Dread issues! (OK, I'm "portly"... )

[personatech]

I find that I'm having trouble holding my Seagull Original S6. When shopping, while the smaller bodied folk models were obviously more comfortable to hold, the sound they produced paled in comparison to the dreads so I made my decision based on my ears, not my comfort. I'm a 6'1", 270 lbs., 61 years old, beginner acoustic guitar player - not a small guy by any means. I tell myself that it isn't my gut - after all, I've seen overweight players do just fine playing dreads (Thomas Walsh of Pugwash comes to mind).

When I hold the guitar, whether sitting or standing, the treble-side bouts are tilted away from me, meaning that I'm having to curve my wrist more to form chords. Also, the guitar neck tends to angle itself away from me at about 30 degrees. I am right-handed. When I sit, I sit in an armless secretarial chair and balance the guitar on my right thigh as recommended by most "how-to" Youtube videos.

While the obvious solution is to lose about 90 lbs. let's be realistic - I'll lose some weight over the summer, but not nearly that much (I usually do). I suppose I could move the guitar to my left thigh, but that seems to create more of a reach for me and stresses the wrist in another way.

I guess my question is, is finding a comfortable position to play effectively usually this much of an issue when starting out? What did you do to finally get comfortable with a guitar?

[srick]

Personatech - well this will be a great thread because you're not alone!

As for me, I have incentive to lose weight. My daughter is getting married next year and I figured it out - I will lose the weight and then have to KEEP IT OFF for the following year! I have simply changed my eating habits. Keeping careful track of what you ingest and portion size is enough, followed by not eating between or after meals. It's too bad that food tastes so good. I am three weeks into this and it's working.

But, back to guitars.

1. A John Pearse armrest has helped greatly increased comfort in the area where the forearm contacts the lower bout (of course the guitar is pushed out by the belly).
2. I wear a guitar strap even while sitting to allow for proper posture. Also, I tip the neck up (almost into a classical position) to again achieve better posture while playing. Playing standing up will also allow the guitar to be held more vertically.
3. I switched to a 00 style and this helped immensely. Thinner guitars (like the acoustic-electrics (Godin Multiac style) fit the same bill.

Good luck with this!

best,

Rick

[Shades of Blue]

I am lucky enough to not have any issues with playing dreads. On the contrary, 000/OM style guitars are more uncomfortable for me actually. It's the way that my shoulder dips down and it always wants to slide off of my leg. You are 100% correct that a bigger guitar just sounds so much better in comparison, but honestly it isn't just about magnitude of the sound, but also the quality. My 000-28 has this chime that is so addicting, and I love digging into that guitar. It just sounds amazing. Low end isn't super present, but it's there.

As far as getting comfortable, I have to get the leg that my guitar rests on up, and I prop it up on a stool leg or on my daughters small guitar stool. If I'm playing a dread, it goes on my left leg, and my 000 goes on my right. My arm will get deep red marks from the edge of the D-18 and J-45, but I'm overweight so I got some padding I suppose haha. I just readjust every now and then.

[ljguitar]

Originally Posted by personatech

…I'm a 6'1", 270 lbs., 61 years old, beginner acoustic guitar player - not a small guy by any means.
…What did you do to finally get comfortable with a guitar?

Hi personatech

I'll match your 270lbs but I'm only 5'7" (and I'm nearly 70 yrs old).

I use a NeckUP lift which I set out near the knee, which allows me to lean the guitar's upper bout back to my chest. Then I elevate the headstock to about chin high (or higher) which brings the fingering section of the neck a lot closer to me and drops the lower bout of the guitar a couple inches for my strumming/picking upper arm to rest comfortably on the lower bout of the guitar. My right arm balances the pivot point of the NeckUP and holds the neck in the UP position with zero effort.

When I stand, I wear a strap and rotate the guitar to the same position for playing while standing (and I wear the guitar fairly high using a strap).

You cannot see the lift in these videos, but you can certainly see the angle of the guitar and how it fits 'me', and the freedom I play with. I've been playing with this position (and the NeckUP) for at least 12 years now.





I taught finger style for over 39 years locally, and I know everybody has opinions about the 'perfect' or 'proper' way to hold guitars, but I personally think it requires some adjustment to make it comfortable for each player.

Our bodies are not all alike, and losing 90 pounds may or may-not solve the issue for you. But I determined about age 50 I was not going to allow the shape or size of guitars determine whether I could play them well, and hold them comfortably.

I experimented with wearing straps while sitting (I'm too short), using a pad under the lower bout, switching legs. Actually I can hold a guitar pretty well by just setting my left foot on my right knee (as in partially crossing my legs), but it's not the most graceful looking position (and my foot falls asleep).

Hope you find the position that works well for you, and these I offer as suggestions for you to explore with. The NeckUP is perfect for me, and I've certainly had a number of students who took to them immediately. Others struggled, so I bought the NeckUP from them and added it to my collection so now I have one in each case.

Hope this adds to the discussion.

[Casey86]

Try a strap. Maybe you will have to consider drilling a hole for the strap. Standing could help and most of us sit an unhealthy amount. Some hold the guitar like a classical, higher up and the neck more vertical. Lots of options so keep an open mind.

Great time to make changes as you are a bit new. If you dig dreads, like I do, make the changes needed.

[Rosewood99]

Or you could lose weight. Not be snarky but it could literally extend the quality of your life. My dad died of heart disease which was attributed to his being overweight.

[LookerBob]

Ever see John Moreland? He's playing a D35 these days and he's probably doubled down on where you're at.

I'd say you can help yourself a lot by elevating the headstock - you see classical guys do this all the time.

[Goat Mick]

I'm 5'6" and 245 so my guitar pokes out in the front as well. I usually play standing and angle the guitar slightly to my left side and have no issues. I usually play a 000 but I do have some dreads that I love so I've had to learn to adapt. If I'm sitting I like to use something like a bar stool that I lean against more than sit on and this allows me to us my right leg to bring the bottom of the guitar out a bit and correct the angle. Here are a couple of pics to illustrate. In my case, dropping 20 pounds would do wonders and I'm working on it but dang it gets difficult after you pass 50.

[personatech]

Thanks, everyone!! You've given me some really good suggestions to try out! Is that 'liftup' a footstool of some sort?

[Oldguy64]

I’m 6’ 280lb.
I play mostly dreads.
Usually strapped iif playing out.
A year ago, I was three lb shy of 350lb.
Nowadays I actually stand to play sometimes.
I am much more comfortable playing seated/semi-seated.

I will plug the diet I’ve been on.
My wife is gluten free and we’ve gone Ketogenic.
The diet has been around for almost 100 years.
It was originally used to treat seizures.
It is also the basis for the Atkins diet.
Please talk to your doctor before embarking on this.
But, I’ve been eating like a king.
My blood pressure is down.
My cholesterol is down.
And I’m enjoying playing more than I have in a long time.

Please talk to your doc. It may not be the best option for all.

[ljguitar]

Originally Posted by personatech

Thanks, everyone!! You've given me some really good suggestions to try out! Is that 'liftup' a footstool of some sort?

Hi personatech

The NeckUP is a small leather strap with a suction cup on one end.



It can attach to the endpin (where a normal strap would attach), or you can use a second smaller suction cup for guitars without end-pins. And both feet remain flat on the ground (better for backs than footstools).



It allows flexibility while playing (it's not rigid) and folds down and goes under the headstock of my guitars when I'm traveling.

The guy who invented it is a guitarist, and the suction cup is safe on Nitro finishes (at least it's been safe an all my guitars since 2005).

The only way I've found them is from the guy who invented them.

There are other lifts out there, and I've tried several. This is the lift I settled on.

Hope this contributes to the discussion…

[Placida]

Personatech, just wondering if you've ever tried one of those Martin Dreadnought Junior reduced size dreads. The shorter scale and overall size might be a good fit for you, and the reviews on the sound from these guitars are stellar.

[RagtopGT]

I still consider myself a beginner...started playing at 52, stopped, started again, so on and so forth. Now I'm 65, retired, and at it again. When the first bug bit in 2004 I bought a new Martin Smartwood OM which I still own. But I had to have a dread because of the 'cool' factor, and have owned several including a D-18 and D-28. Never really had them very long, blaming everything except ergonomics and stubbornness.

Back to the OM 6 months ago when I re-booted. But when a crack in the top developed in February, I got a used Gibson J-35 as a temporary substitute until I figured out where to take the Martin for repair.

The Gibson is a great sounding guitar...slick neck, comfortable profile and the perfect nut width for my hand, and of course it's got the 'cool' factor. Uncomfortable to play on the couch though. Still hadn't learned my lesson.

My OM will be tied up for a few months simply because of the volume of repairs ahead of me at the luthier so I'm expecting a new Martin 000 today. Dreads be d*mned and the J-35 is up for sale. They lose their cool factor if you can't play 'em.

"If the guitar doesn't fit, you must not quit".

[Alan Carruth]

A 'wedge' body helps a lot wiith those wide boxes. It need not be very much; an inch or less of total difference between the treble and bass sides will in effect take about an inch off the width in terms of comfort. A Dread plays like a 000, but still sounds like a Dread.

Arm rest bevels also go along way, even when they're small.

Of course, now you're talking about a luthier built instrument which will probably be a bit more expensive than most factory ones of the same materials and overall trim. OTOH, you can often get one that will sound better than the equivalent factory box.

[Tico]

I'm a big guy too.
I'm gonna order a custom Ovation, but with the bowl installed backwards.