Black Angel Piezo

[GuildF20Guy]

Has anyone tried this as a stand alone pickup? Opinions? Thx!

[Nick84]

It’s just a shadow nanoflex UST

[Cuki79]

Originally Posted by Nick84

It’s just a shadow nanoflex UST

Are you sure?

They look fairly different...

Black Angel piezo:


Shadow nanoflex UST

[martingitdave]

I've wanted to try one of these but haven't ordered one. They are to be installed on the bridge plate with hot hide glue. Looks and sounds like a good solution for a lot of us.

[Nick84]

Originally Posted by Cuki79

Are you sure?

They look fairly different...

Black Angel piezo:


Shadow nanoflex UST

They must have made their own since - the black Angel system used to have the soundhole and then the nanoflex UST

[Doug Young]

Originally Posted by Nick84

They must have made their own since - the black Angel system used to have the soundhole and then the nanoflex UST

Yes, in spite of the confusing name, the Black Angel Piezo is a sound board transducer, not a UST. I have not tried one, and it's a bit of a commitment, since it's supposed to be glued to your bridge plate with hide glue, if I recall. I think Mike Dawes was using it, as part of a dual source setup.

[GuildF20Guy]

Thanks for the replies. There are a lot of examples online of it being used as a dual source. Curious as to why hot hide glue vs other gluee?

[MrErikJ]

I gave it a try as, a few years back, everyone was crushing on the Black Angel mag. The piezo was OK, a little more natural than some SBT options but boomy and not quite enough treble. The mag had a nice clear sound but not particularly warm. They landed up not being for me as I prefer the Sunrise and Rare Earth.

[MrErikJ]

Originally Posted by Nick84

They must have made their own since - the black Angel system used to have the soundhole and then the nanoflex UST

You’re confusing it with the original Angel, the tortoise shell model, which can be purchased with a Shadow nanoflex. The Black Angel has only ever been available with the tongue-depressor style SBT. It’s ok.

[GuildF20Guy]

Originally Posted by MrErikJ

I gave it a try as, a few years back, everyone was crushing on the Black Angel mag. The piezo was OK, a little more natural than some SBT options but boomy and not quite enough treble. The mag had a nice clear sound but not particularly warm. They landed up not being for me as I prefer the Sunrise and Rare Earth.

Thank you. That’s the feedback i was hoping for.

[VinceM]

Hi - I'm a little late to this thread but I just posted a thread on this pickup (I'm blending it with the mag). There is a link to a livestream video I did earlier this week.

I think it sounds excellent and at this point I'm using a bit more of the piezo than the mag in the blend. Both pickups are very complimentary - each one seems to make up for the other's shortcomings.

Vince

Here's the link to my other thread (it's sinking like a ship haha)
https://www.acousticguitarforum.com/...d.php?t=609629

[MrErikJ]

Originally Posted by VinceM

Hi - I'm a little late to this thread but I just posted a thread on this pickup (I'm blending it with the mag). There is a link to a livestream video I did earlier this week.

I think it sounds excellent and at this point I'm using a bit more of the piezo than the mag in the blend. Both pickups are very complimentary - each one seems to make up for the other's shortcomings.

Vince

Here's the link to my other thread (it's sinking like a ship haha)
https://www.acousticguitarforum.com/...d.php?t=609629

Vince does get a lovely sound from his Black Angel setup and recently shared a livestream showcasing his most excellent playing and tone. The K&K preamp seems to work really well with it. I used a Pendulum (and probably overthought it) but just couldn’t get a sound I was pleased with. It was not a bad pickup at all but installed in my Yamaha LL16, I couldn’t get the warmth from the mag nor the brightness from the SBT I required. That’s only my experience and I may have fiddled with the preamp too much.

[VinceM]

Originally Posted by MrErikJ

Vince does get a lovely sound from his Black Angel setup and recently shared a livestream showcasing his most excellent playing and tone. The K&K preamp seems to work really well with it. I used a Pendulum (and probably overthought it) but just couldn’t get a sound I was pleased with. It was not a bad pickup at all but installed in my Yamaha LL16, I couldn’t get the warmth from the mag nor the brightness from the SBT I required. That’s only my experience and I may have fiddled with the preamp too much.

Thanks for the kind words on the playing and tone! I am really impressed with the K&K. Really nice workmanship. I previously had a PUTW belt clip and it was kind of a POS that I put up with for years. I liked that the K&K has a 1MOhm input impedance, which goes well with a mag. I called DiMarzio and they said the BA Piezo doesn't necessarily need a high input impedance either. In any case I think it is a small issue but I feel it is a smoother sound with less high frequency spikey stuff. The main thing for me is the short cable out from my endpin to the preamp. It definitely makes a difference compared to running a long cable to the Solstice.

I was also surprised the K&K had quite a decent ability to independently EQ each source via internal bass, mid, and treble trim pots.

I am also finding that with the dual source, the eq on the mag doesn't need to be so precise - at a 50/50 mix each source seems to covers its strengths and hides the weaknesses of the other. I think I am just scooping a bit of mids and highs on the mag and dropping the bass a bit on the piezo.

Like I said in the other post, in the near future I'll be making a more "proper" direct recording of the setup and will post the results.

[MrErikJ]

Originally Posted by VinceM

Thanks for the kind words on the playing and tone! I am really impressed with the K&K. Really nice workmanship. I previously had a PUTW belt clip and it was kind of a POS that I put up with for years. I liked that the K&K has a 1MOhm input impedance, which goes well with a mag. I called DiMarzio and they said the BA Piezo doesn't necessarily need a high input impedance either. In any case I think it is a small issue but I feel it is a smoother sound with less high frequency spikey stuff. The main thing for me is the short cable out from my endpin to the preamp. It definitely makes a difference compared to running a long cable to the Solstice.

I was also surprised the K&K had quite a decent ability to independently EQ each source via internal bass, mid, and treble trim pots.

I am also finding that with the dual source, the eq on the mag doesn't need to be so precise - at a 50/50 mix each source seems to covers its strengths and hides the weaknesses of the other. I think I am just scooping a bit of mids and highs on the mag and dropping the bass a bit on the piezo.

Like I said in the other post, in the near future I'll be making a more "proper" direct recording of the setup and will post the results.

I recently installed the Fishman Powertap Earth in my Guild OM and also find a 50/50 blend generally sounds best. You can't EQ each element without running it in stereo but when I've tested it in the mixer, I've EQ'd it the exactly same way (except for the bass cute on the piezo, which has a HPF built-in, it seems). I think I probably would've like the Black Angel pickups if I hadn't been using the Pendulum. The Pendulum was, without a doubt, a brilliant preamp but with fully parametric EQ...I spent so much time spinning knobs that I was never able to settle on something.

There's a good example of this in a Leo Kottke video on YouTube where the first half-hour is just him soundchecking and just adjusting his Pendulum and Sunrise ad infinitum. These days, you'll see Leo with his Sunrise running into a Baggs PADI.