PC / Mac for recording - advice

[runamuck]

Originally Posted by paulp1960

No I'm saying that with certain PCs no matter what you try it cannot be fixed. Unless you can re-write the problematic driver(s) yourself.

I've not had that experience. Problematic drivers with audio interfaces, yes, but not with a computer itself. Can you describe the drivers you are referring to?

[Gordon Currie]

Runamuck: Paul seems to be referring to motherboard drivers. There were some motherboard manufacturers with poor drivers 10-15 years ago. These caused the infamous DPC latency spikes under Windows.

These days, even the cheapest motherboards use a small subset of common designs, so DPC Latency is not the concern in 2019 as it once was. If you use your 10 year old bargain bin PC you might need to be concerned, but anything in the last 5 years - regardless how cheap - should be fine.

[paulp1960]

The problem hasn't gone away completely. Just google for Windows 10 audio latency problems and it is alive today as it was years ago with Win XP or Win 7.

Look at the advice for how to try to fix it: Disable wifi (really so you can't browse the internet while running in low latency mode), disable network card, disable power saving schemes for cpu throttling and USB power saving mode. Disable sleep, disable hibernate, disable your Nvidia drivers and revert to in-built motherboard graphics, disable sound effects etc.

Years ago companies like Anandtech who used to benchmark motherboards started showing the max DPC latencies of the motherboards they tested as it was such a big problem. But the problem was not the motherboards but the drivers themselves.

Years ago I read on gearslutz how some guy fixed all his audio problems by installing os-x on the machines (Hackintosh). I tried the same on my 2 pcs running Win XP at the time and managed to install OS-X Yosemite on my home built PCs. All my latency problems disappeared despite the hardware being identical. What was the difference? Apple wrote all the drivers I didn't have to install any 3rd party drivers.

This won't affect every windows PC but if unlucky you can still end up with a new PC that won't play nice and it may be unfixable.

[rockabilly69]

Originally Posted by paulp1960

The problem hasn't gone away completely. Just google for Windows 10 audio latency problems and it is alive today as it was years ago with Win XP or Win 7.

Look at the advice for how to try to fix it: Disable wifi (really so you can't browse the internet while running in low latency mode), disable network card, disable power saving schemes for cpu throttling and USB power saving mode. Disable sleep, disable hibernate, disable your Nvidia drivers and revert to in-built motherboard graphics, disable sound effects etc.

Years ago companies like Anandtech who used to benchmark motherboards started showing the max DPC latencies of the motherboards they tested as it was such a big problem. But the problem was not the motherboards but the drivers themselves.

Years ago I read on gearslutz how some guy fixed all his audio problems by installing os-x on the machines (Hackintosh). I tried the same on my 2 pcs running Win XP at the time and managed to install OS-X Yosemite on my home built PCs. All my latency problems disappeared despite the hardware being identical. What was the difference? Apple wrote all the drivers I didn't have to install any 3rd party drivers.

This won't affect every windows PC but if unlucky you can still end up with a new PC that won't play nice and it may be unfixable.

Or just use RME interfaces made by a company that always designs the best drivers for windows, and supports it's older interfaces! You'll still have to do the basic Windows PC audio interface setup (which i would do on any computer)...

https://www.sweetwater.com/sweetcare...-optimization/

[MikeBmusic]

Originally Posted by paulp1960

No I'm saying that with certain PCs no matter what you try it cannot be fixed. Unless you can re-write the problematic driver(s) yourself.

The only time latency should be an issue is if you are trying to monitor in real time with plugins. If you direct monitor through your interface, then its not a factor.

[Andy Howell]

Originally Posted by rockabilly69

Or just use RME interfaces made by a company that always designs the best drivers for windows, and supports it's older interfaces! You'll still have to do the basic Windows PC audio interface setup (which i would do on any computer)...

https://www.sweetwater.com/sweetcare...-optimization/

Which is why the Apple system is still the most reliable to use for audio!

[paulp1960]

Originally Posted by MikeBmusic

The only time latency should be an issue is if you are trying to monitor in real time with plugins. If you direct monitor through your interface, then its not a factor.

Two points:

1) I use Logic Pro X synths, piano sounds and many more. You can't realistically play these on a USB midi keyboard with high latency.

2) I use plugins such as Scuffham S-Gear for my electric guitar sounds. Once again I need low latency.

Most cheap audio interfaces have very basic direct monitoring that is no use for me. Want a bit of reverb when tracking vocals - forget it!

[paulp1960]

Originally Posted by rockabilly69

Or just use RME interfaces made by a company that always designs the best drivers for windows, and supports it's older interfaces! You'll still have to do the basic Windows PC audio interface setup (which i would do on any computer)...

https://www.sweetwater.com/sweetcare...-optimization/

I still own a RME Babyface but was still unable to obtain low latency without pops and clicks on certain PCs running Windows.

Running Apple OS-X there is no configuration you need to do to optimise audio.
For example having to disable wifi to make low latency work is laughable really.

[rockabilly69]

Originally Posted by paulp1960

I still own a RME Babyface but was still unable to obtain low latency without pops and clicks on certain PCs running Windows.

Running Apple OS-X there is no configuration you need to do to optimise audio.
For example having to disable wifi to make low latency work is laughable really.

I've never had problems with Latency (without disabling the wifi) on my computers using the Babyface which is still in my home demo setup. I'm running it with a laptop (HP Elitebook) and I have 8 more channels via the ADAT optical. That is a windows 7 computer though.

[paulp1960]

Originally Posted by rockabilly69

I've never had problems with Latency (without disabling the wifi) on my computers using the Babyface which is still in my home demo setup. I'm running it with a laptop (HP Elitebook) and I have 8 more channels via the ADAT optical. That is a windows 7 computer though.

I've never said in this thread that you will always have problems running your DAW on Windows. But if you do you can waste a lot of time trying to get it to work instead of focusing on the music. And the cause of these problems are usually 3rd party drivers that you may have to live with.

[Cocobolo Kid]

I chose a PC because I enjoy building computers and selecting each hardware component based on my particular needs. I like to be able to personalize my computer with case, lighting and fan selection. I use my PC for recording but also for photography and gaming.

I use an RME audio interface and have not had issues with reliability or latency under Windows 10. I can play a VST piano/synth live with multiple plugins running and no noticeable latency. With the RME, I don't experience dropouts, pops, clicks or crashes while mixing my acoustic guitar tracks with multiple plugins enabled.

That being said, I did have driver issues under Windows 8 (with my previous PC) with a Universal Audio UAD2 quad PCIe card. UA provided such poor support that I sold my UAD card and all their plugins that I had invested in.

[rick-slo]

Over the years I have had no problems recording with PCs and Windows. Being that Apple stuff is IMO dreadfully over priced
for what you get makes the choice simple IMO. A half way recent computer (PC or Mac) will run your music recording and post
recording tweaks just fine.

[Woodstock School Of Music]

Computers have come a long way. All this talk of Windows being so problematic is outdated. I'll admit that in the Windows 98 single core days there were growing pains but these days I run big projects at low latency and never have a hiccup.

Stay away from cheap computers or better yet build your own with good components choose a good interface like an RME and buy another guitar with the money you'll save.

[Glennwillow]

Originally Posted by rick-slo

Over the years I have had no problems recording with PCs and Windows. Being that Apple stuff is IMO dreadfully over priced
for what you get makes the choice simple IMO. A half way recent computer (PC or Mac) will run your music recording and post
recording tweaks just fine.

This has been my experience, too.

I use a good Dell PC I purchased in 2016 to run Steinberg Cubase using a Presonus interface. I used this equipment because this is what my son uses to run his recording system. He runs an Internet business composing music for games, video, podcasts, etc. I figured if I had questions, he would know the answers.

For me, this has worked out very well.

I recorded this video a while ago on how to record a video with good sound. It may be helpful.

- Glenn

[lkingston]

Strange, I moved the other way, from a computer to an iPad Pro. I'm using the Full version of Auria (which is just fantastic) plus a bunch of instrument and DSP plug-ins. I wouldn't say that it is better than a computer, but it is more convenient and it certainly is as good.