Tricone and Palm Muting

[29er]

I have owned a few National single cone models and the bridge cover was removable to allow for palm muting. Now I find myself thinking I need a tricone to make me complete Having never owned or even played a tricone I wonder about the ability to palm mute since the cover is not removable on these models. I really need to be able to mute on almost everything I play. Can anyone give me some insight on this issue?

[tdq]

Probably not the answer you're looking for - I have a single cone, leave the bridge cover on and mute by resting my palm on the edge of the cover so it sort of half-hangs off it and mutes the strings that way. Perhaps you could do that on the tricone?

[blue]

You just do it. Very few folks remove the strap on their single cone. It's the same thing. There's not a ton of difference between muting directly over the saddle and doing it a little forward. By that I mean it doesn't go noticeably "sharp".

[SpruceTop]

You can also use the thumb and fingers, along with the palm, to mute the strings by slapping or resting them against the strings as does John Hammond. He does this very fluidly and uses what he needs of the above to mute within the context of a given song. Look for his videos on YouTube. He plays a 1935 National Duolian with a non-removable bridge cover.

[29er]

Thanks for the input. I'm sure I can adopt, it's just that I had gotten used to anchoring my hand on the bridge with the single cone guitars. There are some decent prices for used Nationals these days and it may be time to explore my Tricone curiosity.

[blue]

Originally Posted by 29er

Thanks for the input. I'm sure I can adopt, it's just that I had gotten used to anchoring my hand on the bridge with the single cone guitars. There are some decent prices for used Nationals these days and it may be time to explore my Tricone curiosity.

You can still anchor on the tricone strap. Kind of like a tele ashtray cover. Don't sweat it at all. Tricones are much more versatile than singlecones. I bet you'll love it!

I DO NOT RECOMMEND THIS! But I've been told the tricone strap is soldered on. I know of at least one person who says they has removed it for playing, and puts it back on with "rare earth magnets" for transportation in the case. Again, I think it's a bad idea.

I haven't seen great prices yet on used Nationals, but I have seen more "inventory" online. Nationals clearly aren't that many peoples #1.

[Robin, Wales]

Round neck tricones were not really designed to be palm muted or fingerpicked or played with a slide - although all those styles they get used for. They were made (and cost!) at the time as an upmarket band instrument for vamped chord rhythm - so the guitar player could be heard and to some extent seen. They are very art deco and of their time. The best I have heard them played has been in the hands of jazz players rather than blues or slide players. They really fit the jazz band genera - hardly surprising really!!! The square necks came first as a band instrument and then the round necks to meet the demand from rhythm players. Open strummed they sound like a bag of spanners but vamped they are wonderful band instruments.

[blue]

Originally Posted by Robin, Wales

Round neck tricones were not really designed to be palm muted or fingerpicked or played with a slide - although all those styles they get used for. They were made (and cost!) at the time as an upmarket band instrument for vamped chord rhythm - so the guitar player could be heard and to some extent seen. They are very art deco and of their time. The best I have heard them played has been in the hands of jazz players rather than blues or slide players. They really fit the jazz band genera - hardly surprising really!!! The square necks came first as a band instrument and then the round necks to meet the demand from rhythm players. Open strummed they sound like a bag of spanners but vamped they are wonderful band instruments.

Disagree on almost all counts except that the design of the bridge area was not "optimized" for playing "spanish" style, but for lap style.

The "bag of spanners" comment can be applied to single cones in the wrong hands (especially steel models), but tricones are a completely different beast. Do you own or have spent significant time with a tricone?

A couple of examples:

[Robin, Wales]

Originally Posted by blue

Disagree on almost all counts except that the design of the bridge area was not "optimized" for playing "spanish" style, but for lap style.

The "bag of spanners" comment can be applied to single cones in the wrong hands (especially steel models), but tricones are a completely different beast. Do you own or have spent significant time with a tricone?

I can't quite see what you are disagreeing with? The history of the instrument? Or the fact that the best that I've seen them played is in a jazz context (which is my opinion)?

Well, I've spent some time with original 1930s Nationals in German silver and brass, early brass Beltona, and Mike Lewis Fine Resophonic guitars plus more recent copies (Continental et al) but not much time with any tricones Don Young has produced.

[blue]

Originally Posted by Robin, Wales

I can't quite see what you are disagreeing with? The history of the instrument? Or the fact that the best that I've seen them played is in a jazz context (which is my opinion)?

Well, I've spent some time with original 1930s Nationals in German silver and brass, early brass Beltona, and Mike Lewis Fine Resophonic guitars plus more recent copies (Continental et al) but not much time with any tricones Don Young has produced.

Hawaiian Lap is all fingerpicking and right and left hand muting. To suggest that if you stand one on its side, give it a round neck it suddenly isn't good for fingerpicking and muting? That's just ignorance.

And as to jazz. To play a tricone well you HAVE to mute because it will ring for days. You simply can't play swing, which is "period correct" for the introduction of the tricone, or any guitar really, without muting. You lose the groove completely.

I live with Nationals every day. Single and Tricone. From a 1932 squareneck to a Brass Tricone Baritone, to a Modern NRP german silver tricone.

based on near twenty years of experience, the majority of what you said is not correct. Yes you are free to say you prefer it for jazz. Other than that, most experienced Resonator players would disagree with everything you've said. C'mon, A tricone sounds like a Bag of Spanners? That's the usual complaint against single cones in the hands of folks who don't know how to control them. Control them how you ask? With MUTING!

I'm pushing back because some people with no experience with resonators will read your post, and believe it. That may keep them from discovering a wonderful and inspiring instrument.

[Robin, Wales]

OK. I'll give you that one. On re-reading it, my post could have come across as dismissive of any use of the round neck tricone beyond its original market. This is obviously your area of passion. Though I can't quite see the relevance of your lecture on damping (I seem to have flicked a switch there). I certainly don't want to put anyone off reso guitars - they bought my house!

[blue]

Originally Posted by Robin, Wales

OK. I'll give you that one. On re-reading it, my post could have come across as dismissive of any use of the round neck tricone beyond its original market. This is obviously your area of passion. Though I can't quite see the relevance of your lecture on damping (I seem to have flicked a switch there). I certainly don't want to put anyone off reso guitars - they bought my house!

I interchange the words damping and muting all time. You wrote the sentence "Round neck tricones were not really designed to be palm muted or fingerpicked or played with a slide"

That's the switch you flicked. It's a ridiculous statement.

[Robin, Wales]

Originally Posted by blue

I interchange the words damping and muting all time. You wrote the sentence "Round neck tricones were not really designed to be palm muted or fingerpicked or played with a slide"

That's the switch you flicked. It's a ridiculous statement.

Ahh OK. It was clumsy. The key word in my mind was 'designed' ie the brothers and Beauchamp's envisaged market. Like the dreadnought wasn't "designed" by Martin for bluegrass flat picking.

You have actually missed out the qualifying clause from that sentence in your quote! The bit that said - "although all those styles they get used for." (poorly written English).

[blue]

Originally Posted by Robin, Wales

Ahh OK. It was clumsy. The key word in my mind was 'designed' ie the brothers and Beauchamp's envisaged market. Like the dreadnought wasn't "designed" by Martin for bluegrass flat picking.

You have actually missed out the qualifying clause from that sentence in your quote! The bit that said - "although all those styles they get used for." (poorly written English).

Last post from me, and I wish there was an ignore button.

The Les Paul was designed for Pop-Jazz

The Strat was designed for Western swing.

You're just trolling because you are bored. But the real joke is that since I quoted you repeatedly, your wise words are forever perserved for all to see anytime someone searches "tricone" here or in google. Hopefully you stand by them.

Bye bye now.