Contemporary Guitars without Truss Rods

ewh2 · #1 08-07-2014, 04:31 AM

I've noticed a few guitars of the contemporary era are built without adjustable truss rods, for example the Martin OM-18A which has an ebony rod in the neck for reinforcement, and a few other guitars including Blazer and Henkes and some others (I've come across Bagnasco & Casati, Per Marklund, Howard Klepper for a Schoenberg OM).

Does anyone know of any other luthiers who build guitars without adjustable truss rods for acoustic guitars with wooden necks?

I've heard Carbon Fibre/composite guitars often don't have them as they are stable.

Tim McKnight · #2 08-07-2014, 06:25 AM

Ken Parker comes to mind. Although his neck is probably the most unique original design I have ever seen.

philjs · #3 08-07-2014, 06:50 AM

I've just had an adjustable truss rod installed in an '83 Larrivee L-09. Don't know if you'd consider that "modern." My luthier (Russel Crosby) told me that he did find a steel bar under the fingerboard but it (obviously) wasn't enough. My '90 J-09 has an adjustable rod so sometime between '82 and '89 Jean began putting them in.

I also have a friend who has an early (around '82 or '83) Beneteau dreadnought that he inherited from his father that doesn't have an adjustable truss rod either.

Phil

dberkowitz · #4 08-07-2014, 07:22 AM

Even the new Rainsong Al Pettaway model I played last week has a truss rod. Rainsong's reason for using one is the ability to adjust the relieve based on playing style -- if you have a light touch you don't need much relief, but if you lay into the guitar, you'd need more.

It really is a fools errand to buy a guitar without one.

CoolerKing · #5 08-07-2014, 08:39 AM

I don't know this for a fact, but Baranik makes and adjustable neck, so wonder if it's CF reinforced.

Martin Keith · #6 08-07-2014, 08:55 AM

Interestingly enough, several of the major manufacturers that made their names with solid carbon-fiber necks eventually decided to incorporate truss rods - Modulus Graphite and Rainsong both come to mind.

I have a Modulus 6-string bass from the pre-truss-rod days, and...well, it should have one. It's stiff and stable, but there is too much relief for my taste - and that's a 100% CF neck. In light of that, I personally can't really see the reasoning behind making a wooden neck without a truss rod, except in the case of the Martin which is really honoring tradition.

There are new CF products (i.e. the DragonPlate U-channel) that could conceivably be strong enough to work properly - but no two players are exactly alike, so I really think of neck relief as a necessarily adjustable parameter.
Curious to hear other builders' thoughts on this...

Cheers,
Martin

LouieAtienza · #7 08-07-2014, 12:51 PM

PRS and McPherson use a CF rod...

Bruce Sexauer · #8 08-07-2014, 01:28 PM

I have built a half a dozen guitars in the last ten years w/o adjustable truss rods. I do add Carbon reinforcement, however. I charge more for this kind of thing because, a, it cost more, b, if a set up change is required it is a big deal, relatively, and c: When the strings go to tension there is a relief change, and the carbon fiber component makes the change predictable once a few similar systems have be built, but it must be allowed for with some precision, and the learning curve is not insignificant.

Jimmy Caldwell · #9 08-07-2014, 01:48 PM

I've built a number of guitars without an adjustable truss rod, but they have all been bar fret guitars. Bar frets are a different animal and they're another one of those learning curve situations.

Howard Klepper · #10 08-07-2014, 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dberkowitz

Even the new Rainsong Al Pettaway model I played last week has a truss rod. Rainsong's reason for using one is the ability to adjust the relieve based on playing style -- if you have a light touch you don't need much relief, but if you lay into the guitar, you'd need more.

It really is a fools errand to buy a guitar without one.

That would make the owner of every pre-1980's Martin a fool (I don't know the exact year they changed). And since you are saying that anyone who buys one of my traditional Martin style instruments is on a fool's errand I must regretfully say that your comment is mistaken and ill-informed. We build guitars that in a variety of ways are designed to perform optimally with a certain string gauge and playing style. And that is a good thing. People do not seek custom guitars in order to have one that can do everything for every player. That is a formula for a guitar that excels at nothing.

justonwo · #11 08-07-2014, 01:57 PM

Frankie Montuoro builds a number of guitars without truss rods. My 000-12 has no truss rod. The guitar is light as a feather. Of course, adjusting relief is a much bigger deal with these guitars, but it has been pretty stable over the period of time I've owned it.

Burton LeGeyt · #12 08-07-2014, 04:28 PM

I've built some without an adjustable rod. If I built a guitar for myself I would do it this way-

I like Bruce's comments, they echo what I feel. It takes making a couple and paying close attention to predict what will likely happen on the next one. I've spent some time working on small details to make it even more stable/predictable.

In terms of David's comment, it is not for everyone. I wouldn't build a spec guitar without an adjustable rod but for the person who understands what it is I think the solid neck has some subtle advantages in terms of feel and tone.

murrmac123 · #13 08-07-2014, 05:12 PM

The PRS Martin Simpson and Tony McManus Signature models do not have adjustable trussrods.

Tony says that the guitar has never needed adjustment in all the time he has used it (well over a year, maybe two years) and he probably plays in more diverse environments than any other professional guitarist.

Having heard the instrument close-up, unamplified, I can vouch for the fact that it lacks nothing in the tone department ... so it's not like it's overbuilt.

PeteCady · #14 08-07-2014, 07:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dberkowitz

Even the new Rainsong Al Pettaway model I played last week has a truss rod. Rainsong's reason for using one is the ability to adjust the relieve based on playing style -- if you have a light touch you don't need much relief, but if you lay into the guitar, you'd need more.

It really is a fools errand to buy a guitar without one.

I just checked the sales slip - I bought my Rainsong OM, with the original neck with no truss rod, seven years ago yesterday (at Elderly, when we went quite a ways out of our way to visit there, while driving from VT to MT). Seven years of playing it almost exclusively for gigs, parties, and anything else that involved taking it out of the house. It sounds better than the inexpensive wood guitars, and is much less risky to travel with than the expensive ones. In that time, the action has never changed. It started as low as the action on a guitar could be, without buzzing when played with my "technique," and it's stayed that way in every variation of temperature and humidity that Vermont can produce, at least through my gig two nights ago. I think it's among the smartest musical purchase I've made. Since you state that my buying it was a "fool's errand," you might explain just why.

Bruce Sexauer · #15 08-07-2014, 07:33 PM

David Berkowitz may have overstated his case, but I know what he means. It IS a can of worms to get the set up perfect, and can mean rethinking the geometry and refretting after changing the shape of the fingerboard, which is doubly challenging if the guitar is in Rhode Island and the luthier is in California; this is NOT hypothetical. The good news is that if the wood is stable and the carbon fiber well glued in, there is no reason to ever have to adjust it again . . . unless the customer decides to use mediums when the set up was done with lights, or any of the other variations on that theme. This is what David is talking about, I believe.