Martins and Waterloos at NAMM 2016

garthjmoore · #1 01-26-2016, 06:22 PM

Just saw the Martin 00L-17 Whiskey Sunset, looks fantastic. Is this a response to the Waterloo model? Anyone know anything about this or the new Waterloos at NAMM?

ohYew812 · #2 01-26-2016, 06:25 PM

I would LOVE one... it has all the specs I'd be after.

The deal breaker for me is the satin finish.

Cameleye · #3 01-26-2016, 07:12 PM

Look is very similar. Collings has borrowed the L-00 shape. Martin's using their 000.

bayoubengal · #4 02-11-2016, 11:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by garthjmoore

Just saw the Martin 00L-17 Whiskey Sunset, looks fantastic. Is this a response to the Waterloo model? Anyone know anything about this or the new Waterloos at NAMM?

You may have already sen this thread, but just in case...
http://www.acousticguitarforum.com/f...d.php?t=417277

Ted @ LA Guitar Sales · #5 02-11-2016, 12:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by garthjmoore

Just saw the Martin 00L-17 Whiskey Sunset, looks fantastic. Is this a response to the Waterloo model?

Yes, it's a Marin copy, of a Collings copy, of a Gibson copy, of a Martin.

Quote:

Anyone know anything about this or the new Waterloos at NAMM

Tried both at NAMM, but not side by side. We have the new Martin 00's coming in this week at which point I'll be able to compare them to some of their competition.

Wade Hampton · #6 02-11-2016, 01:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by garthjmoore

Just saw the Martin 00L-17 Whiskey Sunset, looks fantastic. Is this a response to the Waterloo model?

Maybe, and maybe it's just a response to the general gestalt in the guitar market right now. It's probably both.

whm

smurph1 · #7 02-11-2016, 01:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ohYew812

I would LOVE one... it has all the specs I'd be after.

The deal breaker for me is the satin finish.

A lot of people prefer gloss and I respect that. But it's been my experience that Satin finished guitars can sound exceptional as well. My 2 cents.

ohYew812 · #8 02-11-2016, 06:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by smurph1

A lot of people prefer gloss and I respect that. But it's been my experience that Satin finished guitars can sound exceptional as well. My 2 cents.

Sure they sound great!

But I'm shallow like that.

However, the 'black smoke' is starting to grow on me... no smudge marks.

Ted @ LA Guitar Sales · #9 02-11-2016, 06:33 PM

So I just spent some time with the new 17's, and I'm happy to report that they are fantastic!

Talk about pre war vintage! Once we get enough of them in, I will no doubt add one to my personal collection and start experimenting with different strings, but I could certainly be happy with them as is, with the Lifespans.

And yes, the finish will throw some people off at first, I know I was thrown off the first time I picked up a Waterloo, but I suspect it will quickly grow on most folks. And the price is certainly right.

Here's a quick iPhone photo.

bayoubengal · #10 02-11-2016, 11:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ted @ LA Guitar Sales

So I just spent some time with the new 17's, and I'm happy to report that they are fantastic!

Talk about pre war vintage! Once we get enough of them in, I will no doubt add one to my personal collection and start experimenting with different strings, but I could certainly be happy with them as is, with the Lifespans.

And yes, the finish will throw some people off at first, I know I was thrown off the first time I picked up a Waterloo, but I suspect it will quickly grow on most folks. And the price is certainly right.

Here's a quick iPhone photo.

Great news!

Coach Jim · #11 02-12-2016, 06:54 PM

Ted,

A lot has been written about the 2 5/32 string spacing at the bridge / saddle on the new Martin 17 series. Since you have had time to familiarize yourself with these guitars, how did you find the new string spacing? Is it noticeable when fingerpicking?

TBman · #12 02-12-2016, 08:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ted @ LA Guitar Sales

Yes, it's a Martin copy, of a Collings copy, of a Gibson copy, of a Martin.

......

.

A classic.

db25364 · #13 02-13-2016, 06:06 AM

Ted, how do you think the 00-17s models compare to the CEO-7? I know the structure is different but how about in sound?

Ted @ LA Guitar Sales · #14 02-13-2016, 10:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coach Jim

Ted,

A lot has been written about the 2 5/32 string spacing at the bridge / saddle on the new Martin 17 series. Since you have had time to familiarize yourself with these guitars, how did you find the new string spacing? Is it noticeable when fingerpicking?

To be honest, I didn't even notice.

Quote:

Originally Posted by db25364

Ted, how do you think the 00-17s models compare to the CEO-7? I know the structure is different but how about in sound?

I'll have to play them side by side some more for a full comparison, but my first impression is that the new 0017's have a more fundamental tone. They are definitely two very different guitars.

EverettWilliams · #15 02-13-2016, 11:19 AM

One could rightly say that Collings' success has been built on emulating the designs of other people.

But Martin's latest move feels flatly uncreative.

I get it: the Waterloo is a knock off of Gibson's old school knockoffs. But, as an owner of an old Carson Robison, I think the new ones are landing pretty close to the target and they're pretty cool.

Martin may have some people who take the leap in this and I haven't played one, but I can't imagine why anyone would be willing to pay the same price for a Martin knockoff of a Waterloo.

I think Martin lost its way for some time. But with the Authentics and updates to the D-18 and OOO-18, has really reclaimed some of the old glory. But some stuff like this just feels like they've got too many people quarterbacking and, as a result, they make some questionable calls. This feels like one of them.

As I said, I haven't played the thing yet, but I already hate it. Martin needs to condense its product line and focus of quality. Looks like regression to me.