Enhance the bass of 000 size?

[Henning]

Hello, concerning the six string steel string guitar; if you want to enhance the bass, could that be done by thinning the top and/(or?) eventually shaving the bracing?
Do you risk to loose any other desirable characteristics by that?
(Beside the strength of the top).

Here I have a factory made scalloped X-braced six string steel stringed with solid sitka spruce top and laminate sides and back. I do have the feeling that the bracing might be worked better.

Regards

[keith.rogers]

I would look at getting a "set up" done by someone experienced, and trying medium strings, or a hybrid set, perhaps, to adjust the balance before thinning anything. There's really nothing "in general" anyone should suggest to do to alter the braces or top without an in-hand evaluation. That's my 2 öre, anyway.

[Henning]

I am perfectly pleased with the set up. I'd rather not change the type of strings. The lacquer is thick gloss, unfortunately in a very good shape, would the bass and perhaps response, separation, brightness and "punch" benefit of that?

[Silly Moustache]

Hej Henning, och välkommen hit från denne gamle engelsman!

You don't tell us what make of 000 guitar you have, but a 000 is quite a different instrument from a dreadnought or jumbo which were really made for maximum bass, and tend to be a little "unbalanced" or biased towards the bass.

The 000 (and smaller) tend to be made for a "balanced" tonality.

I would suggest that you don't try to alter your 000, but maybe consider getting a dreadnought instead or as well.

I have both, and so you might find this of interest.

[FrankHudson]

I've been known to modify electric guitars for fun and to change their sound, but my advice would be that aside from non-invasive things like strings that one had best to leave your guitar be. There may be folks more knowledgeable than me who can tell you about plausible modifications, but my advice would be the same as has already been offered by SillyM: if you want a more bass-heavy guitar, get one.

Also like SillyMoustache, I'm attracted to 000 and smaller bodies because they don't over-emphasize the bass. But that's me. To play somethings on a bass-ey dread I sometime need to be extra light on how I play the lower strings and damp them to keep the notes there from overpowering the upper end which I want to sustain more than the lower notes most times.

Also, if you're recording or performing, there are ways to add bass emphasis external to the guitar. Don't know if that fits your situation, but just saying...

[phavriluk]

It seems that it's an exercise in futility to try to alter the innate voice of a guitar. My own take is, don't like it, get something meant to be a bass source.

[Fathand]

You could study the expected results of changing the soundhole size, then experiment making it smaller by binding it or cutting it larger, the first option being more easily reversible than the 2nd.

[runamuck]

Originally Posted by Fathand

You could study the expected results of changing the soundhole size, then experiment making it smaller by binding it or cutting it larger, the first option being more easily reversible than the 2nd.

Enlarging the soundhole will almost always decrease the low end.

To the OP: attempting to shave braces or thin the top is a terrible idea for someone who knows little about guitar design and will result, almost certainly, in a guitar that sounds worse.

[Fathand]

Originally Posted by runamuck

Enlarging the soundhole will almost always decrease the low end.

To the OP: attempting to shave braces or thin the top is a terrible idea for someone who knows little about guitar design and will result, almost certainly, in a guitar that sounds worse.

Most likely, which is why I suggested the OP study expected results, and my first suggestion was to decrease the soundhole size with binding, which could be done on a temporary basis with masking tape.

[Brucebubs]

Not wanting to change strings but looking at shaving braces seems a little strange.

[Henning]

Thanks guys, I realize that I am a strange guy and you know Swedish way far too good. It´s a Sigma 000R-28VS
Not only strange but persistent too. If you look inside the guitar the edges of the bracing are sharp. Should it be that way?
You mean it doesn´t matter at all?
Rounding the edges of the bracing isn´t worth the trouble?
I certainly don´t want to do anything that doesn´t make any difference in a positive sense.

Kind regards

[Silly Moustache]

Hej Henning. I'm aware of he Sigma line which are perfectly good copies of older Martin designs.

they are fine, but they are/were built to a budget.

Sadly your model has now been discontinued. It was a budget version of the much admired Martin 00028-VS.

The braces are possible not "scalloped" and if you were able to modify them, a difficult job once assembled, you would have difficulty knowing how that affects the stability of the guitar.

I have researched the history of Martin guitars somewhat thoughout the 19th and 20th century.
Martin were proud of the balanced tonality across the strings up until the the 1934 Dreadnought which they allowed to be bass heavy.

This has become "the Martin sound" -accentuated bass modest middle and slightly choked treble.

The original 00028 was introduced in 1902 and discontinued or displaced by the rather pointless 14 fret OM 28 std scale "rhythm" guitar (1931-1933) and the short scale 00028 version. (favoured by Eric Clapton).

Fortunately, Collings, Santa Cruz, and Bourgeois made acceptable alternatives.

I own (and cherish) my Collings 0002h, as Collings retained the balanced tonality, and I think that this aspect of the design of your guitar is what you are "fighting against".
Your guitar will probably improve in tonality but not change its nature. For the Martin bass heavy sound, I think you need to go to a dreadnought, or a more expensive brand.

I hope this helps.

[Henning]

I so far, don´t think a more expensive guitar would do any benefit. What I can see from this, the scalloped bracing makes the top ´easily driven´.
By removing material from the bracing the top will be only further more easily driven. Not really a desired quality!
Neither would that enhance the bass. What could be done is like runamuck says, make the sound hole smaller, or, adding weights to the bridge. The latter would then be cost of clarity, brightness, definition etc. (Really just dampening the treble to mid range registers, thereby emphasizing the bass).

[phavriluk]

I can't turn a Volvo into a SAAB. Same applies to guitars. Please don't make irreversible, and potentially damaging, changes to your guitar in pursuit of goals that can't be predicted.

[Alan Carruth]

There are ways you can experiment with modifications without actually making permanent changes. You're unlikely to get a 'Dreadnought' sort of bass from an OM/000, but often you can get 'more' bass, and maybe that will be enough.

First; in it's low range function the guitar is a 'bass reflex cabinet'. The Helmholtz-type 'main air' resonance, which corresponds with the what you get from blowing across the mouth of a wine bottle, and the loudspeaker-like 'main top' resonance work together to produce sound. Much depends on the pitch relationships of those two resonances, and that can be altered in various ways. Also, you can think of the back as being a sort of 'extra' top in some respects; if the 'main back' resonance is close in pitch to the 'main top' they will work together, and both affect the air flow through the sound hole.

The lowest resonant pitch is the 'main air' mode; usually somewhere around G on the low E string, 3d fret. The actual 'air' resonance is determined by the size and location of the sound hole, so modifying that will change it. Making the hole smaller drops the pitch of the 'air' mode, and makes it a bit weaker; you're perception of the 'bassiness' depends on both, so it can be hard to say whether, say, enlarging the hole will make the more 'bass' or more 'treble'. It's easy to cover up part of the hole and see what happens. I like to cut a disk of foam core poster board that just fits in the hole snuggly, and then glue a slightly larger disk of carboard to it. Then you can cut a hole in it and stick it into the soundhole. It's stiff enough to work well, won't fall in, and you can modify it all you want without changing the guitar. If making the hole smaller takes you in the direction you want to go then you can figure out a more socially acceptable way to make it more or less permanent. One way is to make a 'sleeve'; a tube of paper or card stock, that just fits in the hole. This is more or less the equivalent of making the hole smaller, and you can experiment to see how long the tube needs to be to get the result you want. A clear tube made of flexible plastic can be used and won't show as much.

Often I've found that the best way to add bass is to work on the back. If you block the sound hole and tap on the bridge you can hear the 'main top' resonance: usually it's masked by the lower pitched 'air' mode. It's often around the pitch of the open G string. Tapping on the back in the middle of the lower bout will give you the 'back' pitch. The closer in pitch the top and back are the more they work together, acting like a bellows to pump air through the hole. An exact pitch match there can produce some nasty 'wolf' notes, but getting the back pitch a bit higher than the top can make quite a difference. This can be checked by adding some mass, in the form of a lump of poster adhesive, to the back in the most active spot. Again, you can play the instrument and hear the result without doing any permanent damage. If you do decide to make the alteration, then lowering the height of the center of the lower braces is more effective than taking wood off the ends. Done judiciously this can be very effective, and doesn't weaken the top like shaving top braces does.

Sometimes adding some mass to the bridge can help to cut down on the high end 'cut' of the sound. Again, here's a p[lace where poster adhesive helps. If a small wad of it stuck on the bridge improves the sound you can look into adding that much weight in a more attractive way. If you have plastic bridge pins swapping in almost any other material will ad at least some mass. In some cases it's actually useful to simply transfer the wad of poster adhesive to the inside of the top in the same spot, but it's best not to leave it in place for too long; it gets hard to remove.

This should give you some things toplay around with for a while.