Help me with songwriting?

[tepauldaca]

Hey guys I've just starting writing songs, I've only gotten though 4 or 5. My problem is the quality of the lyrics I come up with are rather poor. Most are just staight out what I see and feel, very simple. Very superficial. The way I've gone about writing these songs is just playing and letting my mind and mouth run. Should I then go back afterwards and try to replace alot of the descriptions with things such as allusions, similes, and metaphors? Or should I go back at all and leave it in the "pure" way it came to me, and hope that in time, after much practice, deeper meanings will come to me like the simple ones do now?

Also many times I will come up with a line that just fits perfectly, then I'll go to write it down and found myself to have forgotten it. So lately I have been playing into a small recording device, the downside is it takes an amount of time to set up. Does your memory also improve for your lyrics as time goes on, just as my fingers can get to a "D" chord faster now than they could when I started? I assume that since my playing has become more elaborate and gained more "style" the same will become with my lyrics? Such as right now I could be playing my "first song", taking a few seconds to get my fingers in the right chord positions; my lyrics will not come as easily as I want? Any advice from those expreinced, those just starting, or those who have felt like this would be greatly appreciated.

I apologize for the ramblings above, I have become very discouraged in writing.

Thanks,
Austin

[Rodger]

Some of the greatest songwriters (Paul McCartney, for example) tend to use "gibberish" lyrics while working out melodies and chord progressions. Once they are happy with the musical portion, they will return to create new lyrics - replacing the gibberish lines with a coherent lyric.

My approach is similar. Once I stumble upon a chord progression I like, I begin humming or singing random syllables until the musical part is improved and remembered. If I'm happy with it, I'll record the two parts (just acoustic guitar and syllabic ramblings) and may jot something down in my notebook. Over the course of the next few days (sometimes the course of a few years), I'll come up with refrain lyrics and go from there to write verses. Something you see, read or experience will trigger a phrase or a complete line. When you get those words, try to match the lyric feeling with music you wrote previously. You may have to edit the phrase a bit to fit.

I always have my music notebook and pen with me and my PC recording system ready to go whenever I start to play guitar. Sometimes I just play old cover tunes or something I wrote previously. Once in a while, however, a new musical idea strikes... you have to be ready to capture it. Keep playing it over and over until you have it. Then record it... don't trust it to memory.

The most important thing is - don't get down on yourself or discouraged. Songwriting is a craft like any other. It takes work and a lot of practice - years of practice. I go back to songs I wrote when I was just starting to write (1970) and cringe. Horrible lyrics and real basic music. The more you work at it, the more you grow. It was 3 years of working at it everyday until I wrote a song I thought was good. Keep plugging away. You'll see your guitar playing improve as well as your writing skills.

Rodger

[Acousticado]

There are excellent books available to help you. In addition, there are a number of excellent songwriting discussion forums (lyrics and/or music). I don't frequent them as much as I used to, but I can tell you that they are invaluable. Like here, the songwriting forums are full of helpful people. Post a lyric and members will provide critiques. And don't forget the community spirit by critiquing the works of others. I can tell you that critiquing can be the best learning experience. It forces you to analyze a lyric (structure, rhyme scheme, meter, story development, etc.). Here are links to two of the better ones.

Just Plain Folks:
http://www.justplainfolks.org/cgi-bi...=60&LastLogin=

The Muse's Muse:
http://www.musesmuse.com/forums/index.php?showforum=9

Also, here's an on-line Rhyming Dictionary that can be very helpful:
http://www.rhymezone.com

Hope this helps you. Happy writing!

[bagelsgirl]

I'm no expert, but I have written a lot of songs. Everyone seems to have their own method, but here are my few insights:

Just keep doing it. Write every day. Don't allow yourself to judge while you are creating.

Focus on quantity not quality, for part of the time you spend, anyway. Just let the ideas flow. Then if you want to go back and rewrite, reshape, by all means do.

It is a great thing that you are putting the ideas on tape so you don't forget them. Very wise!

When evaluating your lyrics, go with your instincts. Don't be too quick to discount something because it seems cliched. I have some songs with a lot of cliches in them and at first I thought they were not so great because of that. But then I realized that to change them would be a mistake. Listen to some of your favorite songs and pay attention to how often they have cliches in them. I noticed almost every artist I like uses a cliche or two, but when it is a great song and it works, it doesn't matter.

On the other hand, it may be that you need to change the lyric. You alone can judge. Like I said, go with your instinct.

I think if people keep on writing, they always improve. Now, I need to follow my own advise, especially #1 and 2 above. I haven't written a whole lot this summer...

[Gear_Junky]

Though I haven't written many songs, I've written a lot of poetry. As with everything, practice makes perfect (I'm repeating it to show that I agree).

But also I think that to write one must read a lot, books, poetry, even the Bible (you'll be surprised how many of your favorite songs borrow ideas or thoughts from the Bible and you didn't even know!).

Just like writing good music takes listening to a wide range of music, same goes for poetry and songs.

Everybody who's anybody in song genre will tell you that they like a wide range of music, even if they only play in one particular "style".

I know many people say that anything that one writes is to be respected, but I think we should not kid ourselves and should scrutinize what we write (if not during the writing, then afterwards). Nobody will like cheesy lyrics with poor grammar, etc., but who decides what's "cheesy"? That's hard to tell. A writer must learn to critisize himself...

Just an opinion, feel free to disagree and argue.

Poetry is as much a science as it is art. I'm not saying one must study poetry professionally to write poetry, but it helps to know what the classics have written of it and about it. There are ways to rhyme ends of lines, beginnings of lines, even mid-word (useful for songs). There are different "rhythms", etc. just like there's different modes and keys in music. The more great poetry you're exposed to the better will you write. It'll just come out of you.

I even happen to believe that anyone can develop this talent/skill if they want to and they will have at least some neat poems/songs.

Personally, though, I find writing songs A LOT more difficult than poetry. I'm always worried that it sounds too predictable/mundane musically or reminds other music too much. It has to be original or it shouldn't be (for me). But I also realize that I'm very subjective here, but I just can't go against my "writer's" concience - if I don't like it I feel I have no right to try and finish it or to sing it. And I rarely like anything I write musically. But there's a couple things...