anyone ever not like the sound of their custom?

[buddiesorg]

So far I've been very pleased with guitars I've ordered ... but then, I usually start with one of the luthier's guitars and talk about how I'd like the sound to change. He then tells me whether or not it's possible and what woods he'd use.

[Fliss]

I wouldn't go so far as to say I don't like the tone of it, but my custom Manson parlour isn't my favourite in terms of tone. Andy and I did have a discussion about tone, but being honest, I commissioned the guitar almost on impulse when I realised I had enough spare savings to enable me to do it, and I didn't take enough time to be clear about what I really wanted from the guitar other than that I wanted an example of Andy's artistry. Lesson learned - if I was doing it again, I would take more time and make sure I knew exactly what I wanted from the guitar first.

However, it is a lovely guitar; it's just that the tone is much crisper and brighter than my other guitars, and it's much better for fingerstyle than strumming, and it's especially good in DADGAD, so I think it will reward me more as my technique improves for that kind of playing.

Fliss

[Brent Hutto]

I agree completely with one experienced dealer in fine guitars who told me the guys most consistently satisfied with commissioning a custom guitar already have one or more guitars they are happy with and who commision the custom one as a way of getting something unique and different.

It is less of a sure thing if you go into it expecting to have one built that is "just like" some other guitar or if you want the custom to be your first or only good instrument.

I think that makes sense, the more you go into it open to a sense of discovery and adventure, the more likely you will be to experience exactly that. If you want to match some highly specific criteria and are going to be looking for reasons to nitpick the custom guitar because it's different than exactly waht you were looking for, you'd be much safer shopping for a guitar you can try before you buy.

If and when I ever go through the process, it would be to give the builder a sense of how I play and what I like and then basically stand back and be prepared to experience whatever he comes up with. Basically, get to know him and then ask him to build me something nice. I think if you can afford a fairly expensive adventure like that it would be a wonderful journey. But just to get a guitar of a certain type to play it's easier, cheaper, quicker when you can find one sitting with a price tag on it and know what you're getting.

[PWoolson]

Originally Posted by rick-slo

Speaking about communication from the buyer as to what he is looking for in tone, sustain, etc, if you as the builder have never built a guitar with those particular set of attributes how do you know you can even do it? Have you ever turned a buyer away because you did not think you could build what he wanted?

I've turned clients away several times. One guy wanted me to build him a D28, EXACTLY. I asked why he didn't just go buy a D28. "Because I want a custom". I think the bottom line there was that he wanted to tell his friends that he had a custom built guitar.
There have also been jobs that I've turned away simply because the project didn't interest me. I've learned to listen to my gut when it says "walk away". It's a pretty painful experience to have to work on something that does nothing for me. So it's easier to just say no from the start.

[jperryrocks]

I was in love with Koa back in the 90s & that's all I could think about. Nothing would stop me from getting one.

I was lucky enough to live in the same town as my luthier and even had the experience of hand selected the stunning flamed wood for my own guitar.

I bonded and enjoyed my Gibson gospel dread more. I paid 1/5 the price for it & pulled off the shelf. Multi ply laminated plain mahogany & all.

I don't blame the luthier. I picked a guitar with a different shape and wood that looked pretty. It didn't add up to the ultimate guitar I had dreamed of.

I would probably appreciate that guitar today more than when I ordered it. I've matured and have a more laid back finger style approach and don't need the booming dread volume anymore.

[Brackett Instruments]

Originally Posted by rick-slo

Speaking about communication from the buyer as to what he is looking for in tone, sustain, etc, if you as the builder have never built a guitar with those particular set of attributes how do you know you can even do it? Have you ever turned a buyer away because you did not think you could build what he wanted?

Yep, there's alot of great builders. I have no problem sending someone to another builder if they want something I don't do. Like others have said, communication is the key.

Originally Posted by itscowfun

.................................................. ................
luthier's has anyone ever come to your shop personally to commission a build/ talk to you about the sound they want, and presented you with a close example (such as an actual guitar they brought or a good quality recording), played it for you, and said something like "i want it to sound like that but with a little more bass" ?
.................................................. .................................................. ..

Most of my clients are local. A bunch of my commissions have started that way.

Obvoiusly the difficult ones are "I want an all Mahogany 00 that sounds like a Brazilian Rosewood Dread"

[Tim McKnight]

Originally Posted by itscowfun

Ah, excellent insight, Tim. I smiled when you reiterated that you've never had to enact your refund policy (not that I questioned it

Thinking back my statement was not 100% correct. We did refund a customer's money once. The guitar arrived at their destination broken due to UPS damage. The options we offered were to build them another new guitar in the next batch or refund their money. They did not want to wait a few more months and opted for the refund which we complied with.

[Sage97]

Originally Posted by PWoolson

I find the main challenge to be communication. "I like a guitar that sounds kind of like a Taylor, with Martinesque qualities." Now I get the challenge of building that.
Well, if I'm ever stumped like that, I dig WAY deeper and really have lots of discussions as to what the client is really looking for. So far so good, but as Bruce said, I'd be suprised if at some point in my career I don't miss the mark. (likely because I misinterpreted what they were looking for)

When Paul made mine, he had tons and I mean tons of questions. And just like Larry's experience with Traugott, my Woolson came a little tight (double adi top) but sounded good. Paul indicated this from the get go. Now, it rocks and the voice is still getting better.

Same experience with two other luthiers including a new one currently working on my build.

Now I've had a custom built that did not speak to me. It was built for someone else and I got it used unplayed. It was a great guitar but not exactly what I was looking for.

My opinion is that good communication pre and during construction most often produces lifers.

[stuartb]

Originally Posted by Chazmo

I've never held onto a guitar that I thought was tight. I have little faith that these instruments can change and I've never experienced it first-hand. I'll try every string type on the planet before giving up, but waiting out the instrument just isn't in my makeup. I know I have a brass player's mentality. Parts of trumpets will wear out and get leaky over the years, but the sound doesn't change and you look at things as "fixable" not as improving with age.

I wasn't sure about the whole opening up concept until this year. A recent experience provides a story to tell.

Fifth guitar, second custom. I received my Franklin, built by Nick Kukich December last. Braz/Adi. Move ahead in time. I was absolutely shocked at how much this guitar evolved tonally over the five months that followed. I would not have thought it possible for a guitar to change so dramatically. Some people use the phrase "opened up". How does anyone describe tone. I just know I was very impressed with the final result. Another owner had the same experience with a Franklin. That was the first time I have experienced a significant change in how a guitar sounds, however.

Another custom that I purchased was mature out of the box, but that builder had a reputation for playing his guitars for a few months before shipping. No question it came mature. But the Franklin changed enormounsly. Kudos to Nick for producing such a fine guitar.

I have five guitars and love them all. I find you sometimes need to find the perfect songs, keys, cappo vs non-cappo, to bring out the best in a particular guitar. Additionally, one guitar will allow you to hear another guitar from a different perspective. They are all different, like the unique tidbits on a thanksgiving day dinner. How do you choose a favourite between stuffing and cranberry sauce. They all work together so well.

My collings 000 may not be a match for my two custom guitars tonally, but you cappo that baby up by the fourth fret, and play a few songs. Few guitars play that well cappoed. Remarkable guitar.

I do think you need to play a few guitars made by the builder you are interested in before commissioning a guitar. This may be a challenge, but it's one that should be met. While some modifications can alter final total qualities in favour of what the purchaser is looking for in a guitar, most builders have a signiture sound and you either like it or you don't. That's a great starting point.

Stuart

[buddiesorg]

Originally Posted by PWoolson

... There have also been jobs that I've turned away simply because the project didn't interest me. I've learned to listen to my gut when it says "walk away". It's a pretty painful experience to have to work on something that does nothing for me. So it's easier to just say no from the start.

That's another thing I've learned. If I sense that a luthier isn't interested in a project, I drop it ... I'd actually like him to be excited about it. I'm still trying to find someone to do an all-Koa, but I've kind of gone in another direction, so I'm not actively looking right now.

[ncognito1]

This is a facsinating topic. It's looking like I will have the opportunity to have someone build a guitar for me so the advice and experiences already relayed have been very helpful.

Given that tone is difficult to describe, what about sound clips? I've been listening to some, and have picked out a few that really caught my ear. Does it make sense to forward these to the builder?

DAVE

[cpabolting]

Nope.... I love what I have! Communication is everything in having a guitar built.

[Larry Pattis]

Originally Posted by ncognito1

Given that tone is difficult to describe, what about sound clips? I've been listening to some, and have picked out a few that really caught my ear. Does it make sense to forward these to the builder?

DAVE

No.

Your builder should be the one that has caught your ear.

[Howard Klepper]

Originally Posted by Fliss

I wouldn't go so far as to say I don't like the tone of it, but my custom Manson parlour isn't my favourite in terms of tone. Andy and I did have a discussion about tone, but being honest, I commissioned the guitar almost on impulse when I realised I had enough spare savings to enable me to do it, and I didn't take enough time to be clear about what I really wanted from the guitar other than that I wanted an example of Andy's artistry. Lesson learned - if I was doing it again, I would take more time and make sure I knew exactly what I wanted from the guitar first.

However, it is a lovely guitar; it's just that the tone is much crisper and brighter than my other guitars, and it's much better for fingerstyle than strumming, and it's especially good in DADGAD, so I think it will reward me more as my technique improves for that kind of playing.

Fliss

Is that the yew?

[FPicker]

Re: "anyone ever not like the sound of their custom? "..

I love my OM, I own it because the person who it was built for never bonded with it, from the get go. He owned it for nearly 25 years, but rarely played it the whole time. Turns out he prefers bigger guitars. To each their own.

That guitar replaced another one built by the same luthier for him, which had been stolen. He didn't like that one either.

(In case you're wondering, he tried, and then tried again with the same luthier because he'd so loved the sound of another guitar that luthier had built, which motivated his order in the first place).

I guess he learned his lesson, because during the time I was negotiating with him about the sale of his OM, he had received another guitar, from a different luthier, that he decided just didn't work. The luthier tried several iterations, shaving some braces, or whatever, but it did not pass this guy's muster, and he wound up putting it back to the luthier. BTW this guy may seem hard to please, and maybe he is, but he has also owned and liked many guitars, I believe.

I know a different fellow who offered up to sell his custom as part of some benefit. One-on-one he afterwards he told me he simply didn't like the guitar, the benefit seemed a good way to get rid of it without having to admit he didn't like it. He felt too embarrassed/ intimidated/ sorry for the luthier to turn it back to the luthier after it was completed, or possibly he was concerned about repercussions since they were part of the same social group. But he never liked it.

Originally Posted by stuartb

My collings 000 may not be a match for my two custom guitars tonally, but you cappo that baby up by the fourth fret, and play a few songs. Few guitars play that well cappoed.
Stuart

I thought this was very interesting, because one of the things I cared for least about my Collings D2H was the way it took to a capo. I thought it sounded horrible capoed, weak and shrill, stripped of all complexity. Of course that was a completely different model.