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  #31  
Old 03-21-2017, 08:06 PM
TJE TJE is offline
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Yes like one of the best ever.....Glen Campbell!😜
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  #32  
Old 03-21-2017, 08:54 PM
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Ok I'm going to try to break this down as simply as possible. While I can sing a song in any key sometimes a song just sounds better in a certain key. So let's say I have a country song that sounds best when I sing it in the key of A. Well if I capo up two frets and play the song with G shape open cords it still sounds like a country song. If I don't use a capo and play it out of the A position it sounds like a blues progression. Do you want to be true to the song or do you want to brag that you "never use a capo"?
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  #33  
Old 03-21-2017, 09:04 PM
Paleolith54 Paleolith54 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paulzoom View Post
Try playing "here comes the sun" without a capo.
OP: this is precisely the example I was going to use. I play this with another guitarist. We both play it in the key of A, but in different ways.

He plays what I think of as the George Harrison part, Capo 7 starting in the D shape. I play what I think of as the Paul Simon part (Capo 2, starting in G shape). Without going into lots of detail, this allows me to play "under" or "behind" his parts, and in some spots to mimic what he is doing much more effectively than I could do trying to play an A shape in first position.

BTW, this approach is based on a joint appearance of Paul Simon and George Harrison on Saturday Night Live that I saw MANY years ago.
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  #34  
Old 03-21-2017, 09:09 PM
Paleolith54 Paleolith54 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PiousDevil View Post
You also never caught Django using four fingers. Guess I better pull out the diagonal cutters if I want to do things right.
We really need a "Like" button on this forum. Spot on!
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  #35  
Old 03-21-2017, 09:10 PM
Matt McGriff Matt McGriff is offline
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I have people ask that very question (mainly a bass player). Why would I want to make the song more difficult? My goal is to make what I am playing sound as good as possible with as minimal of effort as possible. Why would I want to play barred F chords when I could play a capo 1 E or capo 3 D? Easier pivot finger changes, suspensions, etc. Why not?
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  #36  
Old 03-21-2017, 09:56 PM
The Bard Rocks The Bard Rocks is offline
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Default voice in a key

Voices are not in particular keys. That said often certain keys work better with your voice. that's not because of the key but because of the range of notes within the key. Think of it this way: you can sing just so high and just so low, and probably your comfort zone is an even shorter range of notes. Here's what I do to determine the key I will use. First, I know how high and how low I can sing, then I look at the high and the low notes in the song, and select a key that keeps these centered around my sweetest spot.

I don't use capos often but there are times when I prefer the fingering in a certain key but want to sing in another. And, more often, someone else will start a song, say in G, but I've always played it in D. So one goes the capo so I get the fingering I prefer but can stay in tune with the singer.
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  #37  
Old 03-21-2017, 10:23 PM
TokyoNeko TokyoNeko is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paleolith54 View Post
OP: this is precisely the example I was going to use. I play this with another guitarist. We both play it in the key of A, but in different ways.

He plays what I think of as the George Harrison part, Capo 7 starting in the D shape. I play what I think of as the Paul Simon part (Capo 2, starting in G shape). Without going into lots of detail, this allows me to play "under" or "behind" his parts, and in some spots to mimic what he is doing much more effectively than I could do trying to play an A shape in first position.

BTW, this approach is based on a joint appearance of Paul Simon and George Harrison on Saturday Night Live that I saw MANY years ago.
Some other "capo" songs I like to mess with:

1st - '39 (Queen)
4th - I'd Love You To Want Me (Lobo)
7th - Scarborough Fair / Canticle (Simon & Garfunkel)
7th - Everything I Own (Bread)
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  #38  
Old 03-21-2017, 10:23 PM
Riverwolf Riverwolf is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Silly Moustache View Post
I don't understand what you mean by "song lessons".
One that rings a bell is all the online lessons for Tequila Sunrise have a capo on 2.
That is what I meant by song lessons.

Quote:
Originally Posted by campy View Post
I have been playing for just about a year and a half and I will be happy when I'm at the point where I know what everybody is talking about. I'm 66 and so much to learn and so little time.
Great answer.
Four years in and I am obviously still full of questions.

Thank for ALL the replies. I will be reading over these again tomorrow.
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  #39  
Old 03-21-2017, 10:26 PM
Mycroft Mycroft is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by murrmac123 View Post
You never caught Django Reinhardt or Les Paul using a capo ...
Neither Django nor Les Paul were singers...
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  #40  
Old 03-21-2017, 10:33 PM
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I'm not a musician, just a guitar hobbiest, but I like the "flavors" a capo gives at different positions. The song in my signature is capo'd at the 2nd fret, and the guitar is in DADGF#AD tuning (before the capo is put on).
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  #41  
Old 03-21-2017, 10:52 PM
rogthefrog rogthefrog is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Riverwolf View Post
I know that some song lessons call for a capo and some of those songs do sound better with a capo.
But I have never understood why else to use one.
What other reason would there be than "it sounds better with a capo"?

I thought we were playing music, i.e. arranging sound over time.
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  #42  
Old 03-22-2017, 01:07 AM
pjroberts pjroberts is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rudy4 View Post
I've been playing for over 50 years and use a capo often, sometimes as high as the seventh fret.

The simple reason is that it lends a different flavor to the tonality of the instrument. It's analogous to the difference between people who sing as basses, baritones, altos, or sopranos. They can all sing in different keys, but sound much different. The human voice would be far less attractive if there weren't different ranges to sing in and guitar pieces would be far less interesting if they were all played out of open position.

A good example would be to play "Here Comes The Sun" in open position. It's possible, but it doesn't promote the same energy or feeling as when capoed.

There are those that cite capo use in transposing to alternate keys without the need to re-learn chord positions or fingering, but that would be a secondary use to me. I sometimes do it for more complex flatpicking that I've learned in certain open chord positions. In that case it's often a short cut to capo up for a quick adjustment for a different key to sing in.
Here Comes the Sun doesn't work without the capo, probably the primo example.

I love the tonal differences of pseudo open chords up the neck, just a totally different sound than fretted chords. Both good, but no way the same. Capos add new flavors, and i also like the spongy playability factor -- my guitars are all well set up, so don't take me down the set up response to that one.

Anyway that's me .. i like a full palette of sounds, and do a lot of barring for wide range across the board, but a capo can take you to a different dimension, so i use them frequently.
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  #43  
Old 03-22-2017, 03:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mycroft View Post
Neither Django nor Les Paul were singers...
Where's the 'LIKE' button when you need one?
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  #44  
Old 03-22-2017, 04:41 AM
Silly Moustache Silly Moustache is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Riverwolf View Post
One that rings a bell is all the online lessons for Tequila Sunrise have a capo on 2.
That is what I meant by song lessons.



Great answer.
Four years in and I am obviously still full of questions.

Thank for ALL the replies. I will be reading over these again tomorrow.
I think that Riverwolf is either joking with us, or really doesn't understand the
between keys, chords and progressions.

Example :
===============================================
Tequila Sunrise
By The Eagles

G
It's another tequila sunrise
D Am7 D G
Starin' slowly across the sky, said goodbye
G
He was just a hired hand
D Am7 D G
Working on the dreams he planned to try, as days go by
Em C
Every night when the sun goes down
Em C
Just another lonely boy in town
Em D
And she's out running round
G
She was just another woman
D Am7 D G
And I couldn't keep from comin' on, it's been so long
G
Oh and it's a hollow feeling
D Am7 D G
When it comes down to dealin' friends, it never ends


Guitar solo G D Am7 D G


Am7 D
Take another shot of courage
Bm E Am7 B Em A
Wonder why the right words never come, you just get numb
G
It's another tequila sunrise
D Am7 D G
This old world still looks the same, another frame

================================================

To play this song in G - do as above.
To play it in A - capo on II and play the same SHAPES.

You wanna sing it in D ?

Capo II and transpose to a C shape for the root, then change the SHAPES to keep the progression of I,V, IIm7 V I etc (that's just the first line obviously).
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  #45  
Old 03-22-2017, 06:07 AM
brianmay brianmay is offline
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Was that a serious question?

For somebody with nearly 3000 posts here, I can't imagine you not knowing . . .
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Last edited by brianmay; 03-22-2017 at 06:08 AM. Reason: Maths
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