New Used Guitar Yesterday

[tbeltrans]

One additional comment for anyone reading this thread that might be contemplating a McPherson Sable purchase...

If you have played Taylor guitars and like how they play, then you will like the Sable because it has similar string spacing and can be set up with VERY low action. I would say, generically that a Sable plays like a Taylor, but sounds closer to a Martin.

Tony

[jdinco]

Originally Posted by tbeltrans

One additional comment for anyone reading this thread that might be contemplating a McPherson Sable purchase...

If you have played Taylor guitars and like how they play, then you will like the Sable because it has similar string spacing and can be set up with VERY low action. I would say, generically that a Sable plays like a Taylor, but sounds closer to a Martin.

Tony

Ahh...so that would explain why the 2 easiest guitars to play that I have are the Taylor and the Sable. The action on the Sable being just a hair lower. And I love the tone of both. I agree with your comment.

[Earl49]

Originally Posted by tbeltrans

After bringing my Sable to St. Paul Guitar Repair, it plays noticeably easier than the X20. But the X20 has not had any set up done to it, according to David - it is as it was fresh out of the box.

Maybe I am not too sensitive. I have never changed the factory setup on any Taylor, my Rainsong's, or on most of my Emeralds. When I got the X30 it was so low that I could play soft enough to avoid buzzes, even fingerstyle. Strumming was a disaster in that respect. I shimmed it up and the new owner likes how it plays - low enough for soloing and light strumming.

Originally Posted by tbeltrans

...If you have played Taylor guitars and like how they play, then you will like the Sable because it has similar string spacing and can be set up with VERY low action. I would say, generically that a Sable plays like a Taylor, but sounds closer to a Martin.

Very interesting comment. When I had a custom shop Martin J-40 my fondest wish was keeping that rich tone while having the playability of any Taylor.

[tbeltrans]

Originally Posted by Earl49

Maybe I am not too sensitive. I have never changed the factory setup on any Taylor, my Rainsong's, or on most of my Emeralds. When I got the X30 it was so low that I could play soft enough to avoid buzzes, even fingerstyle. Strumming was a disaster in that respect. I shimmed it up and the new owner likes how it plays - low enough for soloing and light strumming.



Very interesting comment. When I had a custom shop Martin J-40 my fondest wish was keeping that rich tone while having the playability of any Taylor.

A friend of mine recently told me that many jazz players have their archtop action set so low that they frequently get buzzing. I like the easiest possible playability so that I can play longer without my fingers tiring. To me, there are enough factors that may influence a given player's preferences for set up that it would be difficult to make any comparisons. Some people just prefer a lower action and setup in support of that, while others may prefer a different approach to set up.

Maybe some of it has to do with what we like to play? I play a lot of what some call "jazz" chords with a lot of barre'ing and fretted extended color tones. So I am usually playing complex chords up the neck. I have read Adam Rafferty and Joe Robinson both talk about having the strings set as low as possible too. That doesn't justify my own preferences (which don't need justification), but does show that I am certainly not alone. It really just depends on the individual player and what s/he wants.

To be very clear about my comments regarding the Sable...

A Sable has the same string spacing at the saddle and nut as is typical of a Taylor (i.e. 2 3/16" at the saddle and a 1 3/4" and if you measure string to string of 1st to 6th, it will be similar). To me, the neck on a Sable feels very much like that of those on Taylors.

As for comparing the Sable sound to a Martin, I don't buy into that wishful thinking I sometimes see around here that a carbon fiber guitar sounds like wood. So my comparison of the sound normally identified with Martin is a deeper, bassier sound of, say, a D18, D28, etc. as compared to the brighter sound of a Taylor. The Sable has more of that bass-heavy, deeper sound, but as from a carbon fiber instrument. That is what CA Guitars went for in their designs and as I understand it, Ellis Seal went for with the McPherson carbon fiber series too. Read the patent for the CA Guitars method of construction and it will seem very similar to what I understand has been done with the McPherson carbon fiber series too.

Tony

[steelvibe]

Originally Posted by David Eastwood

This morning I ordered a purple X20, with a 25"-26" fan fret layout and an Element pickup. No veneer, no inlay, no other upgrades - #dreamguitar

Now the waiting begins...

Cool! I’ll be waiting along with you! Every indication from those who own fan fret guitars is that they love them and are surprisingly easy to play.

[tbeltrans]

Originally Posted by steelvibe

Cool! I’ll be waiting along with you! Every indication from those who own fan fret guitars is that they love them and are surprisingly easy to play.

Very true. There was absolutely no adjustment required on my part to play the X20-7 which comes with fan frets.

Tony

[Earl49]

Originally Posted by tbeltrans

justification)...A Sable has the same string spacing at the saddle and nut as is typical of a Taylor (i.e. 2 3/16" at the saddle and a 1 3/4" and if you measure string to string of 1st to 6th, it will be similar). To me, the neck on a Sable feels very much like that of those on Taylors.

All should be aware that even though the nut width is 1.75" the actual string center-to-center distance on most of that nut width is actually 1.5". That is the case with my Taylor and Rainsong, and even the Blackbird Lucky 13.

Originally Posted by tbeltrans

As for comparing the Sable sound to a Martin, I don't buy into that wishful thinking I sometimes see around here that a carbon fiber guitar sounds like wood.

I appreciate that distinction. There were no delusions / illusions that any CF guitar can fully replicate a fine wood sound. But they still sound good to my ears. Perhaps another way to say it would be that Sable tends toward a more Martin-esque sound overall, whereas the other CF brands that might be more closely compared to a modern Taylor-esque sound. That is how I would describe my Emerald X20.

[David Eastwood]

Originally Posted by Earl49

I appreciate that distinction. There were no delusions / illusions that any CF guitar can fully replicate a fine wood sound.

One could equally well say “there were no delusions/illusions that any wood guitar can fully replicate a fine CF sound”

But they still sound good to my ears.

Which, of course, is the most important thing.

[Earl49]

I've mostly been playing my all-koa Taylor lately. A test set of Elixir strings was sent to me, and that guitar had the oldest strings among all my guitars. Last night at a bluegrass jam, one fellow said that he liked the sound of my Taylor better than the CF guitars that I normally play. But I think it sounds way too bright, especially with this new set of strings. They sound more like 80/20's to me despite being labelled Phosphor Bronze. I'm more a fan of older strings and don't like most new sets in their first week until they lose the "sizzle".

We all hear differently. He is ~75 and clearly has some hearing loss. I'm younger and still have good hearing. Beauty is in the ear of the beholder....

[tbeltrans]

Originally Posted by Earl49

All should be aware that even though the nut width is 1.75" the actual string center-to-center distance on most of that nut width is actually 1.5". That is the case with my Taylor and Rainsong, and even the Blackbird Lucky 13.



I appreciate that distinction. There were no delusions / illusions that any CF guitar can fully replicate a fine wood sound. But they still sound good to my ears. Perhaps another way to say it would be that Sable tends toward a more Martin-esque sound overall, whereas the other CF brands that might be more closely compared to a modern Taylor-esque sound. That is how I would describe my Emerald X20.

Thanks for posting the actual string spacing at the nut. I should have provided that detail rather than just saying that the Taylor and Sable have the same string spacing, measuring 1st to 6th string.

I agree with the "Martin-esque" description and am glad that you said it. I wanted to be really clear about the carbon fiber vs wood thing and therefore described what about the Sable had similarity to what I hear from the Martin without anybody reading into my post that I am saying it sounds like a Martin.

I think that with our respective posts on these things, folks should have a very clear of the points being made, so I appreciate all your comments on it.

Tony

[tbeltrans]

Originally Posted by David Eastwood

One could equally well say “there were no delusions/illusions that any wood guitar can fully replicate a fine CF sound”


Which, of course, is the most important thing.

But why does everything taste like chicken and carbon fiber sound like aged Brazilian rosewood?

Tony