Pickup for Loud Band

[pjrvmg]

I have a Martin D28 that I want to amplify to use with a loud rock band. If I had a more inexpensive instrument for this application believe me I would use it, but this is my only acoustic guitar.

From my research it looks like an undersaddle pickup will give me the most volume before feedback. However, I read that undersaddle pickups will affect the unplugged tone and response of the instrument, which is a dealbreaker.

Right now I am leaning towards the K&K Pure mini + Double Helix system. However, part of me thinks having Bob Colosi fabricate a bone saddle to mount on an LR Baggs LB6 would be doable too.

Does anyone have experience with one or both of these pickup systems? Or do you have another one not mentioned that you have had success with?

Thanks!

[tadol]

There are more than a few ways to kill feedback, but if you’re planning to play with a loud band (as I do) a “refined” acoustic tone is rarely noticable. So, I choose pickups and external equipment to satisfy my desire for a great sound, while also making sure I can be heard when the electric guitar and bass start cranking it up without my acoustic going into a massive feedback loop.

To that end, I found the K&K did a pretty good job initially, but as things cranked up, I had to deal with more feedback issues. Then, after getting and loving the Tonedexter, I tried James Mays’ UltraTonic pickup. It’s now my favorite, providing great tone and detail without needing any external processing, and no batteries, no feedback, and no loss of tone even when I have the volume control turned down - where the evening usually starts -

Check his website, listen to the samples - its pretty great. I’ve tried to do some sample recordings showing the natural, un-amplified tone of the guitar, then cranking it up to near ear-bleed level to show the tone and no-feedback even facing the amp, but all my recording capability fails to capture the difference in volume - things get “automatically adjusted” and it all gets lost and sounds terrible. But I very highly recommend looking at this pickup - especially if high volume is important with the band, and great amplified tone is important playing solo -

[Goat Mick]

For a loud band situation I’d stick a Baggs M1 in the soundhole and be done with it. That what I use for high volume gigs and I’m impressed with the tone. You can do better for solo singer/songwriter stuff but in a loud band it sounds great and is pretty much bulletproof.

[rmp]

K&K is going to be really prone to feedback IME.

Just to offer a different train of thought here....

If you don't want to touch your Martin, I can understand being reluctant, why not see what kind of second hand pickup equipped acoustic guitars are available in the budget range to match what you'll wind up spending to buy/install one in your D28?

Epi Master Built? Taylor 200 series, Yamaha, Washburn, Guild, etc

They aren't going to MATCH your martin, of course not..., but keeping that as is may be a good idea for ya too.

And you wont be worrying about any kind of damage done while on stage as this is where most of the "Ah CRAPS!" seem to happen anyway.

I have a 78 Alvarez yari Dy74 that I would be using for this, The $4k taylors and gibbies stay home for the bar rom gigs..

The Yari has lots of stories to tell, it is by no means mint.. but it is in really good shape, plays real good and sounds as good plugged in as anything. And I don't worry much of something smacks it during a gig.


Also, There are sound hole covers (feedback buster) but those can be tricky to get set in right with controls inside the sound hole (one must modify the feed back buster to accommodate) if you get a "Stage axe" with the electronics mounted on the side bout,.. problem solved.

Hey, maybe not the answer you were looking for but perhaps something to think about...

[jricc]

Originally Posted by Goat Mick

For a loud band situation I’d stick a Baggs M1 in the soundhole and be done with it. That what I use for high volume gigs and I’m impressed with the tone. You can do better for solo singer/songwriter stuff but in a loud band it sounds great and is pretty much bulletproof.

I have to agree with Goat Mick. I'm using the M1A for loud gigs too...Zero feedback.
Good luck in your search

[varmonter]

Mag pup for sure. I use the sunrise.
But the baggs stuff mentioned above
Is a good choice.piezo pups sense body
Vibration and are easily prone to feedback.
They will also sense the bass and electric
Guitar and drum once they all start crankin
And vibrating your guitar top as well.
So your signal may sound confused.
Mag pups sense the strings .. I use monel.
Greatly reducing feedback potential..

[GuildF20Guy]

I agree with all the mag pickup suggestions. I would like to add that using one with the addition of mild compression and eq will make it sound very convincingly “acoustic” in a loud mix.

[pjrvmg]

This is all great, I really appreciate all the responses. I'm going to look further into the Ultra Tonic transducer and the Double Helix magnetic. Thanks so much!

[SpruceTop]

Originally Posted by pjrvmg

I have a Martin D28 that I want to amplify to use with a loud rock band. If I had a more inexpensive instrument for this application believe me I would use it, but this is my only acoustic guitar.

From my research it looks like an undersaddle pickup will give me the most volume before feedback. However, I read that undersaddle pickups will affect the unplugged tone and response of the instrument, which is a dealbreaker.

Right now I am leaning towards the K&K Pure mini + Double Helix system. However, part of me thinks having Bob Colosi fabricate a bone saddle to mount on an LR Baggs LB6 would be doable too.

Does anyone have experience with one or both of these pickup systems? Or do you have another one not mentioned that you have had success with?

Thanks!

Maybe, leave your Martin D-28 at home, and buy a Korean-made Ovation with either the Op Pro or Op Pro Studio Preamp? Likely, you won't but it may well be a $500 to $800 solution to your rock-band concern and you'll preserve your Martin.

[varmonter]

Originally Posted by GuildF20Guy

I agree with all the mag pickup suggestions. I would like to add that using one with the addition of mild compression and eq will make it sound very convincingly “acoustic” in a loud mix.

Yes ..a bit of comp is great!!

[Methos1979]

Another in agreement that a mag sh pup is the way to go. Since you indicate for a loud band, you don't really need to worry about great acoustic tone which is bane of most mag sh pups anyway. That said there are many to choose from. Sunrise is supposedly the best although I have no personal experience. I know they are expensive, large and heavy and sound best with their external preamp which is also pricey. I've used the M80, AG6 (plus mic) and the Black Angel and all were relatively decent.

I ended up with the K&K Double Helix Solo as it's passive and has a tone switch for switching between strumming and fingerstyle which I really like. It's made to be coupled with another pickup but I opted to just go with the solo as it's good enough for what I need and I didn't want to mess with a dual/stereo output and the need to split the signal and EQ separately. But for those looking to really get great tone I've listened to some demos that were quite good.

[martingitdave]

I would go with a magnetic pickup or a Fishman Matrix with an Aura pedal. Most louder bands I know go with that combination.