The Acoustic Guitar Forum

Go Back   The Acoustic Guitar Forum > General Acoustic Guitar and Amplification Discussion > Carbon Fiber

Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #1  
Old 12-20-2018, 12:44 PM
Irishrep Irishrep is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Ohio
Posts: 19
Default Sanding inside of a Emerald Guitar for BBand AST

Need some help if possible

I have a x20 with a A3T preamp 2016 vintage.

I am going to replace my bband undersaddle pick - up(UST) with a bband AST 1470 soundboard transducer. This is sort of similar to a K & K and mounts to the underside of the soundboard area. Even though the surface is smooth ( you can feel the cloth texture slightly). Do I need to ( and can I?) sand this surface without messing up the guitar. Has anyone ever had any experience installing this type of pick up on an Emerald ? It is mounted using a self adhesive pad on the pickup ( no need to glue). It looks pretty easy to install but I was not sure if I needed to sand the area perfectly flat first. Any comments would be welcome. Thanks
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 12-20-2018, 01:18 PM
Melt in the Sun Melt in the Sun is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2018
Location: Tucson, AZ
Posts: 65
Default

I am new around here, but I know that "prep for K&K" is an additional charge from Emerald, and that it won't stick properly if that isn't done.

I've never put in a K&K but I have the same b-band in my Taylor...and it is sticky as hell, to the point I think it's probably impossible to remove without destroying the pickup (or bridge plate!). Whether that means it'll stick to the carbon fiber, I can't say.

I know that recently I read about someone sanding the inside surface themselves...it was probably on this forum and likely within the past couple pages of threads.

Edit - here it is.
https://www.acousticguitarforum.com/...d.php?t=511122
__________________
Taylor 510 w/ B-band - Alvarez A800 Mandolin - Samick Acoustic Bass - Kala Soprano Uke - PRS SE Santana - PRS SE 277 Baritone - Carvin B4 Bass - Yamaha DTX750 Drum Kit
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 12-20-2018, 01:39 PM
Irishrep Irishrep is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Ohio
Posts: 19
Default Sanding inside of a Emerald Guitar for BBand AST

Quote:
Originally Posted by Irishrep View Post
Need some help if possible
Thanks for digging up that answer - looks like I need to sand to be sure it will stick. I would have gone with something else if I didn't already have a hole in the side of the guitar with the preamp. Have you had any issues with the AST pickup? - since they are out of business - I am thinking of getting a spare before they get rare and go up in price.

Last edited by Kerbie; 12-20-2018 at 05:44 PM. Reason: Fixed quote
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 12-20-2018, 01:57 PM
Melt in the Sun Melt in the Sun is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2018
Location: Tucson, AZ
Posts: 65
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Irishrep View Post
Have you had any issues with the AST pickup?
Not issues per se, but I've rarely used it. I have the combo UST/AST/blender system and have never been able to add more than a smidge of AST before I get howling feedback. This is standing in front of a wedge monitor at church, with volunteer (aka minimally-competent) sound guys and a really crusty PA system. Your mileage may vary.

The AST definitely sounds nice when someone else is singing and I can stand way back. It's very sensitive to finger/pick/arm/clothes noises...picks all of them up perfectly.
__________________
Taylor 510 w/ B-band - Alvarez A800 Mandolin - Samick Acoustic Bass - Kala Soprano Uke - PRS SE Santana - PRS SE 277 Baritone - Carvin B4 Bass - Yamaha DTX750 Drum Kit
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 12-20-2018, 03:22 PM
BT55 BT55 is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: NY
Posts: 1,200
Default

You DO have to sand the inside of an Emerald prior to installation. The CF is rough so nothing will stick. I used a 100 grit sanding block. I sanded the bottom of the saddle area, around the opening to mount the controls, area where the battery bag was installed and the areas for the wire ties. It took me longer to type this than the sanding process!
__________________
Taylor V-Class 814ce, 520ce, 454ce, T5z Classic
Martin D18E Retro
Emerald X20
Rainsong H-OM1000N2
Voyage-Air VAD-04
Custom Build Les Paul
Hot Rod Deville 410, Fishman Loudbox Performer
FOR SALE: Fender Custom Stratocaster
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 12-20-2018, 04:23 PM
Irishrep Irishrep is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Ohio
Posts: 19
Default Sanding inside of a Emerald Guitar for BBand AST

Thanks - I am, lucky - only have to do the soundboard area and plug in the pickup into the A3T -Since I bought the pickup on ebay it did not have the template for placement - but I think I can get it close enough if I create a small block with pins through the high and low E's. Did you vacuum or blow out the dust from sanding ?
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 12-20-2018, 05:18 PM
BT55 BT55 is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: NY
Posts: 1,200
Default

I have an air compressor and blew out the dust. I also drilled the endpin at the same time.
__________________
Taylor V-Class 814ce, 520ce, 454ce, T5z Classic
Martin D18E Retro
Emerald X20
Rainsong H-OM1000N2
Voyage-Air VAD-04
Custom Build Les Paul
Hot Rod Deville 410, Fishman Loudbox Performer
FOR SALE: Fender Custom Stratocaster
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 12-22-2018, 04:37 PM
GuitarLuva GuitarLuva is online now
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: The Great White North
Posts: 687
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Irishrep View Post
Need some help if possible

I have a x20 with a A3T preamp 2016 vintage.

I am going to replace my bband undersaddle pick - up(UST) with a bband AST 1470 soundboard transducer. This is sort of similar to a K & K and mounts to the underside of the soundboard area. Even though the surface is smooth ( you can feel the cloth texture slightly). Do I need to ( and can I?) sand this surface without messing up the guitar. Has anyone ever had any experience installing this type of pick up on an Emerald ? It is mounted using a self adhesive pad on the pickup ( no need to glue). It looks pretty easy to install but I was not sure if I needed to sand the area perfectly flat first. Any comments would be welcome. Thanks
I just recently sanded that area on my X30 to install a Schatten HFN. It was very easy to do. You will get your hands full of black carbon though but it washes off easy. Just make sure after sanding that you clean the surface. I wiped the area down after sanding with a few wet paper towels and shortly after that cleaned the area with isopropyl alcohol to help promote adhesion. The pickup installed no problem with great adhesion. Hope this helps.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 12-23-2018, 05:36 PM
121 121 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: New England
Posts: 578
Default

I'm not sure if this will help or not, but here are some K&K related photos of my Emerald acoustics.

My 2017 X20 with an Emerald installed K&K




My 2018 X10 with an Emerald K&K prep


Last edited by 121; 12-23-2018 at 05:50 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 12-23-2018, 11:50 PM
GuitarLuva GuitarLuva is online now
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: The Great White North
Posts: 687
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 121 View Post
I'm not sure if this will help or not, but here are some K&K related photos of my Emerald acoustics.

My 2017 X20 with an Emerald installed K&K




My 2018 X10 with an Emerald K&K prep

The more I look at that pic the more curious I get. Do anyone know what that prep work actually is?
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 12-24-2018, 06:35 AM
SpruceTop SpruceTop is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Rochester, New York
Posts: 6,687
Default

Most of the following can be applied to the Emerald: I installed a B-Band A1.2N 1470 AST in my Martin D Junior. It was quite easy as I reamed the end-pin hole with my Stewart-MacDonald reamer and then lightly sanded the bridgeplate. I thoroughly vacuumed the inside of the guitar and then wiped the bridgeplate with alcohol to clean it and let it dry for a few minutes. Then with a mirror and small LED lights placed on the back of the guitar, I looked through the bridge-pin holes and guided the AST pickup into place and pressed lightly on the pickup and then gently stroked it to make sure it was sitting flat along its length and making even contact with the bridgeplate.

IMPORTANT: After installation of pickup on bridgeplate, make sure the AST pickup's lead wire is directed away from the guitar's top and any bracing as the lead wire can transfer vibration to the pickup causing distortion when strumming your guitar aggressively.
__________________
Huss & Dalton TD-R
Martin HD-28 (Trance M-VT)
Martin D-18
Martin D Jr (B-Band A1.2N)
Taylor 614ce (ES2)
Taylor 618e (ES2)
Taylor 356ce (ES2)
Taylor 322ce (ES2)
Taylor GS Mini-e Koa (ES2)
Epiphone DR-500MCE (Shadow eSonic2)
Ovation Elite Plus Contour (OpProStudio)
Ovation VXT Electric (two Duncan '59/Fishman Acoustic Bridge)
Eight 5-String Banjos

Last edited by SpruceTop; 12-24-2018 at 06:51 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 12-24-2018, 06:39 AM
SpruceTop SpruceTop is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Rochester, New York
Posts: 6,687
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by GuitarLuva View Post
The more I look at that pic the more curious I get. Do anyone know what that prep work actually is?
It looks like epoxy was spread on bridgeplate area and smoothed out and probably sanded to provide a smooth surface for the K&K transducers. The 2018 prep with its larger bridgeplate looks so much better than the 2017 prep.
__________________
Huss & Dalton TD-R
Martin HD-28 (Trance M-VT)
Martin D-18
Martin D Jr (B-Band A1.2N)
Taylor 614ce (ES2)
Taylor 618e (ES2)
Taylor 356ce (ES2)
Taylor 322ce (ES2)
Taylor GS Mini-e Koa (ES2)
Epiphone DR-500MCE (Shadow eSonic2)
Ovation Elite Plus Contour (OpProStudio)
Ovation VXT Electric (two Duncan '59/Fishman Acoustic Bridge)
Eight 5-String Banjos
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 12-24-2018, 12:08 PM
GuitarLuva GuitarLuva is online now
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: The Great White North
Posts: 687
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SpruceTop View Post
It looks like epoxy was spread on bridgeplate area and smoothed out and probably sanded to provide a smooth surface for the K&K transducers. The 2018 prep with its larger bridgeplate looks so much better than the 2017 prep.
Yeah right on was wondering if my eyes were deceiving me. It certainly looks like professional prep work. I wonder how much difference it actually makes for SBT's.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 12-25-2018, 09:50 AM
JimCA JimCA is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: California
Posts: 181
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by GuitarLuva View Post
Yeah right on was wondering if my eyes were deceiving me. It certainly looks like professional prep work. I wonder how much difference it actually makes for SBT's.
Makes me wonder, is this new X10 under-bridge design shared by the new X7 and X30, or is it unique to the X10 to accommodate the Ghost saddles?

Update: Just answered my own question, there is no extra bridgeplate on my acoustic-only new X10.

Last edited by JimCA; 12-25-2018 at 10:03 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 12-25-2018, 10:35 AM
121 121 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: New England
Posts: 578
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JimCA View Post
Makes me wonder, is this new X10 under-bridge design shared by the new X7 and X30, or is it unique to the X10 to accommodate the Ghost saddles?

Update: Just answered my own question, there is no extra bridgeplate on my acoustic-only new X10.
The 2018 X10 with the K&K prep has the single saddle bridge instead of the six saddle bridge

.Here is a 2018 X7 with K&K prep.


Sorry for the blurry picture but it's really too close a shot for my GoPro


Last edited by 121; 12-25-2018 at 10:46 AM.
Reply With Quote
Reply

  The Acoustic Guitar Forum > General Acoustic Guitar and Amplification Discussion > Carbon Fiber

Thread Tools



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 06:33 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, The Acoustic Guitar Forum
vB Ad Management by =RedTyger=