Atypical string balance problem with undersaddle

[Aspiring]

I have an undersaddle pickup on my folding silent classical.

I've been playing it a lot due to covid. I had been noticing a relatively quiet 3&4 strings.

I decided to make a new saddle as it's a classical so relatively easy and I had a bone blank in about the right shape.

The new saddle was nice and square and flat sits nicely all that stuff forward tilt all good. Still the same problem. I can't check the slot easily as there is some kind of metal plate on top of the piezo element that won't come out easily but I did check that the metal plate was relatively flat and square.

Here is the weird part. Normally I've seen issues when the saddle is not making enough pressure at the particular string that has the problem.

Here I seem to have the opposite. If I manually loosen the 3rd string or use my fingers to take some of the string tension away on the 4th, the tone comes through loudly and balanced with the neighbouring strings. If I let it back down on the slot the volume noticeably and abruptly decreases almost sounding like crackling / short circuit.

Any ideas on what to look for?oh and I haven't been able to identify which pickup it is yet.

Thanks

[rmp]

have the same problem with a taylor, I used shielding tape, eg; the stuff that is a copper faced tape that you would shield the pickup cavities of electric guitars with,

I put a small slice of it it under the strings that are not as loud, helped a little.. still not perfect.

[Aspiring]

Interesting idea. I tried a slight variant on that. I put a full length strip under my saddle conductive adhesive side facing the piezo element and then put a small strip adhesive side against the saddle in the area that was low output. This combo seems to have majorly improved the situation. I don't seem to have the pressure induced cutout in that area anymore and the volume is close to balanced.

Originally Posted by rmp

have the same problem with a taylor, I used shielding tape, eg; the stuff that is a copper faced tape that you would shield the pickup cavities of electric guitars with,

I put a small slice of it it under the strings that are not as loud, helped a little.. still not perfect.

[rmp]

Interesting..

I may try your approach as I'm still not sure I can or can't improve it.

It is a bit annoying though isn't it?

My biggest complaint is the E and B (Treble) strings are more prominent. I can EQ it out a bit but cutting highs and pushing the bass.

I love the guitar, it plays great and acoustically it sounds very good.

but this issue, ugh.. not so much. considering just telling Taylor, "fix it".. it is under warranty and this would apply, I've already inquired on that aspect.

[Aspiring]

Right now mine has a still low output on the 4th string. I just broke the 5&6 during my last string and unstring and replaced them so it's possible I just need to replace the 4th string as well given that I have been fully tensioning and untensioning many times as I fiddle with this. The other thing I will try is adding a second small layer under the 4th string on the saddle. I feel like the copper tape fixed whatever intermittent conductivity problem I was having and now it's back to a regular string balance issue.

I hear youon the warranty. Mine is still under warranty as well but I'd have to ship it back to the UK to deal with as it's a small boutique folding guitar (eo classical). I've emailed them as he has been helpful in the past.

[rmp]

Good luck sorting it out, it's definitely something that once you hear it, you can't un-hear it...

There's a warranty place bout 45 minutes from me, and I've used the guy before, he seems to understand what to do, and the one who gave me the advice on the shieling after he did a setup, and he magaed to improve it slighting by flattening the saddle but still not "there".

I can get a repair ticket from Taylor and just drop it off once this Covid disaster has relented.

Maybe the builder of your guitar will have some additional advice that works. if so, post here and I will try likewise.

/ray

[Aspiring]

I added a couple strips of copper foil under the low volume strings in addition to the main strip and it balances out quite nicely. It will be interesting to see how long the foil holds up in the slot.

You are totally right for unhearing it. I also can see it. I'm feeding this guitar into an axe fx 3 with a nylon guitar impulse response as the output. Actually sounds great. As part of this I was setting up a parametric eq block as part of that I was using the rta block to analyse the input and it was visually very obvious that the string levels didn't match

Originally Posted by rmp

Good luck sorting it out, it's definitely something that once you hear it, you can't un-hear it...

There's a warranty place bout 45 minutes from me, and I've used the guy before, he seems to understand what to do, and the one who gave me the advice on the shieling after he did a setup, and he magaed to improve it slighting by flattening the saddle but still not "there".

I can get a repair ticket from Taylor and just drop it off once this Covid disaster has relented.

Maybe the builder of your guitar will have some additional advice that works. if so, post here and I will try likewise.

/ray

[phcorrigan]

I haven't tried this, but apparently a thin strip of Marblex self-hardening modeling clay under the saddle can help if the bottom of the saddle slot isn't flat. The other option is to fill and re-rout the slot. You can find a video on the StewMac site on how to do this.

I had a similar problem, and I solved it by replacing my UST with a JJB bridge plate pickup.

[Aspiring]

The Marblex is an interesting idea to consider. Right now I appear to have addressed the issue with the copper strips and then adjusting the pressure but the manufacturers suspicions are that the transducer is defective so he is sending me a replacement to try.

That alternative pickup looks like something interesting to try as well. Given that this is a silent guitar and the only output that matters is the pickup that looks like a potentially good alternative with less messing around.

Originally Posted by phcorrigan

I haven't tried this, but apparently a thin strip of Marblex self-hardening modeling clay under the saddle can help if the bottom of the saddle slot isn't flat. The other option is to fill and re-rout the slot. You can find a video on the StewMac site on how to do this.

I had a similar problem, and I solved it by replacing my UST with a JJB bridge plate pickup.

[Aspiring]

Just to close this out, the manufacturer sent me a new transducer and it did indeed behave differently and better when I used it to replace the original. String balance was on point without the foil strip shims and the overall noise floor improved too.

[rmp]

Originally Posted by Aspiring

Just to close this out, the manufacturer sent me a new transducer and it did indeed behave differently and better when I used it to replace the original. String balance was on point without the foil strip shims and the overall noise floor improved too.

great news.

I fixed my taylor (well I brought it to be done) about 2 months ago.

problem was the bottom of the saddle still wasn't true.

[Aspiring]

It's amazing how much difference that makes as well.

Glad you managed to get yours sorted as well.

Originally Posted by rmp

great news.

I fixed my taylor (well I brought it to be done) about 2 months ago.

problem was the bottom of the saddle still wasn't true.