The Acoustic Guitar Forum

Go Back   The Acoustic Guitar Forum > General Acoustic Guitar and Amplification Discussion > Custom Shop

Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #1  
Old 06-21-2021, 08:43 AM
Jamiejoon Jamiejoon is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Bay Area, CA
Posts: 730
Default New Interesting Guitar-Like Instrument Day

Hi everyone,
I just received a new custom ronroco from David Dart. Though most people don't know what a ronroco is, I thought at least some of the luthiers might be interested, and perhaps the ukulele freaks as well. If the moderators think this would be better placed elsewhere, I am cool with that.

A ronroco is a South American instrument that is the big brother to the charango. It has five courses of paired strings, tuned in this case in the Argentinian style: DGBEB. The strings descend in an unconventional manner: 1-4-2-5-3, with the exception that one of the "3" strings is the same as the "1" strings. That is, one of the "3"s is one octave lower than the other. This is the same as a charango.

You can find more information on ronrocos at this blog put together by a mysterious and generous fellow named Don Berglund:
https://ronrocoreview.wordpress.com/

I have always found charangos awkward to play, partly because they are tiny and partly because they have a rounded back - so they tend to slip off my lap. Also, like smaller ukuleles, they sound a little like a toy to me and not a full-grown instrument. I thought a modified ronroco could solve all of these problems - give it a little longer scale, a little wider neck, and a baritone ukulele body, and voila you might get a more playable and better instrument.

David Dart has been building up in Navarro, Mendocino, CA for over 50 years. He has made 50 different kinds of instruments, including lap steel guitars, mandolins, guitars, lutes, ukuleles, etc. My ronroco is instrument #280. He has built instruments for David Lindley, Alex DeGrassi and many others. I own a 2014 cocobolo Dart D-12 that I think is excellent, and is detailed in a build thread by our own Diamond Dave. David (Dart) was game to try a ronroco, so we were off to the races.

I took a road trip to Navarro this weekend to pick up my completed ronroco, and I am extremely pleased with it. It is quite a bit better than any charango I have played, and I expect it to get a bunch better with play. It has a significant advantage of being built with really really fine materials. The top is a ridiculously nice set of sitka spruce from a blown-down tree on native land near Ketchikan, Alaska. Just perfect, exceptionally tight grain and excessive silking. The back is a very nice set of old cocobolo. Mahogany neck. 14 frets to the body. I have included a few pictures below in a follow-up post to this thread (if I can figure out how!).

BTW, while I was at David's place I got to see/play a number of other very interesting instruments. Most notable was a new Honduran rosewood D-12 that was spectacular, in my opinion quite a bit better than my already-excellent D-12. If I didn't have too many guitars already, I would have bought it. While I cannot judge the sound of mandolins, there was a truly gorgeous mandolin in redwood and cherry. Maybe the prettiest set of redwood I have ever seen, salvaged from an old sheep barn nearby. The cherry was local too, cut down by mischievous local kids. Also a beautiful lap steel guitar with a segmented back and beautiful hand-carved headstock and camatillo fretboard. Quite a work of art. Other neat stuff too, such as a beautiful parlor bass! David and his building partner Jeff were great hosts, generous with their time and enthusiastic about all things with strings.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 06-21-2021, 08:54 AM
Jamiejoon Jamiejoon is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Bay Area, CA
Posts: 730
Default

IMG_3055.jpg

IMG_3056.jpg

IMG_3057.jpg

IMG_3058.jpg
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 06-21-2021, 09:55 AM
David Eastwood's Avatar
David Eastwood David Eastwood is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 7,509
Default

What a cool instrument!

How big is it? It's not easy to get a sense of its size from the pictures.
__________________
Martin 0-16NY
Emerald Amicus
Emerald X20
Cordoba Stage

Some of my tunes: https://youtube.com/user/eatswodo
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 06-21-2021, 01:11 PM
Jamiejoon Jamiejoon is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Bay Area, CA
Posts: 730
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by David Eastwood View Post
What a cool instrument!

How big is it? It's not easy to get a sense of its size from the pictures.
Thanks for asking, David. The instrument has a 19" scale nut to saddle, 2 1/16" width at the nut, 10.5" width at lower bout, 7.5" upper bout, and 3 3'8" deep. Small instrument! I am already thinking about designing a larger one, with a Single 0 body and a longer scale...but that might stop sounding like a charango and might be more like a classical guitar.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 06-21-2021, 01:30 PM
David Eastwood's Avatar
David Eastwood David Eastwood is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 7,509
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jamiejoon View Post
Thanks for asking, David. The instrument has a 19" scale nut to saddle, 2 1/16" width at the nut, 10.5" width at lower bout, 7.5" upper bout, and 3 3'8" deep. Small instrument! I am already thinking about designing a larger one, with a Single 0 body and a longer scale...but that might stop sounding like a charango and might be more like a classical guitar.
Thank you - that is small, but beautifully proportioned
__________________
Martin 0-16NY
Emerald Amicus
Emerald X20
Cordoba Stage

Some of my tunes: https://youtube.com/user/eatswodo
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 06-21-2021, 03:18 PM
Rudy4 Rudy4 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 8,796
Default

Hi Jamie,
That's a lovely instrument, it looks like it will serve you well.

I just completed a 20" scale Ronroco (guitar shaped body) that I haven't strung up yet. I designed it to tune identically to Charango, but I'm most likely going to octave courses 3,4, and 5.

I communicated with Don Berglund via e-mail a few times when I was working on my overall design.

The history of the Ronroco is not easy to nail down, but it pre-dates the common "origin story" of the Hermosa connection by a few decades.

Last edited by Rudy4; 06-21-2021 at 04:40 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 06-21-2021, 04:56 PM
Jamiejoon Jamiejoon is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Bay Area, CA
Posts: 730
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rudy4 View Post
Hi Jamie,
That's a lovely instrument, it looks like it will serve you well.

I just completed a 20" scale Ronroco (guitar shaped body) that I haven't strung up yet. I designed it to tune identically to Charango, but I'm most likely going to octave courses 3,4, and 5.

I communicated with Don Berglund via e-mail a few times when I was working on my overall design.

The history of the Ronroco is not easy to nail down, but it pre-dates the common "origin story" of the Hermosa connection by a few decades.
Rudy, that is so cool! Ronroco lovers unite! My next one, if there is one, will have a longer scale for sure - 19" is still a little bit tight. I am almost 6'3", so I am still hunched over this little ronroco. Will you share pictures of yours when you string it up, and report on how it sounds/plays? I am glad to know Don Berglund corresponded with you, as his last blog post was 2015. I was hopinh he would keep posting discoveries, including ronroco tablature.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 06-21-2021, 05:05 PM
Steve Kinnaird's Avatar
Steve Kinnaird Steve Kinnaird is offline
AGF Sponsor
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Nacogdoches, TX
Posts: 3,601
Default

Jamie that is a beautiful little thing for sure.
Are these ever strung with steel strings?

Mathis
__________________
www.stephenkinnaird.com

Crafted in the Piney Woods
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 06-21-2021, 05:29 PM
Rudy4 Rudy4 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 8,796
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Kinnaird View Post
Jamie that is a beautiful little thing for sure.
Are these ever strung with steel strings?

Mathis
I'm hashing over stringing mine with steel strings, basing my strings on a commonly available 12 string set.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 06-21-2021, 05:38 PM
David Eastwood's Avatar
David Eastwood David Eastwood is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 7,509
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Kinnaird View Post
Jamie that is a beautiful little thing for sure.
Are these ever strung with steel strings?

Mathis
I’m about to take delivery of an Emerald Amicus - a short-scale (18”) 12-string carbon fiber instrument, strung with steel strings in unison pairs, and tuned D-D (like the 10th fret of an regular guitar). Larger body than the OP’s ronroco, but very similar proportions.

This thread has made me start thinking about alternatives beyond standard guitar-based open tunings.
__________________
Martin 0-16NY
Emerald Amicus
Emerald X20
Cordoba Stage

Some of my tunes: https://youtube.com/user/eatswodo
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 06-21-2021, 05:41 PM
Jamiejoon Jamiejoon is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Bay Area, CA
Posts: 730
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Kinnaird View Post
Jamie that is a beautiful little thing for sure.
Are these ever strung with steel strings?

Mathis
Thanks Mathis! Good to hear from you.
I have only ever seen charangos with nylon strings. Rudy sounds like he may know more than me.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 06-21-2021, 06:19 PM
Rudy4 Rudy4 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 8,796
Default

To those looking for a good way to judge size, see the Ronroco being played 47 seconds in here:

Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 06-21-2021, 06:29 PM
Rudy4 Rudy4 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 8,796
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by David Eastwood View Post
I’m about to take delivery of an Emerald Amicus - a short-scale (18”) 12-string carbon fiber instrument, strung with steel strings in unison pairs, and tuned D-D (like the 10th fret of an regular guitar). Larger body than the OP’s ronroco, but very similar proportions.

This thread has made me start thinking about alternatives beyond standard guitar-based open tunings.
There are a lot of "alternative" instruments out there when you begin looking for them. Your Emerald Amicus sounds very similar to the Veillette Avante Gryphon, a 18-1/8" 12 string guitar. These are fairly popular, enough to the point that they are manufactured as a "import" instrument.

http://www.veilletteguitars.com/avante_gryphon.shtml

I developed a "short scale mandola" that I played many band gigs with. I made that instrument because it matched my vocal range better than any other commercially available instrument.

That instrument, as well as the new Ronroco, are close enough to baritone ukulele size that I can use baritone uke cases. I learned a long time ago that it's not difficult to make odd-sized instruments, but the tougher part is finding a case to fit them!

Last edited by Rudy4; 06-21-2021 at 06:38 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 06-21-2021, 09:08 PM
Steve Kinnaird's Avatar
Steve Kinnaird Steve Kinnaird is offline
AGF Sponsor
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Nacogdoches, TX
Posts: 3,601
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rudy4 View Post
To those looking for a good way to judge size, see the Ronroco being played 47 seconds in here:

Great video! That was a lot of fun, thanks for sharing.

Steve
__________________
www.stephenkinnaird.com

Crafted in the Piney Woods
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 06-22-2021, 08:21 AM
David Eastwood's Avatar
David Eastwood David Eastwood is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 7,509
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rudy4 View Post
There are a lot of "alternative" instruments out there when you begin looking for them. Your Emerald Amicus sounds very similar to the Veillette Avante Gryphon, a 18-1/8" 12 string guitar. These are fairly popular, enough to the point that they are manufactured as a "import" instrument.
It was playing an import Gryphon a couple of years ago that set me thinking about adding an Amicus to my collection - they are indeed very similar in configuration.
__________________
Martin 0-16NY
Emerald Amicus
Emerald X20
Cordoba Stage

Some of my tunes: https://youtube.com/user/eatswodo
Reply With Quote
Reply

  The Acoustic Guitar Forum > General Acoustic Guitar and Amplification Discussion > Custom Shop

Thread Tools





All times are GMT -6. The time now is 05:04 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, The Acoustic Guitar Forum
vB Ad Management by =RedTyger=