Buegeleisen & Jacobson Serenader - solid or laminate top?

[the duck]

Hello,

I'm looking at a 1930's Buegeleisen & Jacobson Serenader for sale online. I've never seen one before (in-person or online), and didn't know if anyone here has enough experience with them to know whether they were typically solid or laminate tops? Any thoughts about or experiences with these guitars?

Thanks very much!

[Steve DeRosa]

By way of information B&J was a distribution outfit based in NYC who not only handled a number of established marques, but had instruments made for them as house-label items; as such they varied widely in materials and quality, but as a very general rule most of the prewar stuff (both flattop and archtop) would have been solid construction. FWIW Harmony used all-solid woods on all of its archtops (whether their own brand or a house label) through the end of USA production, with some of the upper-line instruments boasting carved tops - a bargain both then and now vis-a-vis their erstwhile Epiphone and Gibson entry-level competition - and inasmuch as they were very similar in appearance/features to the parent company's lineup (other than the headstock label) it's a near certainty that one of these would in fact be of solid-wood construction...

FYI there are some folks here who specialize in instruments of this type (I'm not one of them - but FWIW my first guitar was a pre-trussrod, all-solid-birch Harmony Broadway archtop so I do have some familiarity with the breed), and if you have access to photos I'm sure they'd be glad to offer assistance...

[the duck]

Thanks for the info Steve,
So you're saying all the USA Harmonys are solid tops? I didn't know that, and I've asked online sellers before who could only say they think it's solid, but aren't sure. I've never played a solid-top archtop, only the Godin 5th Avenue which I've really been enjoying.


I'm having difficulty posting a pic of the B&J archtop, but this is a link to the listing:


https://www.facebook.com/marketplace...5-eb2f36522856


I'm interested in getting a depression-era, solid-top archtop at some point; preferably a smaller body size, and am interested in the old Epiphones, but would certainly be interested in old Harmonys, SS Sterwarts, Regals, Slingerlands, Fischers etc. Small body, solid top and from the 1930's?


Thanks again! - Matt

[Dave Richard]

I think that B&J is a Kay-made guitar from the late '40's or '50's, based on the size and shape of the f-holes, and the size and shape of the block f-board inlays(rounded), and overall appearance. It could also be Harmony. Kay, to my knowledge, usually used laminates on top, back, and sides in the lower level instruments(post-war), while Harmony usually used solid woods, even if pressed, not carved. The tuners are post-war, but may be replacements.

I currently own five vintage Epiphones('30's and '40's), small and larger bodied, and have owned and repaired many more. Have you been able to play any vintage Epis? i have a FB page, David Richard Luthier, where I've posted numerous demo videos of these Epiphones, if you're interested.

Good luck with your hunt!

[the duck]

Thanks Dave,
I've looked at your fb page before - I think I found out about it through this forum. Very nice work on the restoration jobs! I haven't played the old Epiphones, just watched videos/listened to recordings, and really liked their sound. Thanks for the info on the solid tops, I didn't know the Harmonys were solid as you and Steve mentioned. I thought many of them (and the Kays, Silvertones etc.) were sometimes solid or laminate depending on the model - and often difficult to know with surety from sellers. I'm not too far away from you, about 2.5 hours SW I think. If you ever have a small-bodied, solid archtop, from the 1930's please let me know.

Thanks again for all the information!

[Steve DeRosa]

Originally Posted by the duck

...I've never played a solid-top archtop, only the Godin 5th Avenue which I've really been enjoying...

I'm interested in getting a Depression-era, solid-top archtop at some point; preferably a smaller body size, and am interested in the old Epiphones...

I've played a whole bunch of solid-top archtops (both new and vintage) over the last 60 years, owned a '46 Epiphone Blackstone and very early A-Series/white-label '47 Gibson L-7 (still with the desirable prewar script logo), and presently own a Godin 5th Avenue as my one-and-only acoustic archtop; cool little guitar BTW - everything the postwar student-level Harmony/Kay instruments aspired to be, with infinitely higher standards of QC and better tone/playability - and if Monsieur Robert ever decides to issue the recent 5th Avenue Jumbo (a loosely-based latter-day interpretation of the postwar Gibson ES-150/Epi Zephyr dual-duty concept) as a full-on acoustic I'm in...

Don't know how long the good times are going to last, but FYI the small-body postwar New York Epiphone acoustic archtops - Olympic, Zenith, Blackstone, Spartan, Ritz - are still an amazing bargain for a first-quality vintage comp-box, routinely selling for 20-30% less than their Gibson competitors; in addition, even the least expensive of them were produced with solid carved tops - something to remember before you shell out $1500+/- for a primo all-laminated Guild A-50 or $2K for a Gibson L-48 - and a good one can be an extremely versatile guitar, easily transcending its Big Band roots. Here's an example of Grady Martin's Tex-Mex influenced lead work on Marty Robbins' "El Paso," recorded with a small-body Epiphone - possibly the same circa 1953 Zenith Marty is playing in the live video clip from 1965:

[fpuhan]

Speaking of Harmony guitars, the brand has been revived and has released a small line of guitars that are getting great reviews (Tim Pierce LOVED the new Jupiter Thinline!). They have issued (re-issued?) a very affordable archtop, the H72 Reissue. Made in Korea, if you're in the market for a 335-style guitar without the price, this might be worth a look.

End thread hijack.

[Dave Richard]

[QUOTe: If you ever have a small-bodied, solid archtop, from the 1930's please let me know.

Do you mean smaller than 16"? Must it be from the '30's? I ask, because while the ‘30’s era guitars can be very fine, those from the ‘40’s(or later) can also be exceptional.

I know of a couple of excelent archtops that I think are available, and maybe a third. All three are guitars I know well.

1947 Epi Blackstone, 16-3/8" wide. Has the neck from a '41 Blackstone, 1-3/4" nut. Big sound, w/OHSC. Laminated back. As Steve DeRosa has written, Blackstones are among the best deals for a quality vintage archtop, and have a very fine sound(especially, IMO, the early postwar years).

!942 Epi Ritz, 15-1/2" wide. 1-5/8" nut. A feisty, spanky sounding firecracker of a guitar. Laminated back, wartime poplar top.

There are videos of these first two on my FB page: I previously owned them, and used them extensively with my band.

1959 Gibson L-48, 16" wide. Laminated top & back, and has a delightful sound, and the distinctive '59 Gibson neck carve.

The Epis are long scale, 25-1/4", and the Gibson is short scale, 24-3/4".

If you'd like more info, send me a PM.

Dave

[Steve DeRosa]

Originally Posted by fpuhan

Speaking of Harmony guitars, the brand has been revived and has released a small line of guitars that are getting great reviews...

FYI this is the second recent attempt at a revival, the first being several years ago with a line of MIK period-accurate late-50's thru mid-60's models (which unfortunately were overshadowed by the comparable-quality - and in some cases cheaper - Eastwood Airline series); one interesting (and now exceedingly rare) offering was a revived version of the mid-60's Harmony Broadway acoustic archtop, produced with an adjustable trussrod and solid pressed spruce/maple (rather than all-birch) construction, and @ $649 priced competitively with the erstwhile Godin 5th Avenue all-laminated comp box. Sorry I didn't pick one up while they were still available: the first guitar I owned was a non-trussrod Broadway that fell victim (as did most of them) to the ravages of Black Diamond strings - for those who don't know only slightly lighter than bridge cable - and I would've wanted one not only to see the improvements but for old-times' sake as well...

[the duck]

Thanks for all the information on the Epiphones and the Harmony revivals. I do very much enjoy my Godin and its sound - and it is certainly everything I need for my level of playing/ability (although I may try to add an inconspicuous pickup at some point just to hear its sound amplified - I have an active "electric habit", playing for fun with a local drummer).

My interest in the depression-era Epis stems in part from an interest in small-bodied parlor guitars, and because I enjoy the history/mileage that many of those guitars have "baked-in". The Olympics were quite small early on:
1932: 13″
1934: 13 5/8″
1935: 14 1/2″
1936: 15 1/4″

Small and old (and wanting to try a solid top) are where my primary interests are with acoustics I guess...? Thinking about engraving my Godin's tailpiece with a personal design in honor of some of those old school customizations from back in the day.

Merry Christmas everyone - Peace on earth, goodwill to all!

[the duck]

PS - Love Marty Robbins playing El Paso!