Schertler Roy

[lkingston]

I’m thinking that with the speaker stand at the lowest setting, on a slightly raised stage and with a mostly seated audience, that the dispersion in an average restaurant or listening room, that the dispersion should be pretty darned good. I haven’t played a crowded standing room bar in ages. I’m too old and no longer cute enough... That and at that height (4’7”), I should have no problem seeing and making sound adjustments on the top mounted mixer.

The obvious response to this would be why not spend less money and get a Fishman 330, RCF EVO JMIX8 or other small line array PA?

One answer is that more often than not there is a house PA, and what you really need is a great sounding mixer and monitor system, not a full PA. This would work far better in low stage monitor configuration. What I found with my Bose L1 Mark 2 was that it really needed about 8 feet of distance between me and it to sound right onstage, and that I rarely had that much space. Plus, the dispersion on small line arrays is so good that you can’t really isolate it from the mains to use as a monitor. Then you have all sorts of issues with phase in the room.

That, plus I really like the idea of a high end all analog mixer (aside from the reverb and secondary DSP) and the exceptionally high sound quality that I expect this to give me. I have played a lot with high quality external analog preamps and this has five of them built in. Class A amps run hot and are heavy, but my do they sound wonderful!

That plus I really like the one box approach and the more car trunk friendly shape. I don’t mind that it is heavy. I am more worried about the size, and this is pretty reasonably sized considering what you have.

I also really want something that can handle keyboard or acoustic bass gigs.

[lkingston]

One of the reasons I am so excited about the Roy is that I do a lot of thumb bass and want to use my Boss OC-3 to double the bass note an octave down. I can set this up on my existing amps (Bose S1, EAE D6-8) but the problem is that I can’t get the volume or bottom end I need at live volumes. The Roy will let me dedicate a channel to just bass and should have ample volume and bottom end to handle the simulated bass at live sound levels.

There is a bit of OC-3 and Schertler Roy being demoed at this link, but I wouldn’t do it the way he is showing. What I would do is put the bass on it’s own track with a little extra lows and no reverb or delay. I’d probably use channel 5 (the one with the “warm” low pass filter) for the OC-3 bass:

https://youtu.be/SgcjKIW52Yg

I can separate the OC-3 bass like this at practice levels with my D6-8, but 40 watts isn’t enough to get a driving bass at live sound levels. The S1 won’t handle the low octave of the OC-3 either. My Bose L1 Mark ii (with either the B1 or B2 subwoofer) handled the OC-3 bass levels just fine. The Roy should be able do this great!

[lkingston]

Well I got the Roy yesterday. I also got the K&M 26747 shelf. The shelf size is perfect. I have it on a short speaker stand and it is perfect except that I might have to find a heavier duty short speaker stand because of the weight of the Roy.

The Roy sounds fantastic. At low volumes it is very close to my Elite Acoustics D6-8 but there is just so much more headroom. The dispersion on the Schertler S4 stand is surprisingly good, at least in my practice room. It just sort of fills the room without seeming to come from a particular point.

Yes, the Roy is expensive and heavy as anything, but I will use the heck out of it. I can’t think of any local gig this one box wouldn’t be able to handle.

[lkingston]

A little more time with the Roy and...oh my god this thing sounds fantastic! I have no idea how good the dispersion will be at a gig with bodies milling around, but in my practice room it is just stunning!

[kramster]

I figured you would love it, best acoustic amp I ever had was the Schertler Unico.

[lkingston]

Here's what I am experiencing with the Roy so far:

If I barely turn it up before and sing and play guitar, it doesn't really sound like the Roy is even amplifying anything. It just sounds a little louder.

As I keep turning it up it keeps getting louder but unless I stick my ear close to the speaker, it doesn't sound like it is coming from a specific point source. It just sounds like it is getting louder in the room.

I have a Shertler AG-6 pickup with the S-mic installed. As I keep turning the Roy up, I have to back off the S-Mic to Zero in order to keep going. As I get louder, the sound gets louder but there is no distortion. In fact there is no change in the sound at all besides me having to turn off the guitar mic because of feedback.

I can get louder than I could with other systems before running into feedback and I wondered why. Then it occurred to me that I was not hearing any of the speaker and amp protecting limiting that I am used to. This is letting me go quite a bit louder without feeding back. I have been playing wirelessly on both the guitar and mic. I moved the mic and guitar around the room and it sounded well balanced everywhere. I still was not hearing the sound coming from any point source. It just filled the room.

The points that stick out to me with the Roy so far are the following:

1) The Roy sounds incredibly natural. At volumes where you can still hear the acoustic sound of your voice and instrument it is hard to tell where the acoustic sound ends and the amplified sound begins.

2) The Roy mounted angled up on the Schertler S4 stand just fills the room without appearing to come from a specific point source. This includes the highs from the vocal mic. At least that's how it is in my practice room.

3) The balance between frequencies stays remarkably the same from barely audible to ear splitting levels. There is none of the usual adding lows and highs at low volumes and subtracting them at higher volumes that most of us are used to. To me, the most surprising thing about this is how rich and full it sounds at barely audible levels.

4) There is no audible distortion or protective limiting when you turn it way up. The fact that the limiting isn't kicking in means that you can turn the amp up a lot more than you would expect.

5) The Roy doesn't seem to have any particular resonant peaks either. When you do get it up so loud that it needs back, it isn't feeding back at any particular frequency. Amazing really!

Part of this is probably related to the Shertler pickup and amp being well matched.

I am playing with a singer for a Christmas Eve service in a few days. I will use the Roy instead of their terrible sound system and will report back some time after that. Hopefully it will sound as good there as it does in my practice room.

[Woodstock School Of Music]

Originally Posted by lkingston

The points that stick out to me with the Roy so far are the following:

1) The Roy sounds incredibly natural. At volumes where you can still hear the acoustic sound of your voice and instrument it is hard to tell where the acoustic sound ends and the amplified sound begins.

2) The Roy mounted angled up on the Schertler S4 stand just fills the room without appearing to come from a specific point source. This includes the highs from the vocal mic. At least that's how it is in my practice room.

3) The balance between frequencies stays remarkably the same from barely audible to ear splitting levels. There is none of the usual adding lows and highs at low volumes and subtracting them at higher volumes that most of us are used to. To me, the most surprising thing about this is how rich and full it sounds at barely audible levels.

4) There is no audible distortion or protective limiting when you turn it way up. The fact that the limiting isn't kicking in means that you can turn the amp up a lot more than you would expect.

5) The Roy doesn't seem to have any particular resonant peaks either. When you do get it up so loud that it needs back, it isn't feeding back at any particular frequency. Amazing really!

Part of this is probably related to the Shertler pickup and amp being well matched.

I am playing with a singer for a Christmas Eve service in a few days. I will use the Roy instead of their terrible sound system and will report back some time after that. Hopefully it will sound as good there as it does in my practice room.

lkingston nice review.

My experiences have mirrored pretty much what you said and I'd like to add that I love that the EQ responds similar to any high end EQ I've used in the studio. When you move a knob just a little you can hear the results unlike everyday mixers.

I've also found that the amp will make good pickups sound great but can bring out the weakness in cheap pickups but that's the nature of hearing the full frequency spectrum and dynamic range of an amp like this.

I know you record and you probably know this but I thought I'd mention that you also have Class A channel strips at your disposal for recording. For example send a vocal mic through the Schertler and use the DI, turn down the speaker and you have a clean signal path as good as any dedicated high end channel strip that can cost almost as much as the amp.

I've had several conversations with Schertler and they're extremely passionate that the signal path be pure and the specs be true When they say 250 watts that's what you get and they don't play the shell game with specs. They don't do bluetooth or batteries because in their words it would compromise the sound.

Hope the service goes well, let us know how it went.

[lkingston]

I've done a lot of playing with a Tech 21 Q/Strip just so I could get a nice preamp and a decent EQ out of house PA systems so I know exactly what you mean. Yeah, on the Roy, the nice preamp and EQ is built in!

[lkingston]

Originally Posted by Woodstock School Of Music

lkingston nice review.

My experiences have mirrored pretty much what you said and I'd like to add that I love that the EQ responds similar to any high end EQ I've used in the studio. When you move a knob just a little you can hear the results unlike everyday mixers.

I've also found that the amp will make good pickups sound great but can bring out the weakness in cheap pickups but that's the nature of hearing the full frequency spectrum and dynamic range of an amp like this.

I know you record and you probably know this but I thought I'd mention that you also have Class A channel strips at your disposal for recording. For example send a vocal mic through the Schertler and use the DI, turn down the speaker and you have a clean signal path as good as any dedicated high end channel strip that can cost almost as much as the amp.

I've had several conversations with Schertler and they're extremely passionate that the signal path be pure and the specs be true When they say 250 watts that's what you get and they don't play the shell game with specs. They don't do bluetooth or batteries because in their words it would compromise the sound.

Hope the service goes well, let us know how it went.

It went well. Looking over the video, I should have turned off the reverb because the sanctuary had plenty of natural ambience. The Roy on the small S4 stand angle up a little filled the room nicely.

I don't have a feel yet for angling the amp up and ceilings. In a church sanctuary with super high angled ceilings it works well. I do video and photographer and it reminds me a little of bouncing light off a ceiling. Sometimes it works well, other times, not so much.

Does anyone have a set of rules of thumb as to when an amp angled up works well? I guess almost always for guitar but not as much for vocals.

[paulin]

I use a stand similar to the S4 for all occasions. It is adjustable and perhaps doesn't point up as high. I also attached a mini music stand for my Kindle reader.

[lkingston]

I like that angle better. With the Shertler S4, at that angle the back arm rests on the power switch so you can't do it. You have to angle it up more than I want.

[Stringmaster]

No factory pole mount on those?

[rockabilly69]

I would think the only reason Schertler doesn't recommend the pole mount is that you have to open the amp to mount it. With that, you could hurt the amp if you did something wrong. But the job is very straightforward. You have to open it up, because to do it right you need bolts with nuts, (instead of wood screws), and the bolts need to be tightened from the inside. Plus you also need to drill a hold in the bottom of the amp. So certain precautions need to be taken to keep the sawdust out of the acoustic blanket/baffling on the inside. But rest assured, if done right, you would never ever think of putting the Jam 400 or Roy on a table again. I've been using mine on a pole mount for 3 years and I LOVE it!!! The job is very straightforward, and doesn't take long, it just takes attention to what you are doing. I am putting the same pole mount of my Jam 200 too!!!

[Stringmaster]

Originally Posted by rockabilly69

I would think the only reason Schertler doesn't recommend the pole mount is that you have to open the amp to mount it. With that, you could hurt the amp if you did something wrong. But the job is very straightforward. You have to open it up, because to do it right you need bolts with nuts, (instead of wood screws), and the bolts need to be tightened from the inside. Plus you also need to drill a hold in the bottom of the amp. So certain precautions need to be taken to keep the sawdust out of the acoustic blanket/baffling on the inside. But rest assured, if done right, you would never ever think of putting the Jam 400 or Roy on a table again. I've been using mine on a pole mount for 3 years and I LOVE it!!! The job is very straightforward, and doesn't take long, it just takes attention to what you are doing. I am putting the same pole mount of my Jam 200 too!!!

Thanks, I was meaning factory equipped with pole mount--I would never think of modding an amp like that, but it sounds like your were ok with it lol!!

[rockabilly69]

yep I just took my time and did it right!