NGD - Yamaha FS5

[Dbone]

Originally Posted by Martin_F

Yea, I noticed that line in the photo too. That is the joint in the wood where the neck meets the heel of the guitar. It's a small line that shows up because the way the finish went on and the two different pieces of wood. It's ok. In person it doesn't really show.

If this were a gloss finish, you probably wouldn't notice that. However, if this were a gloss finish you would definitely notice the other blemish much easier!



I agree. If it were in the wood, I am ok with that. Wood blemishes are the character of a natural product, within reason of course. I will most likely end up returning this guitar and seeing if they can get me another one. If they can't, I'll think about what I want to do.



Your story of the car is very true! I agree with you that once you put marks in things there is less stress. I just hate to pay good money and feel like I am settling. It's a beautiful guitar, but I even thought to just get the Martin instead at double the price if it didn't have a blemish! I think we humans have some odd thinking sometimes.

It kinda sucks when your new guitar day was fretting over a blemish!

Martin

LOL Don’t think that you will necessarily get a blemish free Martin just because you are paying. I have looked at a lot of those and most I’ve seen have problems/blemishes. Not all, but a lot. It surprises me every time for guitars that expensive. I know, it’s the sound that matters yada yada yada...That seems to be the mantra around here...If that’s all that matters to some then good for them. If I’m spending 3k - 6k on a guitar you can be darn sure both the sound quality and build quality will be present.

I mentioned one of my shopping experiences one time on here with Martin quality control problems and the Martin defenders came out in droves not liking my comments etc...That’s fine...I deal in reality, and I’m the same with any product from any manufacturer. If a product is “not up to snuff” relative to what I paid for it I will say so. If my recent Yamaha LL56 had come in a mess I would have been completely transparent about it for the benefit of others on here. Products at the prices we’re paying for some of these things should be as expected...new...

If you go the Martin route, I think it would be ideal if you could try before you buy. They can be really inconsistent in both sound and build quality in my experience. Take my opinion/experience for what it is worth.

[Dbone]

I’m sure this whole Yamaha thing will work out just fine, but in case you go in a different direction there is always Boucher to consider as well. Amazing high end guitars made in Quebec in the event you’re not familiar. If you’re considering Martin money they would be good to at least consider. Every Boucher that I’ve ever picked up has been flawless and sounded amazing. Collings level flawless for finishing.

Give this a watch when you have a chance:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9_puIWsSEs0

[Martin_F]

Originally Posted by Dbone

If you go the Martin route, I think it would be ideal if you could try before you buy. They can be really inconsistent in both sound and build quality in my experience. Take my opinion/experience for what it is worth.

I completely agree. I tried a bunch of 000-18's recently, as I was tossing it up between the FS5 and the Martin. A couple of the Martin's I played were real dogs, some others were very nice ones with a great sound.

I don't bash Martin, because I also love Martin guitars. I just don't know how they get away using some of the wood for top's that they use. A lot of the guitars tend to have very inconsistent grains.

I come from the classical guitar world and no one would ever buy a classical with the kind of top that comes on some steel string guitars, not just Martin. People tend to be much more particular with classical guitars. More people are into individual luthier instruments too, over the more factory made guitars. Seems like very different worlds!

That being said, I would still buy a Martin as long as the top was ok and I had tried it.

Martin

[Beakybird]

Yamaha normally puts a blem designation on guitars that have blemishes. I bought a blem CSF3M a few years ago that I sold. I couldn't find anything wrong with it. It was quite a lot cheaper if I recall.
I would ask to exchange it or get a discount. Not a big deal though.

[Dbone]

Originally Posted by Martin_F

I completely agree. I tried a bunch of 000-18's recently, as I was tossing it up between the FS5 and the Martin. A couple of the Martin's I played were real dogs, some others were very nice ones with a great sound.

I don't bash Martin, because I also love Martin guitars. I just don't know how they get away using some of the wood for top's that they use. A lot of the guitars tend to have very inconsistent grains.

I come from the classical guitar world and no one would ever buy a classical with the kind of top that comes on some steel string guitars, not just Martin. People tend to be much more particular with classical guitars. More people are into individual luthier instruments too, over the more factory made guitars. Seems like very different worlds!

That being said, I would still buy a Martin as long as the top was ok and I had tried it.

Martin

Oh for sure. I’m generally not a Martin fan, but I recently played one on a guitar shopping trip (a D18 by memory). Admittedly it blew my mind pretty good. It was one of the best I played on that day for sure, and it was pretty darn flawless.

[Cool555]

Originally Posted by Martin_F

Yesterday, not expecting it so early, my Yamaha FS5 arrived. The guitar was cold so I brought it in and let it warm up for a while before opening it up at night. Given that I was tired, I just tuned it up and played a few chords and let it sit.

If you have never had a brand new guitar from the box that has never really been played, those first few chords make you nervous! The guitar sounded horrible! What had I gotten myself in to? But, don't fret too much. Tune it up and play a few chords. Then let it sit and get acclimatized to the world of being in tune. It's still not an instrument when it comes out of that box unplayed: it's a box with some strings on it! I have had a few very new guitars and they all have had this phenomenon when first opened.

Anyways, I let it sit and then opened the case in the morning and tried a few notes: there it was! We now have a guitar on our hands! So far, I am very impressed. I am sure that it has not finished developing it's sound, as it will take at least a few days. But boy, has the sound changed since those first chords. It's full and lush. Very impressive!

So what is the sound like SO FAR: very nice and definitely worth the price. For less than half of what a 000-18 would be, I got this guitar. Does it sound like the 000-18? No, it doesn't. The 000-18 is, I believe, lighter built. However, it does share some characteristic sounds of a small-bodied Mahogany guitar --- it's not so far off that you would say it sounds completely different, but not so close as to be the same guitar. It retains that classic tone, but so far I would say that it has more overtones and is more lush sounding than a 000-18. So, I wouldn't say it sounds better than a 000-18, but different. My impression so far is that it is something of a mix between the classic tone of a 000-18 and a more modern guitar. Likely the overtones and overall sound has more to do with the build, the sides in the guitar are braced, which likely makes the box more rigid than some guitars. This should serve to make the guitar project a little better.

Of course, Yamaha uses very good woods. The top has a very nice grain. The mahogany is well done and has a nice colour to it. Everything seems pretty perfect: EXCEPT!

The good is that I love the sound. It plays nice. The action has been done quite good from the factory. The guitar looks understated, which I enjoy. I'm not into a flashy guitar.

The bad is that there is a small blemish. I'm one of those people who hates blemishes in my guitars. Mentally I know that it doesn't affect it at all. But, it's a blemish that I will always see because it's on the neck heel, right where you look! It's a small indentation that was manufactured into the guitar and it looks like they tried to sand it out and just made it look a little worse. So, I'm still deciding what to do. Given that I love the sound, I would like to keep the guitar. But, I am one of those guys who will never stop looking at that mark!

Some pics!





The Blemish:



So, what does everyone think? Return? Ask for another? Keep it?

I think this guitar will only get better with time and it already sounds pretty amazing. It sounds much more lively than my Martin 000-15m, which I already really enjoyed. Of course, they sound much different so it's hard to compare those two guitars. I really enjoy the contrast between them!

Martin

Congrats on getting your Yamaha FS5. I’m quite anal too when it comes to imperfections on the guitar. But considering how long it takes for a FS5 to reach you and how rare it is in Canada, I would just hope for some cash back to pacify me a little more. What if the next FS5 had a bigger imperfection than the tiny depression on the heel?

I think I could live with that small imperfection taking into consideration that you actually really like the tone of this guitar. You actually described the tone of this guitar very similar to how I would describe the tone of my FS5...lots of overtones and very lush! I think I was the first poster (NGD for these Red Label MIJ guitars) in May 2019. These Yamaha guitars are more easily available in Singapore, where I’m from.

Almost every guitar (bought new) that I own, except for the Dread Junior 2, had some very minor imperfection that I only noticed a few days after I brought them home. I thought my FS5 was perfect when I inspected and played it at the GC. But after a few days, I realised there was a very minor scratch that can only be seen when light was shone at the guitar at a certain angle. So I lowered my expectations to owning a flawless guitar.

Anyway, it’s your decision what you plan to do after the guitar centre replies you. The above is just my personal opinion and 2 cents.

Regarding the FS5’s tone, I’m actually surprised at how warm it sounds and the lush overtones it has. It has an impressive aged tone that I think has a lot to do with the A.R.E. (torrefied) Sitka top. I used to own a LS16 (A.R.E.) with Rosewood b/s but it sounded bright and did not have the warmth of the FS5. Its top was Englemann Spruce. So I actually think that the A.R.E. used on Yamaha guitars do actually vary from one model to another. Probably the type/quality of wood used varies too depending on the cost. Having said all these, they are still great value guitars. Like you, I chose to get my FS5 over a 00-18.

All the best in whatever you decide!

[jkilgour2000]

Keep it, if it sounds good. As for the blemish, fuhgettaboutit

[Martin_F]

Perhaps this guitar was not meant to be!

Martin

[TNO]

If you think you could be happy with the blemish and a small refund I would consider keeping it considering the current situation.

[Wellington]

Ding’s, marks and scratches don’t bother me, or most blemishes but for some reason that one would drive me bonkers.
BUT, if I got a half decent partial refund I’d live with it lol

[Matts67]

Love my FSX5. I've recently had a 000-18GE, CEO-7, and OM-28MD...they're all sold and this FSX5 is my new small body "couch" guitar for when I don't feel like playing my D-18 or Taylor 717. I don't feel that it lacks anything compared to my Martins, and the setup from the factory was better than any professional setup I've had done. The nut and saddle heights and neck relief are set to absolute perfection - it's almost too easy to play. This guitar is a definite GAS killer as I just can't justify spending 3x the price on another Martin with how good this thing is.

Like you, I also thought it sounded like crap out of the box. Best thing I did was remove the Elixir 80/20s. I currently have it strung with GHS Americana Lights and they sound fantastic. Going to try some D'Addario XT PB or Nickle Bronze lights next.

[Dbone]

Originally Posted by Martin_F

Perhaps this guitar was not meant to be!

Martin

?

What did L&M say?!?

[Beakybird]

Originally Posted by Matts67

Love my FSX5. I've recently had a 000-18GE, CEO-7, and OM-28MD...they're all sold and this FSX5 is my new small body "couch" guitar for when I don't feel like playing my D-18 or Taylor 717. I don't feel that it lacks anything compared to my Martins, and the setup from the factory was better than any professional setup I've had done. The nut and saddle heights and neck relief are set to absolute perfection - it's almost too easy to play. This guitar is a definite GAS killer as I just can't justify spending 3x the price on another Martin with how good this thing is.

Like you, I also thought it sounded like crap out of the box. Best thing I did was remove the Elixir 80/20s. I currently have it strung with GHS Americana Lights and they sound fantastic. Going to try some D'Addario XT PB or Nickle Bronze lights next.

I'm so happy for you! Hopefully, one of these is in my future to nest between my OO and dread. I can't wait to play one of these!

[sstaylor58]

That’s a beautiful guitar and a very small blemish. The sound should be the driver in your decision, but I know things like that can nag at you. I got my Taylor (used) and it has a small dent right in the lower front. At first all I could do is see it, now, because it plays so well and sounds so good, I don’t even notice it anymore. You could also add a strap pin there! . Good luck with whatever you decide to do.

[Martin_F]

The place I got it offered a 5% discount or to exchange the guitar. But, they don’t seem to be in too much of a hurry to get me a new one. I bought this guitar to play while I am home more during this current crisis. It is looking like I won’t have another one for a while. It’s soured me on the experience. I do love the sound of the guitar though. I just don’t appreciate the service so far. Took just under a week to get an email back.

I am calling a little bit of a failure on this guitar so far. I don’t want to tie up my money and still not have a guitar. If I can’t get it fast, I might talk to them about just returning and I will buy elsewhere.

Martin