#46
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Mr. Morciglio;
Your work and report are fascinating; thank you for the information and pictures. |
#47
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Nevertheless, the original question (which has developed into a fascinating thread) was based on wondering what the relatively high costs were based on for CF guitars and whether they'd ever (well, in the foreseeable future) be used for budget guitars. |
#48
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vANCe 1976 Martin D-28(original owner) 1992 Taylor 420(original owner) 2012 RainSong H DR 1000(original owner) 2011 Gretsch Anniversary Model(original owner) Mandolin- 1920's A-Style (unknown brand) Mandolin- Fender Mandostrat Banjo -2016 Gold Tone EBM-5+ Fender 2013- Strat |
#49
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Ditto!!!!!
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Tom '21 Martin D-18 Standard | '02 Taylor 814c | '18 Taylor 214ceDLX | '18 Taylor 150e-12 | '78 Ibanez Dread (First acoustic) | '08 CA Cargo | '02 Fender Strat American '57 RI My original songs |
#50
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#51
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Three questions:
1. Do the finished products of air cured cf endure the same temperature extremes as high heat productions? 2. The explanations in this thread do not explain how a guitar could be made in one piece, i.e. have sides/back/top/neck all produced as one part. How is that done? John--do you sell guitars and if so do you have a web site? |
#52
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I'm not sure what "home made wood and carbon molds" means, or if you have any experience in mold work. molds, tool & die etc is not a new process and if John was a die maker by trade then he should certainly have a handle on it Everyday people pay too much for things they can't make themselves. |
#53
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Yet another question. Why hasn't the CF guitar market been flooded with imports? The U.S. has moved from 1 major cf guitar company to 4, with others sneaking in at the edges--it seems like such an emerging market would have attracted imported clones.
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#54
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A few years ago I'd produced a niche device for sometime before being completely over run by the Chinese. If I'd done any serious development it'd have all been for naught. |
#55
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Actually two of the six brands currently available are in fact imports, Journey and Emerald are both built outside the US. The four US builder are Rainsong, CA, and Blackbird, McPherson (Kevin Michael). My guess is Peavey, who now owns CA, would have already moved production to China if there was a benefit, so perhaps there isn't.
Last edited by Ted @ LA Guitar Sales; 06-19-2015 at 10:28 AM. Reason: Added McPherson to US CF Builders |
#56
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Journey is the only company now making CF in China. They have a good price point so it will be interesting to see. I heard bottom line is the market isn't big enough for major importers to get excited about
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Steve 2020 McKnight Grand Recording - Cedar Top 2005 McKnight SS Dred 2001 Michael Keller Koa Baby 2014 Godin Inuk 2012 Deering B6 Openback Banjo 2012 Emerald Acoustic Doubleneck 2012 Rainsong JM1000 Black Ice 2009 Wechter Pathmaker 9600 LTD 1982 Yairi D-87 Doubleneck 1987 Ovation Collectors 1993 Ovation Collectors 1967 J-45 Gibson 1974 20th Annivers. Les Paul Custom |
#57
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Leviora looks more like a custom or semi-custom shop, though.
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Breedlove, Landola, a couple of electrics, and a guitar-shaped-object |
#58
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Thanks guys!
As to the temperature comparison between room temp cures and pre-pregs;
It depends on their product used? Can't say what their working or service temps are? The 2 resins that I work with, (room temp. cure and the Boeing Mil-spec, high temp resin); Service temp for the room cure is 285 degree Far. The "HT Mil-spec", is higher but I could not find the product sheet in my books. (I think 40-50 degrees) Used when I want to make something fast. 3-4 hours under infra-red lights and it is cured enough to de-mold. The finish/paint would melt at 200 degrees. To Andy??? Nobody asked if "I" could build 2000 units with my "home-made" molds??? Lets see; 40hrs per/week at 50 weeks per year = ONE GUITAR EVERY HOUR! 2 shifts, 1 unit every 2 hrs. 3 shifts 1 for every 3 hrs. It is likely the high mold costs quoted were from an "insider" that has direct knowledge? Probably would cover 10+ sets of molds. Your not going to mass produce anything without a high quantity of molds and a large work force/factory? Grew up in Flint MI. Can you say "assembly line"? Might as well work for Ford or GM. Have no desire to own or purchase any guitar(s) that are mass produced. Only "brand-name" guitars I have left are an early 90's Ovation Elite and a custom-shop matching 5-string bass w/34" scale. They tried to talk me into a carbon (Adamas) top on the bass when I ordered it. SHOULD have listened as the string force keeps pulling the bridge :-( When I joined I was trying to figure out how/what to say/post, without saying "I build customs" Seems to be a very friendly and informative forum. A lot of forums can and do get nasty with a lot of negative BS. Back to the OT; Carbon work is very labor intensive. A lot of hands on work that can not be done by machines. Plek machine, and probably a semi-automated paint spraying system? JM |
#59
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Doubleneck,
Steve, awesome collection you have listed.
Should have contacted you when I still lived in MI. as we went/go to Ohio all the time. (will be rolling through in late July) Sought out as many players and collectors that I could find, for feedback and comparisons. Re-located to Denver. Used to live here in the 80's JM |
#60
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To make a "1 piece" guitar; It would have to be a "closed" (also referred to as "Blind" ;-) mold. A bladder or "lost wax casting" could be used for the internal pressure/support. "IF" (to me it's a BIG IF) this is actually being done by a builder? I don't get it or see any benefit other than pulling an almost finished product from a single step process?? Super car and Formula 1 chassis are referred to as "Mono" or one piece structures, after many parts are bonded together? PM me or "google" my name. I thought I would wait to donate (so I can link a site etc.) Since carbon is not that popular among traditional musicians. I also build wood and wood/carbon hybrid guitars. JM |