My fingerpicking style, technically wrong, struggling to change!

[Darby]

True. How wonder how Alex got on with his fingerpicking problem.

[Darby]

I think my sloppiness is due to the part of the thumb that strikes the string. So would you fellow pickers mind telling me what part of your thumb specifically hits the string, for comparison purposes, please?

[JonPR]

Originally Posted by Darby

I did not realise it was an eight-year-old thread. I agree with whatever works for you.

But any ideas about my "thumb" problem.

"I am pointing in the right direction and all the rest but I seem to be striking the bass notes with the edge of my thumb just under the nail on the left-hand side (sometimes inadvertently catching the nail). Perhaps I should use more of the pad of my thumb!"

Most fingerstyle players use either the nail of the thumb (along with fingernails), at least if classically trained, or they use a thumbpick.

There are some who use the fleshy side of the thumb, but the reasons would be (a) they don't like the feel or sound of the thumbpick, or (b) they can't grow their thumbnail long or strong enough, or (c) they don't like the sound of the nail either! (Or maybe they just misplaced their thumbpick...)

Personally, I use my thumb nail. I taught myself, and did try using a thumbpick (and even fingerpicks) to begin with, but they never felt comfortable. The sound was good and strong, but either they were too tight (painfiul after a whole) or they were too loose and moved around too much.

Obviously using the thumbnail means the angle of the thumb has to allow the nail to be able to pick the string. The classical position - wrist away from the guitar - allows that, while the folk-blues position - often resting the wrist on the bridge or near it - makes that much harder; hence the traditional use of a thumbpick projecting from the side of the thumb.

My nail is strong enough (and I can grow it long enough) that I can pick the strings even when my wrist rests on the bridge. In detail, what happens is the flesh of the thumb touches the string first, but the corner of the nail actually picks it. (This is standard in classical technique too, in fact. The nails are short enough that you feel the string with your fingertip before the nail picks it.)

The thumb does have to bend a little for the nail to make proper contact. If I keep the thumb dead straight, then I'm picking with the fleshy side alone. But the thumb is not stiffly bent, any more than it is stiffly straight - it just bends a little naturally as I pick the strings. You get a good view of the action here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C5LZ...m59qEL&index=3
The wrist is not resting there - no damped bass needed - so it's more like classical position, but you see the thumb movement. The nail is not especially long, just long enough to reach the string.

If you look at photos or film of the old blues players, mostly they used the flesh of the thumb:

Mississippi John Hurt - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=85BvT5X6WSo. He has his wrist firmly planted on the guitar so he can damp the bass strings.
Skip James - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ytVww5r4Nk0 keeps his wrist well clear of the guitar, but still seems to be using the flesh of the thumb.
Big Bill Broonzy seems to be using the side of his thumb here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fm1qtX7Mz5w
Sam Chatmon: https://youtu.be/AkEhtfPN084?t=82
But it's worth bearing in mind that those are all fairly informal performances, mostly as fairly old men, and doesn't rule out that they might have used thumbpicks when younger (for recording or to be louder whan playing live), or when one was available. Photos of Leadbelly, for example, show him with a thumbpick, but some film of him strumming (informally) shows him just using his thumb: https://youtu.be/xn50JSI0W-E?t=27

Rev Gary Davis used picks on thumb and index: https://youtu.be/4fpPgo4Deo4?t=90

Here's Doc Watson using a thumbpick, wrist on the bridge: https://youtu.be/6VAbrnjdtYw?t=82

Same with Merle Travis (and notice he's using thumb and index only! ) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1nV5xEGkK_g

Lightnin' Hopkins, again with a thumbpick: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hWqA1Z4lPHw

[Darby]

Thanks very much for the long and informative post.

I don't like using my thumbnail. My playing becomes quite erratic when I do so.

I would like to hear some more comments from people who use the flesh of the thumb.

I once tried a thumb pick and I was terrible with it.

My meagre fingerpicking skills were picked up from a Pete Seeger guitar tutor (borrowed from Dudley library back in the mists of time), and Songs of Leonard Cohen.
I use fingerpicking for accompaniment purposes not to play tunes, although I have made some amateurish stabs at that in the past.

My fingerpicking skills are OK after all these years but my thumb often seems to go awry.

[JonPR]

Originally Posted by Darby

Thanks very much for the long and informative post.

I don't like using my thumbnail. My playing becomes quite erratic when I do so.

The point here is there is no one "right" way. Looking at what other players do can sometimes help - maybe suggesting other things to try, other hand angles and so on - but you have to go with whatever works for you.

You're certainly in good company using the flesh of the thumb (tip or side).

[Darby]

Thanks. Yes, I realise there is not really any "right way". But tips can help.

[reeve21]

Hi Darby,

Like you, I use the fleshy side of my thumb.

I don't get on with the feel of a thumb pick, and the volume was too much compared to the rest of the strings (I don't use picks on my fingers, either). I have enough trouble getting the melody to pop without putting an amplifier on the bass

John Hurt was my first role model so that may explain it......

Some folks find it easier to palm mute the bass and getting the trebles to sound with a thumb pick. I had trouble in the beginning with just the flesh of my thumb, but after a few weeks it became second nature (when I want to play that way--for a lot of stuff I let the right hand "float" above the strings).

I guess I'm an advanced beginner/low intermediate in this style, so take my advice with a grain of salt, fwiw, ymmv, etc. etc.

[RodB]

Maybe Alex (OP) will drop by and say how he got on.

Darby,

Apart from some ragtime tunes where I use a thumb pick, I use the side of my thumb just beside the nail for the slower/melodic stuff. Like my fingernails I keep the thumb nail short and ramped away from where I first make contact with the string. In this way dropping the thumb to a more vertical angle to the strings gives more nail to add clarity when desired. Ramping the thumb nail from almost nothing near the side I use also prevents snagging the string accidentally.

I do this for 2 reasons:

1. I prefer the balance of sound on much of my music as I only play instrumentals and like the melody to be pronounced.

2. My thumb nail seems to be the most vulnerable to accidental damage.

I used to play the ragtime stuff with thumb and fingerpicks, but now only use my short fingernails. To prevent the thumb overpowering things and keeping the feel as close to just using bare thumb I have found Fred Kelly speed picks work well for me. They are confortable, not to clumsy and give the tone I like (medium thickness I think...)

Hope this helps.....

[Edit: Forgot to mention that I cut off a bit of the Fred Kelly thumb pick and reshape it to about half the normal length of the producing bit, to keep it ‘tame’]

[Darby]

Thanks for the tips.

[ljguitar]

Originally Posted by robodelfy

…Obviously Im picking close to the saddle which gives a less full and slightly twangy sound. Apart from that though I would be happy to play like this as I can play best this way.

…Im a bit confused as I keep swapping between and need to settle with something and get on with it!

Any info greatly appreciated

Alex

Hi Alex…
You are going to get still more options and recommendations (and strong opinions).

Half the great fingerstyle players play with the pinky dropped (and sometimes anchored) on the top, and the other half float it. Some do both.

Some play all flesh, and some with artificial nails (or actual nails or fingerpicks).

In addition there are thumb-n-one finger, thumb-n-two finger, and thumb-n-three fingers. Hybrid players play with a flat-pick and fingers 2-3-4 (as opposed to thumb-1-2-3)

Absolutes defy absolute agreement.

You are probably right to conclude you'll be better off to make a choice and pursue what you can do with that.

By the way - most of us think the way we chose is the perfect combination (and for us it probably is).

[Bob from Brooklyn]

Originally Posted by ewalling

Acoustic guitar picking isn't classical guitar - people do whatever works for them.

e.g., John Lennon, Paul McCartney

[davidbeinct]

Darby I can’t use my nails due to psoriasis and don’t like thumbpicks. I have loads of them if you want a couple.
Like Reeve I love MJH and try my best to emulate his style. I have a pretty good callus on the left side of my right thumb. It sits right about where the crescent part of my thumbnail meets the straight up and down part of the nail. That should give you a pretty good idea of where my thumb hits the bass strings. I rest my pinky on the guitar body either back by the bridge if I’m palm muting or more over the scratch plate area if I’m going for a more open sound.

[JonPR]

Originally Posted by Darby

Thanks. Yes, I realise there is not really any "right way". But tips can help.

Sure. That's where the videos come in! Much better than trying to describe things in words! Hopefully some of the players mentioned have some clear demos.

The issue, of course, is that you still have to choose a technique that feels comfortable for you - where your thumb can pick the strings without feeling awkward. What works for others may not work for you.

There could be an issue with hand angle and position too, or the way you hold the guitar. Again, pictures are worth 1000 words (and video a few 1000 more...).

[reeve21]

Originally Posted by JonPR

Sure. That's where the videos come in! Much better than trying to describe things in words! Hopefully some of the players mentioned have some clear demos.

There could be an issue with hand angle and position too, or the way you hold the guitar. Again, pictures are worth 1000 words (and video a few 1000 more...).

Here's one way to do it, worked pretty well for him

[JonPR]

Originally Posted by reeve21

Here's one way to do it, worked pretty well for him

I just posted that, back in post #33.