Do dual-purpose Acoustic/Electric (magnetic) strings exist?

[louparte]

Is there a set of strings that will both project good unplugged acoustic tone and still be suitable for use with a magnetic pick-up?

I need to change strings on my archtop. But if I put on PB's, the guitar sounds great unplugged. But the strings create problems when I plug it in. If I put another set of electric strings on it - it will sound fine plugged in. But those strings don't do justice to how good and
loud the guitar sounds unplugged.

It's a dilemma.

[pbla4024]

Originally Posted by louparte

Is there a set of strings that will both project good unplugged acoustic tone and still be suitable for use with a magnetic pick-up?

I need to change strings on my archtop. But if I put on PB's, the guitar sounds great unplugged. But the strings create problems when I plug it in. If I put another set of electric strings on it - it will sound fine plugged in. But those strings don't do justice to how good and
loud the guitar sounds unplugged.

It's a dilemma.

Have you tried nickel?
http://www.daddario.com/DADProductDe...z_Light__12_51

[dkwvt]

I have found DR Zebra's acceptable. They have a nice fat acoustic sound and a "thick" electric sound out of a Seynour Duncan archtop humbucker. Good jazz/blues sound, I wouldn't shred with them...

Bear in mind that by being either/or you lose some of the best of both.

[louparte]

Maybe I'll try some of the .11's in pure nickel. How long do they last? I've been using EXP coated electric .10's. They last a long time. But PB .10's are fine for my guitar's acoustic volume. It's louder than a lot of arch-tops strung with .12's. Maybe I need to go up in gauge though, if I use electric strings. I'd like to have a bit more acoustic volume with electric strings.

Originally Posted by pbla4024

Have you tried nickel?
http://www.daddario.com/DADProductDe...z_Light__12_51

Originally Posted by dkwvt

I have found DR Zebra's acceptable. They have a nice fat acoustic sound and a "thick" electric sound out of a Seynour Duncan archtop humbucker. Good jazz/blues sound, I wouldn't shred with them...

Bear in mind that by being either/or you lose some of the best of both.

I didn't have good luck with the last batch of DR strings I bought. But they were for acoustic flat-top. I didn't use them on my arch-top and they were not that type.

I'll place an order for both suggestions though. Thanks for the ideas.

[Archtop Guy]

GHS White Bronze are marketed as dual purpose, exactly as you want. I like them and I use them on both of my archtops that have floating pickups.

In my opinion the marketing is still a bit of a stretch however. The "white bronze" (marketing talk) wrap on the wound strings is alloy 52, which is 48% iron and 52% nickel, so these guys are really an electric string. All plain strings, acoustic or electric, are steel. Plating is so thin that it makes no difference in magnetic characteristics.

Just for the record, the problem with acoustic strings is that the bronze (copper / tin) is not magnetic, so the PU only "sees" the steel core. It is possible to adjust the polepieces closer to the wound strings to compensate for most of the volume difference that results from that. I used acoustic strings for years on my L-5C and nobody but me ever noticed the slight string output imbalance!

[louparte]

Originally Posted by Archtop Guy

GHS White Bronze are marketed as dual purpose, exactly as you want. I like them and I use them on both of my archtops that have floating pickups.

In my opinion the marketing is still a bit of a stretch however. The "white bronze" (marketing talk) wrap on the wound strings is alloy 52, which is 48% iron and 52% nickel, so these guys are really an electric string. All plain strings, acoustic or electric, are steel. Plating is so thin that it makes no difference in magnetic characteristics.

Just for the record, the problem with acoustic strings is that the bronze (copper / tin) is not magnetic, so the PU only "sees" the steel core. It is possible to adjust the polepieces closer to the wound strings to compensate for most of the volume difference that results from that. I used acoustic strings for years on my L-5C and nobody but me ever noticed the slight string output imbalance!

I'll order some of those too. FWIW, I live outside the US and only go back once a year or so. This time, I'm going back to EXP PB .10's acoustic. I'll just live with the difference in output now. I'm not confident adjusting pole-pieces, especially since I'll eventually just go back to electric strings for recording.

Thanks. The GHS white bronze at least are aimed at what I'm trying to do - get strings that work well either way, plugged or unplugged.

FWIW, here's what it sounds like with EXP coated electric .10's. (I recorded it with my cell phone. It's both acoustic and low-volume amplified through a Roland AC60. That's not me playing.)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ncd6...5OQ3D3LZWA4z0Q

[dkwvt]

The common complaint about the Zebra's is the feel. The dual wrap is bothersome to some people although that is what makes them literally dual purpose. I am used to an orchestra setup, high action and 13's so they don't bother me at all.

Good luck...

[zippy]

just posted this on a similar thread. these strings sound great IMO either acoustic or electric.

I've been quite happy with John Pearse acoustic/electric strings (#2700 jazz mediums, .12-.52) they are nickel wound and sound great on my gretsch g100 with a floating HB.

JP also makes a nice pure nickel set which are also fine with pups.

cheers!

[Driver8]

I can recommend John Pearse pure nickel strings after using them for the past five years on flat-top acoustic guitars.
They wear extremely well,seem to be slightly softer in tension & of course work well with magnetic pick-ups.
I use the medium set 13-57 on my archtop & they have a lovely warm clear tone.

[scottishrogue]

I use D'Addario ECG24 XL Chrome flat wound nickel strings (Jazz Light .011-.050) on several of my acoustic-electric guitars, including 2 archtops, and whenever magnetic PUs are used. They sound best when using your amp. They sound a wee bit dark without the amp, yet quite passable.

Glen

[j3ffr0]

Michael Hedges used to use Nickle wound strings on his acoustic because of his mag pickup, and they sounded pretty good.

[campusfive]

I'll second the usual suspects for this particular problem: GHS White Bronze, DR Zebras, and Pure Nickel, especially the John Pearse "acoustic/electric" ones.

I actually did a bit of research about this problem historically, and realized there was a a missing link: Monel (aka Mona-Steel). It's not like there were specifically "acoustic" or "electric" strings before there were electric guitars, so I started trying to figure out what would have come on early electric guitars, like pre-war ES-150s. Bronze strings were not introduced until the mid 30's (1935 was the earliest mention that I found), so all those pre-advanced guitars had to have some kind of non-bronze string, and at least after 1930, that would have been Monel (or as it was branded by Gibson, Mona-Steel). The 1937 Gibson catalog (the one that introduced the ES-150) recommends Monel for their electric instruments. It's nickel-based so it's more magnetically responsive than bronze, though it's not as balanced as pure-nickel or something else. (Also worth noting, flatwound strings weren't introduced until the late 40's and didn't really become the thing until the early/mid 50's).

I wrote an article about it here: http://www.campusfive.com/swingguita...ng-guitar.html

Monel went out of production in the 70's, but Martin reintroduced it last year as the Tony Rice Signature set, only available in one guage (13-56, but the B, D and A are a bit light to my taste). It was successful enough that they recently added additional guages under the Martin "Retro" series (11's and 12's).

Having put the Tony Rice gauge Monels on both my Eastman 805 non-cut, and my pre-war ES-150 CC, I dig them. They are more focused and midrange-y than the 80/20 Martin SP's I usually keep on my 805, but still with an "acoustic" character I don't get from modern Nickel strings. I went back to the 80/20's for my 805 but, only because I don't use a pickup. If I needed to use my DeArmond Guitar Mic on it, I'd put the monels back on it.

On the ES-150 (with a notched B Charlie Christian pickup), I find they have a distinctive tone that matches Charlie's tone exactly. They do not balance perfectly, but the natural compression of my EH185 tends to even things out a bit - especially because the slight natural overdrive is part of that sound, especially on double-stops. I swap the high E from a 13 to a 14 plain string, and I leave the 16 gauge B string only because the B string doesn't need any help projecting electrically. The biggest surprise was how acoustically viable the guitar became with Monel's over D'Addario Pure Nickels. I use an Audio Technic AT831b on a gooseneck w/windscreen clamped to my tailpiece to amplify my Eastman, and trying this on my 150 worked surprisingly well. (I abhor electrified swing rhythm guitar).

Anyway, I've used all of the usual suspects, and I think it comes down to finding which one happens to match your guitar perfectly. Try each of them, and see what you like best. Just consider your self lucky that most sets of guitar strings cost under $10, and the few that cost more are only $20-25. String bass players usually have to spend $100+ a set to experiment. Yikes!

[Archtop Guy]

Campus Five (Jonathan?),

Great write up here and on your website. Thanks for the all the research and experience!

[campusfive]

Yup, that's me. Thanks very much!

[louparte]

Originally Posted by campusfive

I'll second the usual suspects for this particular problem: GHS White Bronze, DR Zebras, and Pure Nickel, especially the John Pearse "acoustic/electric" ones.

I actually did a bit of research about this problem historically, and realized there was a a missing link: Monel (aka Mona-Steel). It's not like there were specifically "acoustic" or "electric" strings before there were electric guitars, so I started trying to figure out what would have come on early electric guitars, like pre-war ES-150s. Bronze strings were not introduced until the mid 30's (1935 was the earliest mention that I found), so all those pre-advanced guitars had to have some kind of non-bronze string, and at least after 1930, that would have been Monel (or as it was branded by Gibson, Mona-Steel). The 1937 Gibson catalog (the one that introduced the ES-150) recommends Monel for their electric instruments. It's nickel-based so it's more magnetically responsive than bronze, though it's not as balanced as pure-nickel or something else. (Also worth noting, flatwound strings weren't introduced until the late 40's and didn't really become the thing until the early/mid 50's).

I wrote an article about it here: http://www.campusfive.com/swingguita...ng-guitar.html

Monel went out of production in the 70's, but Martin reintroduced it last year as the Tony Rice Signature set, only available in one guage (13-56, but the B, D and A are a bit light to my taste). It was successful enough that they recently added additional guages under the Martin "Retro" series (11's and 12's).

Having put the Tony Rice gauge Monels on both my Eastman 805 non-cut, and my pre-war ES-150 CC, I dig them. They are more focused and midrange-y than the 80/20 Martin SP's I usually keep on my 805, but still with an "acoustic" character I don't get from modern Nickel strings. I went back to the 80/20's for my 805 but, only because I don't use a pickup. If I needed to use my DeArmond Guitar Mic on it, I'd put the monels back on it.

On the ES-150 (with a notched B Charlie Christian pickup), I find they have a distinctive tone that matches Charlie's tone exactly. They do not balance perfectly, but the natural compression of my EH185 tends to even things out a bit - especially because the slight natural overdrive is part of that sound, especially on double-stops. I swap the high E from a 13 to a 14 plain string, and I leave the 16 gauge B string only because the B string doesn't need any help projecting electrically. The biggest surprise was how acoustically viable the guitar became with Monel's over D'Addario Pure Nickels. I use an Audio Technic AT831b on a gooseneck w/windscreen clamped to my tailpiece to amplify my Eastman, and trying this on my 150 worked surprisingly well. (I abhor electrified swing rhythm guitar).

Anyway, I've used all of the usual suspects, and I think it comes down to finding which one happens to match your guitar perfectly. Try each of them, and see what you like best. Just consider your self lucky that most sets of guitar strings cost under $10, and the few that cost more are only $20-25. String bass players usually have to spend $100+ a set to experiment. Yikes!

Excellent article. I'll look for a set.