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Old 10-17-2019, 03:22 PM
tadol tadol is offline
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I've been led to believe that it is a badge of honor, a sign that you have "made it to the big time" to get a cease and desist order from Gibson, usually about the headstock design -
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Old 10-17-2019, 10:24 PM
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DenverSteve DenverSteve is offline
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I believe it is more of a badge dishonor for copyright, trademark and patent infringement from companies seeking to cheat those who have spend decades and/or centuries cultivating a brand identity based on history and appearance. I see no badge of honor for cheating and or copying others' achievements. But, that's what the Japanese companies were doing in the 60's and '70's.
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Old 10-17-2019, 11:04 PM
tadol tadol is offline
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I wasn’t referring to off-shore companies, just American ones that got threatening letters for having an extremely minor stylistic headstock detail that was similar to one that Gibson used, although every other detail (especially a large and obvious brand-name) was different. I prefer companies that compete on the quality of their instruments rather than the quantity of their lawyers -
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Old 10-17-2019, 11:16 PM
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I would be interested in those names. I’m only familiar with Japanese companies receiving law-suit threats.
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Old 10-18-2019, 08:19 AM
lowrider lowrider is offline
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One of the guys I play with has an over 40 year old Takamine copy of a Martin dread that he has had since it was new and it sounds really good. But it's had 40 years to mature. I doubt if it sounds any better than a 40 year old Sigma would sound and I also doubt that it sounds as good as a 40 year old Martin sounds.

Most of those guitars were just cheap plywood guitars made to look like the real thing. I think that sellers stick that ''lawsuit era'' title on them to try to make them look like something they are not.
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Old 10-18-2019, 09:02 AM
IM4Nats IM4Nats is offline
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Default Global Dove

Global is really entry level and I can't imagine one selling for more than $100.
I don't think Korea is outputting acoustics anywhere as good as the electrics from that country...I could be wrong. Some Japanese acoustics from the 70s were pretty good and a great value. My experience is that they don't mature into better sounding instruments. They stay about the same. I have a "Nagoya" with a solid top and herringbone purfing, and it's still plays nice and sounds OK. Got it in 1975. I could never get the $265 back even though it looks nearly new. The cheap acoustic guitars out of China blow those old Taks outta the water. Especially Eastman, Guild and Fender.
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Old 10-18-2019, 11:58 AM
Hogeye Hogeye is offline
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Kopp Guitars received a letter from Gibson concerning his headstock shape. He was told to cease or get sued. He changed the headstock and all seems to be fine now. The headstock change didn't have any effect on his sales and I think that it looks a lot better.

Yes he was intimidated by the letter but his change was for the better and all is well.

Kevin still builds his guitars in Bozeman and he is a former employee of Gibson having worked in their custom shop for many years. He didn't use the Gibson headstock shape to try to fool anyone into thinking they were buying a Gibson. He used it because he was familiar with it and since it was such a small detail he didn't think it was any problem. He now sees that it is much better for him to be totally identified with his own superior product than to have any questions about who he is.

The Kopp guitars are far superior to anything Gibson is building and one would think that they would be happy to be identified with a great product.
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Old 10-18-2019, 12:10 PM
Athens Athens is offline
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Default OMG!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brucebubs View Post
I think Takamine might have received 'cease & desist' notices from Martin AND Guild.

Wow. Even the TRC is a direct ripoff of the old Guild style.
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Old 10-18-2019, 01:34 PM
tadol tadol is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DenverSteve View Post
I would be interested in those names. I’m only familiar with Japanese companies receiving law-suit threats.
This is a video that Gibson posted, then took down shortly after - but it basically explains the approach and attitude that they have to everyone else in the industry. Notice that they specifically say that even if its just a copy of the "open-book" headstock shape, that alone makes it a Gibson copy - and if you need to know those names, most of my discussions have been with very small boutique builders over quite a few years, none of whose products could never be confused with Gibsons and build so few instruments in such limited markets, even if people confused their guitars with Gibsons, it would only make Gibson look better. And none could afford lawyers to defend themselves against that corporation, Personally, I have a hard time understanding how basic symmetry can be considered a trademarked element -

https://www.reddit.com/link/c1p9kc/v...uxvx431/player

"Gibson Threatens Guitar Builders in Controversial Video, Takes It Down After Public Outcry
"You have been warned. We're looking out and we're here to protect our iconic legacy." "


And you can read about their suit against Dean - from the website Guitar.com

"GIBSON SUES DEAN GUITARS OVER ALLEGED TRADEMARK INFRINGEMENT
Gibson follows through on video threat and files multi-million dollar lawsuit against Dean and Luna Guitars in Texas court.

The details of the filing are equally interesting. Rather than only accusing Armadillo of infringing trademarks, the filing accuses it of Trademark Counterfeiting – in effect accusing Armadillo of trying to deceive or mislead the public into thinking that the guitars made by Dean and Luna are in fact Gibsons, or have some connection to Gibson.

This is notable because not only is it a more serious accusation than trademark infringement, the penalties if the court is to find against Armadillo are also much greater. Gibson is seeking damages comprising Armadillo’s profits, damages sustained by Gibson, and the costs of the action, as well as for the former two amounts “to be trebled or otherwise multiplied to the extent permitted by statute”, according to official court documents. Alternatively, Gibson can pursue statutory damages of up to and including $14 million ($2 million for each of the seven mentioned in the filing)."

Now, I know essentially about electric guitars, but looking at what Dean offers, and looking at what Gibson offers, there is no way I would confuse the 2 brands even from many yards away -
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Old 10-19-2019, 10:09 AM
Bernieman Bernieman is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tadol View Post
(...)Now, I know essentially about electric guitars, but looking at what Dean offers, and looking at what Gibson offers, there is no way I would confuse the 2 brands even from many yards away -
You surely have many years of experience with guitars ; but many youngsters or beginners wouldn't pay much attention to those various details you're aware of, and end up thinking they'd get the real thing quite often ; I'm not against anyone, but it's easy to find one's way of making guitars, to find a peculiar shape or logo, to bring some identity and original ideas, that I don't see why many people just copy iconic models. Of course there woundn't be any guarantees that these models would make it; or even sell reasonably well ; then I'd have to say again that those who copy must be really uptight ! Or that copies are the safest way to sell (and make) guitars, and then that they are greedy (want to make as much as possible), and mean (don't want to spend in research) - or lazy maybe -, which would (partly at least) justify some of Gibson's people concerns...Wouldn't you agree pr are there other reasons ?

Of course a luthier building 10 to 16 guitars/year, that would make a replica of some iconic model by Gibson or Martin works on a different base as those industrial process I'm thinking of...

Last edited by Bernieman; 10-19-2019 at 10:23 AM.
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