Onboard preamp options for K&K?

martingitdave · #1 06-11-2018, 03:49 PM

I have a K&K that could use an onboard preamp. I can't recall if I liked their prephase when I tried it a few years ago. But, I think I want something with mid frequency control. I play a lot of open mics, and I'd like to start with a decent tone sent to the mixer. I'm fine with the passive K&K, but I'd like to have the highs come out a little better. I have a few pedal options, including the ToneDexter, so this is really a hunt for an onbaord preamp for open mic scenarios.

K&K offered the following options:

Onboard Trinity Upgrade: includes preamp and microphone
Onboard Trinity preamp ONLY: includes preamp ONLY - no microphone
PowerMix Pure Upgrade: includes preamp and FAntaStick pickup
PowerMix preamp ONLY: includes preamp ONLY - no pickup
UltraPure preamp ONLY: includes preamp - no pickup
Trinity Microphone Solo: includes microphone
Prephase Miniature Preamp

I was wondering if anyone is aware of any other onboard preamps that work well with the K&K Mini. I have tried the Wavelength Dual preamp from Duncan, but it didn't sounds great in my latest installation.

I'm looking for something with the 1MOhm input impedance. The new products from Sunnaudio look interesting.

martingitdave · #2 06-14-2018, 03:15 PM

Updating my thread:

I spoke with someone who is very knowledgeable about the acoustic guitar pickup world. He made a few suggestions of after market preamps to try with the K&K depending on what you're looking for. The internal preamp will restore the attenuated frequencies from the passive pickup. That's what I am looking for, incidentally.

If you can fit the K&K UltraPure soundboard mounted preamp (I cannot), and you aren't concerned with the acoustic tone impact (I am), then that is the best product for a single source K&K installation.

If all you need is to restore the missing highs and lows, and don't need additional gain, the K&K Prephase is a good option, but it only has a 4 dB gain. Most of the others have up to 20 dB, which is important if you are plugging directly into PA mixing boards.

If you have a K&K installation and you want to warm it up, he suggested looking at endpin preamp that is supplied with the LR Baggs iBeam system. He said it is pre-eq'd for a soundboard transducer and will likely have a warmer sound. So, if you have a bright guitar with a K&K, that might be a good suggestion.

In my case, I have a big boomy dreadnought, so I don't need it to be any warmer. He suggested the Schatten Player VT preamp. This preamp is a flat response preamp but will restore the missing high end and low end frequencies, which is exactly what I am looking for. My guitar sounds a little muddy with the passive K&K and I want to make it more crisp across the spectrum. I called Schatten in Canada to get his opinion. He agreed. He also indicated that he didn't think impedance would be an issue. This unit also has an adjustable gain pot, which is a plus.

So, I ordered a Schatten. Should be here in about a week. I'll report back.

Methos1979 · #3 06-15-2018, 09:17 AM

When you say 'onboard' you are implying you want the pre-amp to be mounded inside your guitar? Or at the very least somehow attached to the guitar or to you? I'm assuming this is so you have some control at your fingertips for on-the-fly corrections?

I have in the past used the little K&K preamp with the belt clip. I've had it on my right, front pants pocket and I've even put it on the guitar strap. I usually have it pre-EQd to dial up the highs, the mids are way back and the bass just a little back. Like you, my K&K guitars are muddy without EQ mostly due to my playing style of playing fingerstyle with no nails or picks.

As of late I've just started bringing my Boss VE-8. It runs on batteries and I've got it dialed in for EQ. It sits on the floor (obviously) but gives me great pre-EQd tone plus volume and notch control on the fly plus mute and tune if I need it. I would think a PARA or Venue would also work well but again those are not 'onboard' solutions.

EdEd · #4 06-15-2018, 10:36 AM

Other than sound quality, the best thing about the K&K (IMO) is the "nothing else in the guitar" aspect...

The K&K Pure Preamp on the guitar strap or belt works great for me, when I need a preamp. It's nice that it sounds so good going straight into my Ultrasound, and often I don't need any preamp at all.

Ed

fedexnman · #5 06-17-2018, 07:28 AM

Mi-Si Crystal pre..... Might work maybe email the company ? And tell them the impedence of the K&K and what your trying to do . If you have a solder iron and can solder it might be an easy thing .

martingitdave · #6 06-17-2018, 07:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fedexnman

Mi-Si Crystal pre..... Might work maybe email the company ? And tell them the impedence of the K&K and what your trying to do . If you have a solder iron and can solder it might be an easy thing .

Thank you. I’ve tried it, actually. They will make one for the Dazzo and K&K with the appropriate impedance. I’ll admit that this was for a previous guitar. And, ultimately, it did not have the tone or headroom I was looking for.

AndyC · #7 06-17-2018, 09:16 AM

I've just taken delivery of a Sunnaudio external preamp, which my K&K sounded really good with. Their onboard systems use exactly the same circuitry.

I bought the Sunnaudio because I am going to fit Dazzo's to my guitar, but wanted to hear it with the K&K's before I did the swap. It's as good as I have ever heard the K&K's sound.

Br1ck · #8 06-17-2018, 02:44 PM

Hold on to your hat, because the Dazzos will shine with the SunnAudio circuit.

I'm mystified about all the K&K eq talk. I've had Dazzos in all my guitars for so long I've forgotten EQ issues exist.

Vancebo · #9 06-17-2018, 04:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Br1ck

Hold on to your hat, because the Dazzos will shine with the SunnAudio circuit.

I'm mystified about all the K&K eq talk. I've had Dazzos in all my guitars for so long I've forgotten EQ issues exist.

I laughed a bit at this quote. ...I’ve forgotten EQ issues exist.

It is so true. I was always scrambling for the EQ knobs adjusting here and there and taking deep cuts at times. I knew something must not have been right having to EQ as much as I did with other systems. I do use the treble and bass knobs on my Sunnaudio preamps but not to any extreme.

BluesKing777 · #10 06-17-2018, 07:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by martingitdave

I have a K&K that could use an onboard preamp. I can't recall if I liked their prephase when I tried it a few years ago. But, I think I want something with mid frequency control. I play a lot of open mics, and I'd like to start with a decent tone sent to the mixer. I'm fine with the passive K&K, but I'd like to have the highs come out a little better. I have a few pedal options, including the ToneDexter, so this is really a hunt for an onbaord preamp for open mic scenarios.

K&K offered the following options:

Onboard Trinity Upgrade: includes preamp and microphone
Onboard Trinity preamp ONLY: includes preamp ONLY - no microphone
PowerMix Pure Upgrade: includes preamp and FAntaStick pickup
PowerMix preamp ONLY: includes preamp ONLY - no pickup
UltraPure preamp ONLY: includes preamp - no pickup
Trinity Microphone Solo: includes microphone
Prephase Miniature Preamp

I was wondering if anyone is aware of any other onboard preamps that work well with the K&K Mini. I have tried the Wavelength Dual preamp from Duncan, but it didn't sounds great in my latest installation.

I'm looking for something with the 1MOhm input impedance. The new products from Sunnaudio look interesting.

Do you have a coat with a pocket large enough to squeeze your ToneDexter in? Hang TD around your neck?

(I was playing my Waterloo WL-14X with the K&K installed a few weeks back through my Tonedexter > mixer > headphones and it is just superb - the first and only wavemap I have made of the WL-14X and I nailed it!)

BluesKing777.

Doug Young · #11 06-17-2018, 07:56 PM

I've used a DTar Wavelength end-pin preamp with a K&K. I suspect many of the preamps that come with other pickups would work fine. The Wavelength worked quite well.

martingitdave · #12 06-17-2018, 09:13 PM

Thanks for the suggestions!

lkingston · #13 06-24-2018, 03:40 PM

Why not just a simple active directbox?

martingitdave · #14 06-24-2018, 05:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lkingston

Why not just a simple active directbox?

Thanks for the suggestion. This was for the guitar I use for “plug and play” events like open mics and showcases. I was hoping for a simple solution. I just found another HD28E Retro and I bough a ToneDexter. I’ll use the Retro when I need plug and play and the ToneDexter and higher end guitar with passive K&K wherever I can accommodate it.

BluesKing777 · #15 06-24-2018, 07:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by martingitdave

Thanks for the suggestion. This was for the guitar I use for “plug and play” events like open mics and showcases. I was hoping for a simple solution. I just found another HD28E Retro and I bough a ToneDexter. I’ll use the Retro when I need plug and play and the ToneDexter and higher end guitar with passive K&K wherever I can accommodate it.

You bought another HD28E?

I would get on over to Artisan Music in Franklin near Nashville and try/buy this used Maton Messiah dread with the superb AP5-Pro pickup system I love.... (though I prefer the 00 size 808s) but I know you like Rosewood/spruce, so

https://artisanguitars.com/maton-em1...-2015-id-12366

Here is a list of Maton artists on the website and I bet over 90% of them plug direct to a PA:

https://maton.com.au/artists/archive

BluesKing777.