Anyone want to try the K&K Double Helix Solo magnetic sound hole pickup?

[Methos1979]

I recently sold off my wonderful Martin custom D-1 in which I used the equally wonderful K&K Double Helix Solo sound hole magnetic pickup system. I kept the pickup but I have no immediate use for it. I just recently loaned it out to a forum member so he could try it out and then he sent it back.

I thought this might be a neat thing to keep going. Here's the way it would work: If you want to give this pickup a try, you let me know via PM where you live. I ship it out to you and you try it out for a few days or a week and then you ship it back to me with payment for my shipping inside the box or remit via PayPal.

If there were multiple people that wanted to try it out then I'd instruct the current tester to send it to the next closest one on my list to minimize the shipping costs. Since it's small it doesn't cost a ton to ship anyway, usually under $10. If it goes to multiple people then I'd waive the initial shipping cost. Win-win.

The pickup has an external cable to you can run it out of your sound hole for testing purposes. What do you think? Any takers?

[jricc]

Very cool thing for u to do Scott! Thanks for offering to the AGF community.
IMO, the K&K Double Helix is an excellent sounding pickup!

[jontewright]

Great idea and really generous of you. Unfortunately, well in this instance anyway, I live in England otherwise I’d have been in!

[meb]

PM sent....I am/was looking for one to try.

[dogdog49]

PM sent - thank you!

[Methos1979]

Originally Posted by dogdog49

PM sent - thank you!

I have not received a PM from you. Try again.

[AnneS]

Message sent—please let me know if you don’t see it.

Thanks!

Anne

[dogdog49]

Originally Posted by Methos1979

I have not received a PM from you. Try again.

Sent a second PM. Let me know if you got it. Thanks!

[meb]

I spent the last couple of days with the DHS using multiple Goodalls
and have other pickups on hand for comparison....a Sunrise, BlackStack and
a Black Angel. Most observations were done with a Red-Eye Twin or
sunnaudio Stage DI.

SOUND
I tweaked pole pieces to a reasonable level but probably could be more precise
with more time.

The Black Angel (BA) is my third fav SH pu. The DHS was a little more
subdued in presentation. The BA was a tad brighter with more body to
the tone. At times I thought the DHS was somewhat metallic in sound,
but I could usually dial that out. All in all, I prefer the BA and always
find it easy to get good sound with.

The BlackStack & Sunrise are clearly more full-bodied and dynamic than
either the BA or DHS.

ERGONOMICS
I liked the small footprint of the DHS but was disappointed that to
install it, you clip it internally via via a metal jack. The Sunrise is like this,
and I despise all that extra stuff in my guitar. Also, when running out
of the soundhole, that metal pin is exposed to hitting your guitar.

There was a HUGE difference in the volume of the Gloss and Steam settings.
You will probably need to adjust your volume if you do that in a live
situation.

DUAL SOURCE
I have a Pure mini in my Mahogany OM. I ran the PM thru the Pure Preamp
and the DHS thru the Stage. It sounded fine, but there was not as much
difference in the Dual Source vs the Pure Mini alone as I expected.
I also dual sourced the BA with the PM with similar good sounding
results, but not a huge difference BA alone, vs PM alone vs dual.

In summary, I think the DHS can be setup to work fine in many
situations, but it is not a small footprint Sunrise killer for a third of the price.

It has been a fun project! Thanks to Scott methos1979 for doing
this. I hope this summary helps. I will ship it out this pm to the next
in line.

[MrErikJ]

Originally Posted by meb

The BlackStack & Sunrise are clearly more full-bodied and dynamic than
either the BA or DHS.

I haven't tried the DHS but that was my experience trying the Black Angel, Black Stack, and Sunrise. The BS and Sunrise were very similar and, through the Sunrise Buffer, very acoustic. The BA didn't impress me very much, though I didn't think it was bad, by any means. I like the warmth of the BS and Sunrise and think they really come alive with a good preamp, particularly the Sunrise buffer.

[Methos1979]

Great review, Michael - thanks! The pickup is on its way to the next person.

If anyone has an interest in trying this pickup out, please PM me.

[dogdog49]

I’ve had the pickup for a couple of weeks now and have installed and tested it in three very different instruments with three very different pickup systems. First up was my main guitar for years now, a Flammang Cedar and EIR concert model with a K&K as it’s only source. Number two is my Composite Acoustics GX Performer with the LR Baggs IMIX, iBeam/Element Dual Channel System. Last and not least was my 1989 Santa Cruz Custom D with the full Baggs Anthem which has easily become my favorite plug and play system since I had it installed last year.

I don’t have any other mag pickups at the moment, but I’ve tried a couple in the past which I’ve used in combination with the K&K hoping to get cleaner, punchier bass with a bit more brightness and better note separation in the trebles. I tried the original DiMarzio Angel which added a bit too much electric twang and then a Schertler Magnetico AG-6 with the dedicated S-Mic which was considerably better and more acoustic sounding with the mic dialed in about half way. I was only doing low volume, small acoustic gigs and house concerts in quiet environments at that time so feedback was never a concern. Probably could have used an external mic with no problems but I wanted all the gear in the guitar for ease, mobility, etc. I eventually sold both the mags because although they added some presence and clarity to my ear my audience didn’t care and my own enjoyment of the solo K&K was close enough that I didn’t want to deal with the hassle of a dual source system.

I remained interested with the possibilities however and was intrigued by the demos of the Helix on K&K’s website, particularly with the variety of tonal possibilities of the gloss and steam settings, so I was excited to participate in Scott’s offer to test and review the system. All of the listening took place at close range through my small but extremely accurate Elite Acoustics A1BR8 amp.

OK, let’s get to it! Before I go into the individual guitar comparisons let me say that I significantly and immediately preferred the Gloss setting in every case. I play soft and intimate fingerstyle almost exclusively and don’t need to “stand out in the mix”, and the Steam setting sounded quite brittle and electronic. So much so that I didn’t spend much time with it and all further comments will refer to the Gloss setting only. In the Flammang with the K&K, though it didn’t exactly sound like “my guitar only louder”, it was closer to the K&K in warmth and acoustic accuracy than any of the other mags I’ve tried. If I had to choose between the Helix and K&K and couldn’t combine them I would have a very hard time doing so only because of the K&K’s invisibility and ease of use factor. On sound alone I felt nothing was lost when switching over to the Helix at a significant gain in presence, clarity and balance in all registers. Less fiddling with EQ to dial in a sound I liked and the bonus of playing far better with my Align reverb pedal which I’d felt had a beautiful tone but muddied up the sound a bit. Not with the Helix – crystal clear shimmering reverb just like I’ve always wanted. I tried mixing the two pickups together at many different levels into channels 1 and 2 of the amp hoping for the best of both worlds. But surprisingly although maybe it added a little something I enjoyed on certain tunes, it was never enough to want to deal with the extra hassle.

With the IMIX/IBeam in the CA guitar it was much closer. The IMIX/IBeam is a terrific and underrated pickup IMO and this system and the Helix sounded most like one another. In fact I can dial in so many varieties of tones with the side mounted preamp on the IMIX that I was able to find settings where my wife (who is a classical musician) couldn’t tell the two systems apart in a blind test. They were so similar that I couldn't see any reason to experiment with combining them

The Santa Cruz / Anthem has the best amplified tone of any guitar I’ve ever owned or played. Clean, clear full tone, punchy articulate bass and sweet, soaring trebles. Because of the location of the Anthem controls on the side of the soundhole I had to install the Helix at a pretty extreme angle to the point where only the middle four pole pieces were reasonably aligned with the strings. Despite this I could instantly tell from those middle strings that I clearly preferred the Anthem’s tone to anything I could get out of the Helix. All of the Helix’s advantages in clarity and note separation were gone and what it lacked in true acoustic tonality that didn’t show up so much in the other two tests was revealed.

So, would I buy or recommend the Helix? Definitely yes, but probably not as a permanently installed system unless I played out in louder settings or in a group as I think the Anthem is a better option. But the Gloss setting is by far the best sound I’ve ever gotten from a mag pickup for the style of music I play. It’s very close to great in my opinion and to have something this good that you can move from guitar to guitar as needed might be a perfect option for a lot of people. I’m not bothered by the cable hanging out of the soundhole or the other ergonomic considerations Michael mentioned in his review, though I would put a bit of tape around the metal connector so as not to scratch the side of the guitar.

One final note. Shortly after the Helix arrived I received the newest version of the CLOUDVOCAL Isolo Choice wireless mic pickup system. I’ve just today begun to experiment, but the results so far are astounding. The sound I’m getting with it out of the Flammang mixed with its K&K SBT is as or more accurate and much more three dimensional than the Anthem, though not quite as plug and play. I’m adding this here only because I recommended the Helix as the best easily moveable system I’d yet heard, and at least my first impressions are that the Isolo is far superior. The caveat is that the Helix is really, really good and if the Isolo is the only pickup in your guitar and your not mixing it with anything else it can start to feed back and sound a bit boomy at high volumes. Nothing is perfect, **** it!

[jricc]

Im enjoying reading everyone's take on this nice sounding pickup.

[Groberts]

Originally Posted by dogdog49

I’ve had the pickup for a couple of weeks now and have installed and tested it in three very different instruments with three very different pickup systems. First up was my main guitar for years now, a Flammang Cedar and EIR concert model with a K&K as it’s only source. Number two is my Composite Acoustics GX Performer with the LR Baggs IMIX, iBeam/Element Dual Channel System. Last and not least was my 1989 Santa Cruz Custom D with the full Baggs Anthem which has easily become my favorite plug and play system since I had it installed last year.

I don’t have any other mag pickups at the moment, but I’ve tried a couple in the past which I’ve used in combination with the K&K hoping to get cleaner, punchier bass with a bit more brightness and better note separation in the trebles. I tried the original DiMarzio Angel which added a bit too much electric twang and the a Schertler Magnetico AG-6 with the dedicated S-Mic which was considerably better and more acoustic sounding with the mic dialed in about half way. I was only doing low volume, small acoustic gigs and house concerts in quiet environments at that time so feedback was never a concern. Probably could have used an external mic with no problems but I wanted all the gear in the guitar for ease, mobility, etc. I eventually sold both the mags because although they added some presence and clarity to my ear my audience didn’t care and my own enjoyment of the solo K&K was close enough that I didn’t want to deal with the hassle of a dual source system.

I remained interested with the possibilities however and was intrigued by the demos of the Helix on K&K’s website, particularly with the variety of tonal possibilities of the gloss and steam settings, so I was excited to participate in Scott’s offer to test and review the system. All of the listening took place at close range through my small but extremely accurate Elite Acoustics A1BR8 amp.

OK, let’s get to it! Before I go into the individual guitar comparisons let me say that I significantly and immediately preferred the Gloss setting in every case. I play soft and intimate fingerstyle almost exclusively and don’t need to “stand out in the mix”, and the Steam setting sounded quite brittle and electronic. So much so that I didn’t spend much time with it and all further comments will refer to the Gloss setting only. In the Flammang with the K&K, though it didn’t exactly sound like “my guitar only louder”, it was closer to the K&K in warmth and acoustic accuracy than any of the other mags I’ve tried. If I had to choose between the Helix and K&K and couldn’t combine them I would have a very hard time doing so only because of the K&K’s invisibility and ease of use factor. On sound alone I felt nothing was lost when switching over to the Helix at a significant gain in presence, clarity and balance in all registers. Less fiddling with EQ to dial in a sound I liked and the bonus of playing far better with my Align reverb pedal which I’d felt had a beautiful tone but muddied up the sound a bit. Not with the Helix – crystal clear shimmering reverb just like I’ve always wanted. I tried mixing the two pickups together at many different levels into channels 1 and 2 of the amp hoping for the best of both worlds. But surprisingly although maybe it added a little something I enjoyed on certain tunes, it was never enough to want to deal with the extra hassle.

With the IMIX/IBeam in the CA guitar it was much closer. The IMIX/IBeam is a terrific and underrated pickup IMO and this system and the Helix sounded most like one another. In fact I can dial in so many varieties of tones with the side mounted preamp on the IMIX that I was able to find settings where my wife (who is a classical musician) couldn’t tell the two systems apart in a blind test. They were so similar that I couldn't see any reason to experiment with combining them

The Santa Cruz / Anthem has the best amplified tone of any guitar I’ve ever owned or played. Clean, clear full tone, punchy articulate bass and sweet, soaring trebles. Because of the location of the Anthem controls on the side of the soundhole I had to install the Helix at a pretty extreme angle to the point where only the middle four pole pieces were reasonably aligned with the strings. Despite this I could instantly tell from those middle strings that I clearly preferred the Anthem’s tone to anything I could get out of the Helix. All of the Helix’s advantages in clarity and note separation were gone and what it lacked in true acoustic tonality that didn’t show up so much in the other two tests was revealed.

So, would I buy or recommend the Helix? Definitely yes, but probably not as a permanently installed system unless I played out in louder settings or in a group as I think the Anthem is a better option. But the Gloss setting is by far the best sound I’ve ever gotten from a mag pickup for the style of music I play. It’s very close to great in my opinion and to have something this good that you can move from guitar to guitar as needed might be a perfect option for a lot of people. I’m not bothered by the cable hanging out of the soundhole or the other ergonomic considerations Michael mentioned in his review, though I would put a bit of tape around the metal connector so as not to scratch the side of the guitar.

One final note. Shortly after the Helix arrived I received the newest version of the CLOUDVOCAL Isolo Choice wireless mic pickup system. I’ve just today begun to experiment, but the results so far are astounding. The sound I’m getting with it out of the Flammang mixed with its K&K SBT is as or more accurate and much more three dimensional than the Anthem, though not quite as plug and play. I’m adding this here only because I recommended the Helix as the best easily moveable system I’d yet heard, and at least my first impressions are that the Isolo is far superior. The caveat is that the Helix is really, really good and if the Isolo is the only pickup in your guitar and your not mixing it with anything else it can start to feed back and sound a bit boomy at high volumes. Nothing is perfect, **** it!

Awesome review. I was particularly interested in your comparison of the Helix to your Anthem equipped Santa Cruz D. Why? I have a Martin Outlaw 17 with a K&K that is just too much work to get anywhere close to the quality of tone I get from my Anthem equipped D-18's and HD28 cutaway. So after all this time, I may just take the plunge and put an Anthem in the Martin Outlaw 17. I have Anthems in several guitars and it always sounds better than anything else I've ever tried.

[dogdog49]

Thanks Groberts, and I'm with you on the Anthem. I was a K&K lover for years but the Anthem is just so much better to my ears. I can't think of a singe thing about the K& K's sound that I prefer. I know some folks say they hear a difference in the unamplified tone of their instrument after installation, but I know the tone of that Santa Cruz inside and out and I couldn't detect a change. I'd love to see somebody do a true, double-blind AB test with a full panel of listeners to maybe settle that score, but I realize it would be tricky to set up.

But geez, the K&K - Isolo mix was so thrillingly three dimensional and room filling. The word that keeps coming up is that it sounded "alive" in a way that no other pickup I've owned (including the Anthem although it's the closest) can replicate. I certainly wouldn't change out the Anthem for it because it's so freaking good and so convenient, but I think I'm going to love having the Isolo around for use with my other guitars. One other note is that I have two other guitars that have the K&K Trinity Pro dual channel system with the Silver Bullet mic which does add quite a bit to the basic K&K sound (though I still prefer the Anthem). I didn't try the Helix in those instruments but the the Isolo - K&K combo sounds significantly more lifelike than the Trinity system in my opinion.