Need Help. Looking for Koa tuner buttons for Martin OEM closed back tuners

[Guitartanzon]

Bought a martin ooo-12e koa. Looking for Koa wood tuner buttons, Do not know what the OEM closed back they are, Ping? Shaller?, Grover Rotomatic, ???I have no idea. There is not marking on them.

Anyone know what make tuners martin is using on the current road series guitars?

[colins]

Don't have particular experience with your model, but my go to people for tuner buttons are:

Bill Wise - https://www.charisacoustic.com/charis-tuner-buttons

Stewmac - https://www.stewmac.com/parts-and-ha...s/tuner-parts/

[Wade Hampton]

Originally Posted by Guitartanzon

Bought a martin ooo-12e koa. Looking for Koa wood tuner buttons, Do not know what the OEM closed back they are, Ping? Shaller?, Grover Rotomatic, ???I have no idea. There is not marking on them.

Anyone know what make tuners martin is using on the current road series guitars?

Martin just describes them as "Chrome Enclosed Gears." They're definitely not Grovers or Gotohs, and they're even less likely to be Schallers. The chances are that they're Pings or something similar.

There don't seem to be any regular suppliers of aftermarket tuner buttons for Pings. And it does make a difference, because all the various tuner brands have different shapes to their button shafts. So there's no "one size fits all" solution you can turn to, not if you want to maintain any tuner accuracy. Those "fits all brands" buttons have oversized holes, so they'll fit onto everything. But - boy howdy! - are they sloppy. They'll totally degrade your ability to get precisely in tune.

If I had my heart set on putting nice wooden tuner buttons on your guitar, I would simply upgrade the tuners to Gotoh minis and then get the buttons I wanted.

The best reasonably priced sources I've found for aftermarket tuner buttons are Allparts and Reverb.com. Charis has some, but they're slightly expensive at $49.00 a set.

Reverb.com doesn't have any koa buttons for Gotoh tuners at the moment. Nor does Allparts.

Two things I should mention is that

1. I habitually swap out stock metal buttons for aftermarket buttons, both for looks but also to cut weight;

and

2. I've seen koa buttons on some other folks' guitars, but they don't look as good as I would want or would ever buy.

Don't get me wrong, I love koa as either the primary tonewood for the back and sides or as an accent wood for binding. But the koa tuner buttons I've seen have all been surprisingly murky- and grubby-looking.

Part of the problem, I suspect, is that if unfinished (which is what I prefer for wooden buttons) they get skin oils and grime built up on them and ground into the wood pores through use. But even with a coat of lacquer on them, they don't seem as elegant as koa normally does.

That might be just my take on them and you'll love them once you get them.

But one suggestion I would make is that you consider using snakewood buttons as well:

˙˙˙

Snakewood has more naturally occurring oils in it than koa, and its colors blend nicely with both koa back and sides and with rosewood headstock veneers. I've got snakewood buttons on a couple of instruments, one of them koa, and they look as elegant several years later as they did when brand new.

It's all a matter of personal preference, of course, but I thought I would mention snakewood as a possible viable alternative to koa buttons.

Just a thought...

The main question is whether you want to replace what are probably perfectly functional mystery brand tuners for some Gotohs or Schallers so you can put wooden aftermarket buttons on them. Because you'll probably need to do that.

One thing you can do before you make that decision is to call Martin's toll-free customer service number at 1 (888) 433-9177 during East Coast business hours on Monday and ask to speak to a product specialist who's familiar with their current Road Series guitars. Then tell whoever you speak to what guitar you have and just ask him or her what brand the tuners are so you can find aftermarket buttons for them.

I've found that these customer service folks come in two varieties: as helpful as they have to be, but no more, and those smarter, friendlier ones who will tell you whatever they know.

With luck, you'll get the latter.

If not they'll say: "They're 'Chrome Enclosed Gears,' that's all I can tell you." At that point I think I'd call back the next day in hopes of getting a different customer service rep.

But they just might not know, too. So call and find out what you CAN glean from them before you proceed with getting any aftermarket buttons.

Hope this helps.


Wade Hampton Miller

[Guitartanzon]

Thanks Wade. Appreciate the info.

[Wade Hampton]

Happy to help. Let us know what, if anything, Martin Customer Service tells you about the tuners. You've got me curious now, too.


whm

[Guitartanzon]

I am going to look at some Gotoh tuners. I may send you a link to get your opinion. I like the cosmo black ones I think.

[Wade Hampton]

Sure, that’ll be fine.


whm

[colins]

Originally Posted by Guitartanzon

I am going to look at some Gotoh tuners. I may send you a link to get your opinion. I like the cosmo black ones I think.

Gotoh 510s in cosmo black and with koa buttons? Just got them on my new Baranik 00 and am very happy with them:







Mike does custom buttons as part of his build. The buttons on the other side are resin-infused burl.

[Wade Hampton]

Originally Posted by colins

Gotoh 510s in cosmo black and with koa buttons? Just got them on my new Baranik 00 and am very happy with them:

.

That headstock looks like a satellite photo of the ocean lapping up against an arid, mountainous coastline.

What’s the blue material he used? Is it Corian or some kind of reconstituted stone? It’s attractive, whatever it is.


whm

[colins]

Originally Posted by Wade Hampton

That headstock looks like a satellite photo of the ocean lapping up against an arid, mountainous coastline.

What’s the blue material he used? Is it Corian or some kind of reconstituted stone? It’s attractive, whatever it is.


whm

Well described Wade. Riorider thought so too and suggested I put a little arrow on it with the words “You are here”!

The blue part is resin with blue colouring and metallic flakes mixed into it. Mike cut a piece of burl down a bit, flooded it with the resin, then sanded it.

I commissioned this guitar because I really like the tone and playability of Mike’s guitars, but the build process was a huge lot of fun too - https://www.acousticguitarforum.com/...d.php?t=544744

And those Gotoh 510s are great tuners.

Col

[Wade Hampton]

I get it: you told him that you wanted a guitar headstock that looks like the coastline of Western Australia south of Perth, right? Either that or Yemen, maybe, SOME place with lots of camels and hot dry winds....

Seriously, it’s very striking.

I agree with you about the superb quality of those tuners. I have several sets on some of my instruments, too.


whm

[Guitartanzon]

Bought the Gotoh sg 301 6 pm hole position with locking mech.

I wonder if these koa buttons would fit?

https://reverb.com/item/2788713-tone...uner-buttons-6

[mercy]

headstock reminds me of a cow and calf with the shadow of a man. This is very artistic and of course unique but still within the confines of a guitar so I like the approach.

[drive-south]

That headstock is a Rorschach test. I see a babies hand holding an apple

[Wade Hampton]

Originally Posted by Guitartanzon

Bought the Gotoh sg 301 6 pm hole position with locking mech.

I wonder if these koa buttons would fit?

https://reverb.com/item/2788713-tone...uner-buttons-6

Any aftermarket tuner button for Gotoh will fit any current Gotoh sealed gear tuner*, the only holdup being if you need the right length of the clutch screws. A short clutch screw is needed for mini buttons and the longer clutch screw for the midsized and large tuners.

I have put full-sized buttons with Gotoh minis on both of my Martins because I think the full-sized buttons look best on Martin headstocks (plus the larger buttons are easier to grab.)

But I prefer the lighter weight of the mini tuners. So I mix and match.

About ten or twelve years ago I bought a large order of Gotoh clutch screws both long and short, in gold, nickel and black. They’re quite inexpensive and it cost me virtually nothing. I’m still working through them and have enough left for many guitars yet to come.

For those of you puzzled by what I mean by “clutch screws,” those are the screws that do double duty both keeping the buttons on the tuners and also regulating the tension of the tuner itself.

Vibrations from both playing and travel can loosen sealed gear tuners, but the clutch screw makes it possible for you to firm up any of them that get sloppy.

If any of you reading this have never adjusted the clutch screws on your tuners, the next time you have a chance to work with your guitar take the right size and style of screwdriver and go around and firm up each tuner that has any slop or play in it. Schallers and older US-made Grover Rotomatics require a straight blade screwdriver, while Asian-made Grovers and virtually all of the other brands use a phillipshead.

I find that it’s easiest to go around and firm up any tuners that need it when I change strings. You’re already working with the guitar, your tools are where you can reach them, and right after you put a fresh string on you firm up the tuner if necessary.

If you’ve never dialed in the tension on your tuners before, you might be surprised how much of an improvement in tuning accuracy that can make. Just don’t crank it down to where the tuner becomes difficult to turn because that causes premature wear on the tuner, shortening its usable lifespan.

Hope that makes sense.


Wade Hampton Miller

*Any current Gotoh guitar tuners. The buttons and shafts on Gotoh planetary banjo are larger, and the ones on their professional quality mandolin tuner sets aren’t for adjusting the tension, they just hold the buttons on.