|
|
#271
07-17-2019, 05:24 PM
|
|||
|
|||
Quote:
In my opinion, yes it could be the Elixirs. My disdain for Elixirs is well documented on this forum. What thickness pick are you using? What I love about the GP is the fat sound, but everyone has different ears. One of the main reasons I don’t like Elixirs is that I don’t like the sound of fresh strings, so I could certainly think you could be hearing that new string clang. At any rate, your mileage may vary and this is all just my opinion! I’m ecstatic with my GPs if you haven’t noticed lol. 
|
|
#272
07-17-2019, 05:35 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Quote:
Standard GC give away pick. Strumming side by side with a martin road series dread. Martin sounded martin light but warm and sound generated by strings 4, 5 and 6 but the GP was more sounding like it came from strings 1-4
|
|
#273
07-17-2019, 05:42 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Quote:
I use a 1mm Blue Chip, so my overall sound is generally on the more mellow side. If I recall, the GC picks are a little thinner? Either way, I’d hate to tell you that if you were to change strings you’d hear anything different. Only way to be sure would be to put some Elixirs on the Martin and see if it made it thin?
|
|
#274
07-17-2019, 07:02 PM
|
||||
|
||||
|
* Ok Jonathan, Gary, BK & others, I finally had the chance today in a quiet room alone with two beautiful specimens of the BE 717e and 517e and to run them both thru a series of noledog tests: fingerstyle, flatpick/bluegrass, strummin' and my reggae percussive stuff; both unplugged and amplified thru a Loudbox!! So strap in, here it is long and into the details
 ** The 717 was natural and the 517 was a honeyburst, sorry no camera with me, but you've all seen pics posted of them: 1) Aesthetics & workmanship - both were impeccable visually with excellent fit n finish upon my inspection. The torrified spruce tops on both were perfectly even straight grained with a fair amount of silking, especially the 517. The mahogany was a fine, rich reddish brown & the 717's eir had a lovely, purpley-chocolate, grain pattern perfectly bookmatched. They both had new Elixirs, set up well & in perfect tune, I never touched a tuner the whole time! 2) Satin finish - the finish was much like my two Lowdens from the 90's & Pro Series 3 Takamines; smooth, lively & a contributor to the resonant, airy tone like my Lowdens & Taks... I prefer satin finishes & no pickgard, so more boxes checked for the GP's. 3) Bridge - the new, rounder design is an improvement imo as I never liked Taylor's bat wing shape. My hand rested comfortably on the new bridge for muting and comping...tho I much prefer the pinless design of both the Tak and Lowden. Added note, I don't care much for Taylor's headstock design & don't like truss rod covers on any guitar for that matter, but there are so many beautiful things on these GP's that it's not a deal breaker. *** Neck design, comfort, intonation: 1) Profile - the neck felt very similar to Lowden's full C, very comfy with string spacing & radius. I still prefer Tak's asymmetrical design more then any other neck ever because it is more ergonomic, thus reduces fatigue for the 4hr. shows I do 4 to 5 nights a week. My old Avalon neck my son now has comes in close second, the Lowden is third. The GP felt close & I think I would get along fine with it. The MLO/PA on the D-18 is not as full & not my fav, but by no means is it too skinny & the slight v-hint is nice so I still enjoy it just fine when I switch to it. 2) Neck weight & guitar weight - is on the heavier side as compared to my D-18 which is 4lbs or less, yet I think it is a positive contributor to the GP's fullness & continuity of the tone & resonance. The guitars overall weight is around the same as my Tak's, in my guesstimation around 5lbs or so, especially the 717; and that's a good thing imo as I think it contributes to the sustain.... may I add that I also prefer the continuity of a dovetail neck joint like Tak, Martin and Lowden, however, this new neck on the GP's is a beast & I think helps that tone continuity travel nicely! 3) Comfort - the body shape & rounded edges are fantastic & facilitate easy kick back ja'mon sitting, or standing! 4) Intonation - was excellent all the way up the neck & I would say equal to, but not better then my Tak's or Lowden because their split saddle design lends itself to excellent intonation & has worked great for me over the years...I don't have to retune while capoing. Not so with my D-18, so I will say the Taylor, Lowden & Tak have better intonation then my D-18 & other Martins I've owned and used. **** Unplugged tone: 1) Tone bass - let me say I much preferred the 517 over the 717. Both had excellent, balanced low end. I don't like overpowering bass like an HD-35, it's way too much. I prefer punchy, tight & defined bass like a D-18 or standard D28. The 517 & 717 lack nothing in the bottom end. They sounded (especially the 517) like my Tak KC70 OM which has a very nice defined presence so you can tell a low G played on the 3rd fret on the E/6th string & not just a thud. My D18 has a bit more oomph in this area. 2) Tone mids - like Jonathan has described so correctly, I find the mids to be punchy and alive like a Mike Tyson right hook! I likey a lot!! Again as I compare them to my guitars, the 517 had mids like my KC70, which btw is sapeale (my fav b/s wood, it tends to be punchier in a wider frequency then mahogany as I've owned several of both sapeale & mahogany). The 717 had the same punch, but with more crispness to it which lends itself to a lil' more flesh fingerstyle articulation I found when playing some JT on it. The 717 was more like my PC3NC which is deeper & slightly more overtoned. The 517, 717, and P3NC have a bit more mids then my D18, but not as much as Jonathan describes about his own scooped sounding D-18. This is because I use Martin SP PB Mediums tuned down a half step, combined with Blue Chip TAD 50 picks. Add to that, I swapped out the bone saddle in my D18 to a Tusq saddle & thus my mids are punchier, trebles are much rounder & the sustain increased. I've made my saddles for years & know most folks dig bone, but in my D18 the Tusq rules. So I think my D-18 may sound a bit different than Jonathan's. BTW...I don't use a UST in my D-18, I use an M80. 3) Tone highs - were rounder & fatter on the 517 but a little too jangly on the 717, but they both sounded great all the way up the neck. Again I know Jonathan feels his D18 sounds thin comparatively, but my D-18 as mentioned above has been tweaked & the highs are very fat & round. The highs on my Tak's are very punchy & round & this was a main selling point for me as it translates well amplified... I'm sure a set of Martin SP PB's would only improve the impressive results I heard from the Elixirs on these GP's. ***** Volume, sustain, resonance, and reverbiness: 1) Volume - the 517 wins here over the 717 & my guitars as well, it is loud and stays loud. I was very impressed like a Gibson AJ explosion LOL! ...but volume is not a huge factor for me & my D18 can keep up pretty well enough. The Tak's are cedar-topped so they have less headroom while having more of a percussive nature with great sustain. 2) Sustain - the 717 edges out the 517 by a hair & is impressive. I went thru various chord positions that all rang out evenly & let them sit to hear their lengthy decay. I went thru a series of notes above the 12th fret where many guitars deaden out, yet the GP's were both excellent all the way to the second to last fret. This is a test I do on every guitar I purchase. I fret the low E on the 12th fret to see if it sustains, as well as all around the upper frets. My Tak's do this just as well as the GP's did with exceptional bloom after the note is struck...and this too translates well to amplified performance & is something I require as a soloist so I can ride notes & sound fuller. The D-18 was good here & satisfying, but not to the better level of the GP's, Tak's & Lowden. Like I mentioned earlier, the D-18 does not quite intonate as well up here like the others, but it's not bad. 3) Resonance & reverbiness - belongs to the 717! The 517 is more fundamental yet very impressive for a mahogany guitar. My Lowden easily equalled the torrified 717 as it is EIR too with an incredible sitka top that has aged since '97 when I bought it... it now belongs to my son, but I still play it  It has some of the finest silking ever too. But the 717 is new so it will grow into a greater beast than it already is!  The Tak's vibrate my chest, especially the KC70 OM due to the cedar, satin finish & bracing. They have an average amount of reverb/resonance which I don't mind because again too much does not translate well amplified. My D-18 has a surprisingly amount of resonance & an average reverbiness, guess it's been played in so much that it just plain vibrates... but the 717 still leads this pack in this area. All these guitars display wonderful dynamic capabilities, something a torrified top does well as does a cedar top in a different way. ****** Amplified thru Loudbox as I set up for my shows plug n play: 1) Let me just say that if I was to buy a GP, it would be a 517 honeyburst without the ES2. I know there are many who like the ES2 & that's fine because it is a quality system. But I've run it thru the gamet on several different Taylor's including the GP's & without an additional outboard preamp such as a Session or similar, the ES2 falls short tonally of my plug n play demands & style. The ES2 lacks the percussive nature & beef that Tak's provide so wonderfully. The ES2 sounded clean, but very thin & hollow after much direct dialing in. So if I did get one, I would most likely install an Anthem or Session VTC if the under bracing would allow. 2) Strap knob - I stand when I perform & I did not like the where the strap knob was located on the GP's. So this and the ES2 are the only cons for me. ******* The 517 & 717 do a lot of things well sonically, physically & visually. Are they enough to trump what I already have? No, I still gravitate to the lower mid depth of the Martin D-18 for strumming, flatpicking & even some fingerstyle as I demo'd in some of videos. I also love the prettiness of my KC70's unplugged tone more then just about anything & when amplified I've found none more satisfying. That said, would I recommend the Taylor GP BE 517 and 717? Most certainly!! They do not sound like a typical Taylor & that's good for some folks & maybe not for others who enjoy the Taylor signature. Nonetheless these GP's are an excellent, innovative work of musical art that are built well & sound wonderful. I am pleased that Jonathan & others have found them so gratifying & I genuinely enjoyed demoing them in an way that I could appreciate their attributes. I can appreciate how one can fall in love with these fine instruments, kudos to Taylor on the Grand Pacific design!  I'm also pleased to further what has become an excellent thread with so much enjoyable input so carry on!! eric
__________________
 NOLE TUNES & Coastal Acoustic Music one love jam!  Martin D18 & 3 lil' birdz; Takamine KC70, P3NC x 2 
Last edited by noledog; 07-17-2019 at 08:43 PM. Reason: spelling
|
|
#275
07-17-2019, 07:16 PM
|
||||
|
||||
|
Noledog: Wow! Really terrific review, but I have to strongly disagree with your last comment. Your thorough review should be a thread starter and not merely part of a long meandering one...
__________________
Emerald X20 Emerald X20-12 Fender Robert Cray Stratocaster Martin D18 Ambertone Martin 000-15sm
|
|
#276
07-17-2019, 07:23 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
What an amazing write up! So glad you finally got a chance to play them!
I think the more I play my 517 and 717, I prefer the 717 for just about everything but fingerstyle. They have the same base tone which is awesome, but the 717 I have is louder, and just more robust overall. I feel mine with the bear claw top must be special, so I’m going to go with that wink wink. The 517 is no slouch, and I prefer it to both my D-18 (which sold Sunday) and my J-45 I sold. No regrets. The strength and punch of these guitars just blows my mind. Regarding the thinness of my D-18, I don’t know if thin was the correct description, but perhaps jangle or crispness? With the GP guitars, I just hear wood, and I love this sound to pieces.
|
|
#277
07-17-2019, 08:05 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Preaching to the converted again, Shades!
The others are concerned their old X's are worthless, I suppose, can't afford to buy a GP now.  . Kidding!V Brace rules, Gov! But you were right to buy the 5 as well, as I am a bit heartsick that Taylor has announced another BE at Summer NAMM with no mention of THE NECK. And as I may have mentioned before, I was hoping for a GC 14 fret V Brace BE with THAT NECK, didn't care if it was Balsa wood, but prefer something sensible for fingerpicking, Rosewood/Sitka..(a bit boring I suppose, so Blackwood/Sinker Redwood covered in molluscs!  .)BluesKing777.
|
|
#278
07-17-2019, 09:49 PM
|
||||
|
||||
|
Quote:
__________________
NOLE TUNES & Coastal Acoustic Music one love jam! Martin D18 & 3 lil' birdz; Takamine KC70, P3NC x 2
|
|
#279
07-17-2019, 10:19 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Quote:
Thanks Shades. Really love the 517 honeyburst. Now if I can convince myself that's it's worth it for the songs I want to learn that are primarily finger style....hmmmm decisions decisions
|
|
#280
07-18-2019, 06:30 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Quote:
|
|
#281
07-18-2019, 06:36 AM
|
||||
|
||||
|
Quote:
__________________
Emerald X20 Emerald X20-12 Fender Robert Cray Stratocaster Martin D18 Ambertone Martin 000-15sm
|
|
#282
07-18-2019, 07:36 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Quote:
It's interesting because I've had conversations with a few dealers and the same topic comes up that if Taylor were to keep the BE appointments with the BE that they expect that it will be accompanied by a price increase, or a loss of 1 or 2 features that are currently on the guitars. Several people out there don't think Taylor can continue to produce the BEs with these features at this price once they go into full production.
|
|
#283
07-18-2019, 07:45 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Quote:
__________________
Current: Lowden F35, Sitka / Cocobolo. Maestro Victoria, Sitka / EIR. Maestro Singa, Adirondak / EIR. Maestro Singa, Sinker Redwood / Wenge (incoming) Gone but not forgotten: Martins, Gibsons, Taylors, sundry others.
|
|
#284
07-18-2019, 07:52 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Quote:
Details, see Google... ‘New Taylor Guitars at Summer NAMM’ Not my thing really....I may have to try the V Class GCs. (On arrival). BluesKing777.
|
|
#285
07-18-2019, 06:17 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Be quiet about the GPs you lot!
I was going to wander down to this shop near the city here on the weekend and line up all the models with some other makes to have a listen/play/compare. The 717, 517, 317 , a new Gibson J45 Vintage torrefied top, new Bird, and a shop full of goodies! Except I just checked their line up online and someone has bought all of the Taylors in the last few weeks. Apart from the GPs, they must have sold at least 8 or 9 various high end V classers as well! Good! I will keep playing my 717e (and a house full of guitars!) - but the 7 is perfect in every way and no drama so far whatsoever. Setup perfect from the robots! Flawless. Rare! BluesKing777.
|
