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Old 09-22-2020, 07:04 AM
Daniel Grenier Daniel Grenier is offline
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Default Play Acoustic into Reaper. What am I missing?

Windows 10 laptop w/Reaper (Ver 6.14) and Play Acoustic USB-connected to it.

Two tracks created. One left (voice), one right (guitar). Play Ac Output set up as "Voice/Guitar" to separate left & right (which they are when monitored).

Problem is, Reaper does not isolate left+right. It records the voice and/or the guitar on both tracks as opposed to the voice on left and guitar on right track.

What am I missing??? Thanks
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Old 09-22-2020, 07:50 AM
Rudy4 Rudy4 is offline
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Originally Posted by Daniel Grenier View Post
Windows 10 laptop w/Reaper (Ver 6.14) and Play Acoustic USB-connected to it.

Two tracks created. One left (voice), one right (guitar). Play Ac Output set up as "Voice/Guitar" to separate left & right (which they are when monitored).

Problem is, Reaper does not isolate left+right. It records the voice and/or the guitar on both tracks as opposed to the voice on left and guitar on right track.

What am I missing??? Thanks
Don't record as a stereo track. Set your preferences up to record as two mono inputs.

Does the PA function as a USB interface that's capable to transferring the isolated guitar and vocal (left/right) signal to your DAW? I'm not familiar with the hardware, but Reaper will be capable of recording the two as isolated inputs provided the PA hardware device acts as an interface and whatever drivers it uses handle the "traffic" accordingly.

Otherwise, the two XLR outputs would need to port to a dedicated USB interface to do the A/D conversion and interface with your DAW.

Last edited by Rudy4; 09-22-2020 at 08:07 AM.
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Old 09-22-2020, 08:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel Grenier View Post
Windows 10 laptop w/Reaper (Ver 6.14) and Play Acoustic USB-connected to it.

Two tracks created. One left (voice), one right (guitar). Play Ac Output set up as "Voice/Guitar" to separate left & right (which they are when monitored).

Problem is, Reaper does not isolate left+right. It records the voice and/or the guitar on both tracks as opposed to the voice on left and guitar on right track.

What am I missing??? Thanks
I don't use a Play Acoustic or Reaper so just making general observations I did look at the Play Acoustic manual

It sounds like a routing problem i.e. somewhere the separate mono signals are getting summed together
I would guess :

First the Play Acoustic manual was a bit vague BUT said something about selecting either stereo or mono ,,,so am I correct in assuming you have mono selected ? If not then try that, or if you do have mono selected try stereo panned hard L and R and see if that works

If not then Either the USB output is internally summing the L & R (regardless of the mono stereo selection switch and is not the same as what the audio outputs are doing ) So it is not really passing discrete L &R mono signals via USB,,, to the computer/Reaper even though it is still separate in the Audio outs of the Play Acoustic itself ?

I did try Reaper' 60 day trial and
Reaper is fully capable of passing discrete mono signals (if it is actually receiving them via the inputs ) Unless you have inadvertently summed them in Reaper

Question :: In the Reaper I/O matrix does it show two separate mono inputs one L , and one R or 1, 2 coming from the Play Acoustic USB in ?

Perhaps you can post some screen shots of the I/O in Reaper and the mixer view as well
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Last edited by KevWind; 09-22-2020 at 08:29 AM.
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  #4  
Old 09-22-2020, 08:29 AM
Chipotle Chipotle is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel Grenier View Post
Windows 10 laptop w/Reaper (Ver 6.14) and Play Acoustic USB-connected to it.

Two tracks created. One left (voice), one right (guitar). Play Ac Output set up as "Voice/Guitar" to separate left & right (which they are when monitored).

Problem is, Reaper does not isolate left+right. It records the voice and/or the guitar on both tracks as opposed to the voice on left and guitar on right track.
I don't know how the Play Acoustic works, or whether Reaper will recognize it as two separate inputs, or just one stereo. What is your input selection on the track in Reaper?

You may be recording in stereo on both tracks. In that case, you need to take one of the tracks and explode it into two mono tracks to separate them.

It's also possible that for some reason Windows 10 itself thinks the USB input is mono. Go to the device settings in Windows and make sure the Play Acoustic is appearing as a stereo device and there isn't some "mono" setting checked somewhere.
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Old 09-22-2020, 12:58 PM
MikeBmusic MikeBmusic is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel Grenier View Post
Windows 10 laptop w/Reaper (Ver 6.14) and Play Acoustic USB-connected to it.

Two tracks created. One left (voice), one right (guitar). Play Ac Output set up as "Voice/Guitar" to separate left & right (which they are when monitored).

Problem is, Reaper does not isolate left+right. It records the voice and/or the guitar on both tracks as opposed to the voice on left and guitar on right track.

What am I missing??? Thanks
What does Reaper show as input device? Does it give you two input channels of choice?
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Old 09-22-2020, 02:35 PM
Daniel Grenier Daniel Grenier is offline
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To clarify, Reaper's input options for the Play Acoustic are left, right, or stereo. The Play Acoustic has 2 outputs - voice and guitar - which can be output as Stereo, (summed) Mono or hard left (voice) and hard right (guitar).

Reaper's 2 tracks are set as left input (voice) and right input (guitar) respectively (not stereo) but, as mentioned, it records both L & R on each track as opposed to voice left and guitar right.
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Old 09-22-2020, 04:30 PM
Chipotle Chipotle is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel Grenier View Post
To clarify, Reaper's input options for the Play Acoustic are left, right, or stereo. The Play Acoustic has 2 outputs - voice and guitar - which can be output as Stereo, (summed) Mono or hard left (voice) and hard right (guitar).

Reaper's 2 tracks are set as left input (voice) and right input (guitar) respectively (not stereo) but, as mentioned, it records both L & R on each track as opposed to voice left and guitar right.
When you choose the input in Reaper, you get 4 choices in the first menu: Mono, Stereo, MIDI or None. Then you can choose from those the actual inputs from your interface. For example, on my Focusrite 2i2 with two inputs, I can choose "Mono > Input 1", "Mono > Input 2", or "Stereo > Input 1/Input 2".

What are your Reaper input selection options on a track with the Play Acoustic hooked up?

EDIT: Looking at the TC PA manual, try changing the Output parameters. It says they affect the XLR outputs, but maybe they affect the USB as well? Try "Vocal/Guitar(DI)" to see if you get separate channels for vox & guitar.

(BTW, a Google search turned up a thread you made here in December. Did you have it working then?)

Last edited by Chipotle; 09-22-2020 at 04:37 PM.
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Old 09-22-2020, 05:06 PM
Fran Guidry Fran Guidry is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel Grenier View Post
To clarify, Reaper's input options for the Play Acoustic are left, right, or stereo. The Play Acoustic has 2 outputs - voice and guitar - which can be output as Stereo, (summed) Mono or hard left (voice) and hard right (guitar).

Reaper's 2 tracks are set as left input (voice) and right input (guitar) respectively (not stereo) but, as mentioned, it records both L & R on each track as opposed to voice left and guitar right.
Are you panning the tracks in REAPER? Right click the level button on the track control panel, shove one all the way to the left. Right click the other one and shove the pan all the way to the right.

There are probably about 15 ways to do the panning but this one should work. After you have the tracks hard panned you might decide to adjust the panning a bit toward each other.

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Old 09-24-2020, 11:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel Grenier View Post
To clarify, Reaper's input options for the Play Acoustic are left, right, or stereo. The Play Acoustic has 2 outputs - voice and guitar - which can be output as Stereo, (summed) Mono or hard left (voice) and hard right (guitar).

Reaper's 2 tracks are set as left input (voice) and right input (guitar) respectively (not stereo) but, as mentioned, it records both L & R on each track as opposed to voice left and guitar right.
Understanding that Communication can be very hard on the internet.

Do you know how to do screen shots and post them here ?
and or you might want to list your entire signal chain., starting with mics to monitoring



And you say you are getting separate L &R when "monitoring". Monitoring what and where exactly ? There are usually four options for monitoring the actual signal chain Are you monitoring for example the (input) of the Play Ac. ? The analog output of the Play Ac. ? The input into Reaper or the Output in reaper ?

When you say Reaper "Records both L & R " on both tracks,,,, Does that mean
it is showing a dual waveforms on each track ( like on a stereo track ) or does that mean it is showing one waveform but it sounds summed ? Try panning as suggested and also muting one track at a time

Or (assuming you using 2 mics ) are you perhaps getting bleed into both tracks ?
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  #10  
Old 09-25-2020, 07:08 AM
Daniel Grenier Daniel Grenier is offline
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Well, it's like this: I was under the assumption that the USB Output of the Play Acoustic going direct to DAW would/should follow the actual SetUps within the Play (i.e stereo, mono, Voice/Guitar). After some more fiddling, it is now obvious that the USB only outputs a summed mono signal no matter the output setting of the Play Ac.

That is both unexpected and, frankly, unintuitive. Anyways, thanks for your replies.
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Old 09-25-2020, 08:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel Grenier View Post
Well, it's like this: I was under the assumption that the USB Output of the Play Acoustic going direct to DAW would/should follow the actual SetUps within the Play (i.e stereo, mono, Voice/Guitar). After some more fiddling, it is now obvious that the USB only outputs a summed mono signal no matter the output setting of the Play Ac.

That is both unexpected and, frankly, unintuitive. Anyways, thanks for your replies.
Yes I wondered about that in my earlier post (#3), because the user manual does not really clarify that. And that is the problem with a lot of the less expensive multi channel board mixers that offer 2 channel USB out. Bummer

The good news there are a number of two channel less expensive ($200 to $400) Digital interfaces that do offer discrete 2 channel/and more , USB out. That may even have a bit better mic pre's and converters than the TC
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Old 09-25-2020, 11:25 AM
MikeBmusic MikeBmusic is offline
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Good to know that about the PA. I only ever used mine using the separate XLR guitar and mic outputs into my Focusrite interface. I wish the PA had a better 'mixer' section - it has only a volume control for the guitar, not the mic, and no EQ.
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Old 09-25-2020, 02:24 PM
Rudy4 Rudy4 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel Grenier View Post
Well, it's like this: I was under the assumption that the USB Output of the Play Acoustic going direct to DAW would/should follow the actual SetUps within the Play (i.e stereo, mono, Voice/Guitar). After some more fiddling, it is now obvious that the USB only outputs a summed mono signal no matter the output setting of the Play Ac.

That is both unexpected and, frankly, unintuitive. Anyways, thanks for your replies.
You might try contacting the PA manufacturer. There should be no reason why it can't output a 2 channel signal other than the firmware it uses. Some manufacturers take user suggestions and modify to more appropriately meet user needs with updated firmware revisions.

Do check the website to see if there's a firmware upgrade that's already addressed this. Firmware updates are free and usually fairly easy to do.

A mono only usb signal is just plain silly on their part.
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Old 09-29-2020, 12:07 AM
silvercn silvercn is offline
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I had the Play Acoustic and now, switched to the Boss VE 8 Acoustic Singer. For sure on the VE 8,the USB out to my computer/ DAW is a summed mono signal, despite the XLR L&R outs which can be set to have guitar on L and Vocal on R, for lines out to a mixer and or PA. No matter the signal coming into a Daw (in my case Sonar Professional, now Cakewalk by BandLab, free), the input/ drop down choices will be R, L, or Stereo. The USB cable in this case is not carrying L and R guitar /vocal separated. It is lame though that it's not designed to be a multi channel signal!!! I suppose the XLRs directly to an interface with separate guitar and vocal should work.
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Old 09-29-2020, 08:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rudy4 View Post
You might try contacting the PA manufacturer. There should be no reason why it can't output a 2 channel signal other than the firmware it uses. Some manufacturers take user suggestions and modify to more appropriately meet user needs with updated firmware revisions.

Do check the website to see if there's a firmware upgrade that's already addressed this. Firmware updates are free and usually fairly easy to do.

A mono only usb signal is just plain silly on their part.
While I don't know for sure, but for example "IF" for cost saving, they simply sum the analog L&R channels and only put one channel of A/D conversion in the unit , then split that summed digital signal going into the USB out ? in which case a firmware revision would not help . I agree contacting the Mfg to get first hand conformation one way or the other makes sense

Otherwise my guess is, as "silvercn" suggested going to a two channel interface may be the best way to get discrete L & R into the computer
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