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  #46  
Old 09-29-2019, 10:09 AM
Brent Hahn Brent Hahn is offline
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Originally Posted by Doug Young View Post
What do you do when someone comes in with a Martin with the built-in Aura preamp? I guess you could drill a hole in the guitar to get at the raw pickup? :-) Just kidding.
I'm pretty familiar with those.

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Honestly, I'd say you let the guitar player choose his stage signal chain and what signal he gives to the house, whether it's a simple PADI, or reverb pedal, a Helix, or a ToneDexter.
Yes, I do.

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If it's an open mic with no time, you just accept that 90% of the guitars are going to sound mediocre to bad no matter what gear they're using, just the nature of the situation.
That's the reality, and maybe I do have to accept it. But it doesn't mean I don't get to dig a little deeper to find out why a $400 miracle-cure disappoints its purchasers while making me and my colleagues come off as inept.

I do a good enough job of coming off as inept already.
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  #47  
Old 09-29-2019, 11:00 AM
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Doug Young Doug Young is offline
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Originally Posted by Brent Hahn View Post
I'm pretty familiar with those.


That's the reality, and maybe I do have to accept it. But it doesn't mean I don't get to dig a little deeper to find out why a $400 miracle-cure disappoints its purchasers while making me and my colleagues come off as inept.
Well, there are hundreds of pedals out there that people can use to get good or bad sounds... They all claim to be magical from the ads. Not sure you can know them all, tho I'm sure people would appreciate a sound guy with the expertise to teach people how to dial in their sound.

As far as ToneDexter, it sounds like you just need to encounter a few people who are using it successfully to make up for your bad experiences. They're out there. As I think someone else mentioned in one of these threads, one of the most impressive demonstrations I've seen lately was the CA Guitar Trio. They used to be a total quack-fest. With all three using ToneDexters, the sound was quite impressive, with the individual character of each guitar coming thru for nearly studio-quality tone.
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  #48  
Old 09-29-2019, 12:52 PM
midwinter midwinter is offline
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I certainly concur with these very sensible suggestions.
Thanks.

Most of my work is as a multi-instrumentalist, and so my pedalboard contains preamps/EQs/tuners for each (currently a Radial PZ-Deluxe and a PZ-Pre), which are then submixed via a compact mixer mounted on the board so I can just send one line out to FOH instead of 3.

My hope was that the TD would allow me to replace all of that with one pedal. And it's VERY close. But all of my instruments output a signal at different levels, so not being able to save the gain setting means I can't just use a preset for each instrument. And then there are songs where I have to switch instruments mid-song, and bending down to turn the knob is not ideal.

Saving gain settings for each preset and the ability to toggle up/down through presets would be an absolute game changer for me.
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  #49  
Old 09-29-2019, 01:40 PM
Petty1818 Petty1818 is offline
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Not that they lurk around here to tell us, but I wonder how many sound crews, both big- and small-time, pick off a DI feed from the guitar before it ever hits the Tonedexter. From the info I'm starting to gather, that would seem like a good idea. But I'm also betting it would introduce digital latency issues, which blending inside the Tonedexter doesn't.
Probably very few. I mean, why would they? I get it that some people like the tonedexter and others don’t but that goes for every piece of gear. If a deluxe reverb worked for every electric guitar player then there wouldn’t be a reason for other models or brands. The tonedexter is a cool piece of gear that probably takes a bit more experimentation than most players want.
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  #50  
Old 09-29-2019, 01:53 PM
Cellomangler Cellomangler is offline
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Originally Posted by varmonter View Post
You can load IRs into the stomp.even Tonedexter IRS.
My understanding is that Tonedexter IRs are proprietary. Have you actually been successful loading a Tonedexter IR into the Helix Stomp?
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  #51  
Old 09-29-2019, 06:24 PM
lppier lppier is offline
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Originally Posted by Doug Young View Post
With the full Anthem, if I recall, it's possible to replace the jack with a TRS jack to add a 2nd source without a 2nd jack. But the issue you run into is that the Tru-Mic goes in the same place as K&Ks. I'd suggest looking at the kinds of pickup systems people who play that style use. Among the Candyrat crowd, K&K+mic seems to be the norm, with some variations. Check out the video of Antoine Dufour someone posted recently demoing an internal mic, for example. If I recall, instead of a K&K he was using the DiMarzio SBT, but same idea.


I got a reply from James:
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Thanks for your questions. ToneDexter will train with a blended mic/piezo system with whatever blend combination you desire. The more mic, the more feedback issues you might have. We recommend dialing the mic back, but it is up to you. The WaveMap will transmit any and all of the percussiveness that the pickup system gives it.

The Anthem SL doesn’t work because it contains a compressor which is non linear process that interferes with training. The full SL does not have the compressor.
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  #52  
Old 09-29-2019, 07:59 PM
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My understanding is that Tonedexter IRs are proprietary. Have you actually been successful loading a Tonedexter IR into the Helix Stomp?
It is possible to capture an IR from any device...
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  #53  
Old 09-29-2019, 10:40 PM
Paultergeist Paultergeist is offline
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AudioSprockets has an extensive list of pickups that work/don't work, along with tips for some, on their site:

https://audiosprockets.com/support/

They say Anthem: yes, Anthem SL: no
Wow. Thank you so much for referencing that link. I did not know previously — BOTH of the pickups I have in my guitars (rather premium pickups to me) are somewhat incompatible with the TD (on the “work” but with caveats list). I would have been very dissatisfied if I had tried a TD with my current guitars. I am grateful that I saw this. Thanks again.
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  #54  
Old 09-30-2019, 07:11 PM
J Patrick J Patrick is offline
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I did find that the TD was a little light in the loafers going to a live sound setup...my fix is to not use the XLR out and run the 1/4 inch out of the TD into to a Radial DI...(a passive DI)..and then to the board....try it...you might be as surprised as I was...I bet an Active DI would make it that much bigger sounding...

Last edited by J Patrick; 09-30-2019 at 07:22 PM.
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  #55  
Old 09-30-2019, 09:44 PM
Gordon Currie Gordon Currie is offline
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Originally Posted by Doug Young View Post
As far as ToneDexter, it sounds like you just need to encounter a few people who are using it successfully to make up for your bad experiences. They're out there. As I think someone else mentioned in one of these threads, one of the most impressive demonstrations I've seen lately was the CA Guitar Trio. They used to be a total quack-fest. With all three using ToneDexters, the sound was quite impressive, with the individual character of each guitar coming thru for nearly studio-quality tone.
I think that was my post - so far that is the high water mark in live use of ToneDexter for me.
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  #56  
Old 10-01-2019, 05:58 AM
varmonter varmonter is offline
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Originally Posted by midwinter View Post
Thanks.

Most of my work is as a multi-instrumentalist, and so my pedalboard contains preamps/EQs/tuners for each (currently a Radial PZ-Deluxe and a PZ-Pre), which are then submixed via a compact mixer mounted on the board so I can just send one line out to FOH instead of 3.

My hope was that the TD would allow me to replace all of that with one pedal. And it's VERY close. But all of my instruments output a signal at different levels, so not being able to save the gain setting means I can't just use a preset for each instrument. And then there are songs where I have to switch instruments mid-song, and bending down to turn the knob is not ideal.

Saving gain settings for each preset and the ability to toggle up/down through presets would be an absolute game changer for me.
To answer the OP question. This is the reason I sold my TD. And bought the helix stomp. I would need 3 tonedexters to efficiently do just an acoustic sound.
Then to add comp delay and reverb pedals. I would be back to a pedalboard.
The helix solved this for me.
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  #57  
Old 10-01-2019, 06:07 AM
varmonter varmonter is offline
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Originally Posted by Cellomangler View Post
My understanding is that Tonedexter IRs are proprietary. Have you actually been successful loading a Tonedexter IR into the Helix Stomp?
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Originally Posted by Doug Young View Post
It is possible to capture an IR from any device...
I have not actually tried this as I've sold my td. And know of no one locally I could try it with. That being said IR files are cheap commercially. And tonedexters IRS are nothing magical except they are made from your guitar.
My guitar ir is a sound hole pup from a Martin d45. My mandolin ir is a Gibson f.
And my bass ir is some 17th century upright. Interestingly enough when I had my tonedexter I made the ir using my kk mini. But played thru the td live using the kk ir but a baggs m80 in my guitar . It sounded great. You can use a mag pup with the ir .you just can't generate the ir with a mag pup..
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  #58  
Old 10-01-2019, 08:05 AM
midwinter midwinter is offline
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To answer the OP question. This is the reason I sold my TD. And bought the helix stomp. I would need 3 tonedexters to efficiently do just an acoustic sound.
Then to add comp delay and reverb pedals. I would be back to a pedalboard.
The helix solved this for me.
I've considered a Helix (or some similar product—or even just using a QSC Touchmix) but I just don't relish the idea of needing to make a quick adjustment to something and having to page through a bunch of menus, so I opted for gear with knobs.

I still have my TD, though. But I have not used it in a long time.
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  #59  
Old 10-01-2019, 08:18 AM
varmonter varmonter is offline
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Originally Posted by midwinter View Post
I've considered a Helix (or some similar product—or even just using a QSC Touchmix) but I just don't relish the idea of needing to make a quick adjustment to something and having to page through a bunch of menus, so I opted for gear with knobs.

I still have my TD, though. But I have not used it in a long time.
Couldn't agree more. The touchmix and the helix are menu heavy. The touchmix more so than the helix. Now that I have
My presets squared away in the helix its
Not too bad. Oddly enough in the band I run the helix into a touchmix 16. I miss our old analog board where I could reach
Over and tweak the mid knob during a song. This digital technology has a ways to go sound wise and ease of use wise as well. No one seems to care about this loss in audio quality..But you can still buy a turntable so apparently there are some of us that appreciate the difference.
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  #60  
Old 10-01-2019, 11:05 AM
midwinter midwinter is offline
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I miss our old analog board where I could reach
Over and tweak the mid knob during a song.
Exactly. Depending on the venue, sometimes I'll need to tweak something on one of my Radial pres or adjust level on my submix board.
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