Is LR Baggs Anthem an upgrade from their Dual Source?

BigSky · #1 04-19-2021, 03:56 PM

I am contemplating changing out Baggs USTs (Lyric and AES-VTC) in two guitars and replacing them with the Anthem. I have a Baggs Dual Source in my Breedlove SC20 and I love it. It seems as if the Anthem is a newer product and I seek some advice on whether it is in any way superior to the Dual Source.

Last summer I bought a Breedlove Oregon Concert CE Ltd Edition with the Baggs AES-VTC UST. I am not impressed with the plugged-in sound as it sounds seriously quacky. I own a Fishman Aura Spectrum DI and have tried in vain to get the plugged-in sound to be pleasing to my ear. Many have recommended getting a Tonedexter but carting around more gear does not get me terribly excited.

I understand that the cost of replacing two simple USTs with the Anthem would be more costly than the Tonedexter but that is not an important concern. I would like a more natural sound with the ease of showing up to an open-mic without a cartload of gear.

Petty1818 · #2 04-20-2021, 08:03 AM

I always thought the Dual Source had a nice sound and the internal mic was surprisingly good in terms of feedback. However, I would probably switch to the Anthem. It's just a much more "plug and play" system. You can also dial in far more mic to the point where you are hearing mostly mic. I don't remember being able to dial in a ton of the Dual Source mic.

Now with that said, I still find that the Anthem has a distinct tone to it so if you like it in demos then I say make the change. You might also want to check out the Lr Baggs Voiceprint. You would save a lot by not changing out the pickups and simply making some good IR's.

BigSky · #3 04-20-2021, 08:35 AM

Petty: Thanks for the advice. If I had an Iphone or if Baggs comes out with an Android version of the Voiceprint DI, I would certainly check it out. It is nice to know that you can dial in more mic on the Anthem. I have watched the YouTube comparisons between the Anthem and the Fishman Matrix and while most of the commentators like the Anthem better, I found it hard to chose between two rather different sonic profiles.

Petty1818 · #4 04-20-2021, 10:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigSky

Petty: Thanks for the advice. If I had an Iphone or if Baggs comes out with an Android version of the Voiceprint DI, I would certainly check it out. It is nice to know that you can dial in more mic on the Anthem. I have watched the YouTube comparisons between the Anthem and the Fishman Matrix and while most of the commentators like the Anthem better, I found it hard to chose between two rather different sonic profiles.

Yeah, the difference between the Matrix and Anthem should be night and day, unless it's the full Anthem and the demo showcases the full Element blend. If you are liking the Matrix tone though, then maybe you don't necessarily want/need the most natural sound? It's too bad you didn't like the Aura as I would just suggest using it with the Element or Matrix.

BigSky · #5 04-20-2021, 02:56 PM

Again thanks for commenting... I have had the Aura for a number of years and I have dabbled with the different images and have not found anything that greatly eliminates the quack without dialing in a weird sound. There are no images in the library for the two guitars that I want to modify. I, also, have two guitars with passive SBTs (K & K pure mini and a McIntyre feather) which yield a much more realistic sound but I can't adjust volume or tone without a mixer or a DI.

jimmy bookout · #6 04-23-2021, 08:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigSky

I am contemplating changing out Baggs USTs (Lyric and AES-VTC) in two guitars and replacing them with the Anthem. I have a Baggs Dual Source in my Breedlove SC20 and I love it. It seems as if the Anthem is a newer product and I seek some advice on whether it is in any way superior to the Dual Source.

Last summer I bought a Breedlove Oregon Concert CE Ltd Edition with the Baggs AES-VTC UST. I am not impressed with the plugged-in sound as it sounds seriously quacky. I own a Fishman Aura Spectrum DI and have tried in vain to get the plugged-in sound to be pleasing to my ear. Many have recommended getting a Tonedexter but carting around more gear does not get me terribly excited.

I understand that the cost of replacing two simple USTs with the Anthem would be more costly than the Tonedexter but that is not an important concern. I would like a more natural sound with the ease of showing up to an open-mic without a cartload of gear.

"New" does not mean "better".
Your second sentence...read it again.
Now, read it again.
One more time.
I wouldn't touch a pickup system I "love".

BigSky · #7 04-24-2021, 03:31 PM

Jimmy B: I agree that "new" does not necessarily mean "better" but the evolution of guitar electronics has generally yielded upgraded features and capabilities. I might consider putting the Baggs Dual Source in the two guitars if I could find it from a reputable source like Sweetwater. However, they are very hard to find and the reviews on the Anthem have generally been excellent.

MrErikJ · #8 04-28-2021, 09:20 AM

I don't think the Anthem is necessarily better than the Dual Source but a streamlined version of that tech. The advantage of the Dual Source is the ability to use whatever piezo you would like (I replaced the included Element with a LB6) and you can operate the pickups in stereo. I think that's an especially nice option for live performance and recording. The mic in the Dual Source is a more "typical" and full-range condensor mic, which comes in handy if you're a slapper or like to talk into your soundhole like Phil Keaggy.

However, the Anthem does what most people would do with a stereo setup of the Dual Source: use the Element for lows and the mic for everything else. If that's how you would EQ those elements separately and you don't need a full range mic (the tru-mic is a boundary mic) it's undeniably a simpler solution.

I think the Dual Source is a really good "do it yourself" system for those who want to control everything on their own. I rather liked mine, tho I don't use it anymore. The Anthem is an easier solution for most players.

BigSky · #9 05-02-2021, 10:59 AM

MrErikJ: Thanks for the insightful and knowledgeable response. That is exactly what I was looking for!

guitaniac · #10 05-02-2021, 02:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigSky

I am contemplating changing out Baggs USTs (Lyric and AES-VTC) in two guitars and replacing them with the Anthem. I have a Baggs Dual Source in my Breedlove SC20 and I love it. It seems as if the Anthem is a newer product and I seek some advice on whether it is in any way superior to the Dual Source.

Last summer I bought a Breedlove Oregon Concert CE Ltd Edition with the Baggs AES-VTC UST. I am not impressed with the plugged-in sound as it sounds seriously quacky. I own a Fishman Aura Spectrum DI and have tried in vain to get the plugged-in sound to be pleasing to my ear. Many have recommended getting a Tonedexter but carting around more gear does not get me terribly excited.

I understand that the cost of replacing two simple USTs with the Anthem would be more costly than the Tonedexter but that is not an important concern. I would like a more natural sound with the ease of showing up to an open-mic without a cartload of gear.

FWIW, the Lyric mic is a single-source pickup, although it can be installed as a second pickup in a dual source setup. The Lyric was released after the Anthem system was introduced. The Dual Source system is a much older system than any of the various Anthem systems or the Lyric system. The Dual Source mic is a very different animal than the Lyric.

I have an Anthem SL system in one of my guitars which I quite like. I have to admit, however, that it was quite a struggle (with my particular guitar) to get the optimal pickup signal/mic signal balance and the optimal EQ applied so that it didn't sound too muddy or too brittle. I wouldn't recommend it for someone who prefers a simple approach, but your guitar (and your mileage, as they say) may vary.

The full Anthem system is probably simpler to deal with, with respect to getting a pleasing sound. As a soundman, I've been blessed with hearing a great many good sounding full Anthem systems. I was cursed with one, however, that went crazy loud every time the player plucked an A# at 116.5 Hz. (The G chord position with a capo on the third fret was a nightmare.)

Petty1818 · #11 05-02-2021, 02:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by guitaniac

I have an Anthem SL system in one of my guitars which I quite like. I have to admit, however, that it was quite a struggle (with my particular guitar) to get the optimal pickup signal/mic signal balance and the optimal EQ applied so that it didn't sound too muddy or too brittle. I wouldn't recommend it for someone who prefers a simple approach, but your guitar (and your mileage, as they say) may vary.

I had the same experience when I tried the SL version. I was encouraged by the fact that the SL was often pushed as being a more "clear" sounding pickup when compared to the full Anthem. However, I could never fully balance it out. It was either too muddy or too hi-fi. It's funny because I tried the Lyric in the same guitar and although I moved on due to a lack of bass, I really liked that pickup. I know the SL is a bit different but it is supposed to be the highest tru-mic setting that the full Anthem has so I was surprised that I didn't like it. I thought it would be basically the Lyric with a bit more bass.

The full Anthem was better but I too struggled with it. There's a mid range that pops up when the guitar is turned up to loud gig volumes. It's not as noticeable in intimate settings but on larger stages, it's difficult to eq. Still, I wouldn't mind trying the Anthem again but with the tru-mic put in one of the alternate mounting positions that Baggs recommends.