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  #16  
Old 08-30-2013, 11:46 PM
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justonwo justonwo is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brock Poling View Post
So back to your original question... I've fallen off the show circuit in the last few years, but that has more to do with personal issues rather than thinking the shows weren't a good investment.

I miss them and plan on getting back on them in 2014 or so.
Boy, it has been a while. I remember when you were running the AGF fundraiser in 2009 and the dozens of unanswered emails I sent you for months to follow up on the thank you gifts (me and several others). You definitely did drop off the circuit. Or off the face of the earth for a lot of us donors. Glad to hear you are committed to get back in the community.
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  #17  
Old 08-31-2013, 03:27 AM
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iim7V7IM7 iim7V7IM7 is offline
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For those of you who replied regarding he utility of "shows". I found your answers interesting. Particularly the investment in time for spec. guitars and the escalating point-of-purchase bling factor expectation by attendees.

What about the impact of online forums such as AGF? As Larry's empirical observation about repeatedly attending shows, many luthiers spend a lot of time (generously I might add) answering questions, providing perspective and of coarse showing their fine work. This all takes time away from the shop.

Has the advent of Internet communities such as this changed the business of luthiery?
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  #18  
Old 08-31-2013, 08:24 AM
Brock Poling Brock Poling is offline
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Originally Posted by justonwo View Post
Boy, it has been a while. I remember when you were running the AGF fundraiser in 2009 and the dozens of unanswered emails I sent you for months to follow up on the thank you gifts (me and several others). You definitely did drop off the circuit. Or off the face of the earth for a lot of us donors. Glad to hear you are committed to get back in the community.
Thanks. I am looking forward to it.

I had a couple things go sideways in my business and it couldn't have come at a worse time for me so I needed to go away and regroup. I have been quietly building all along though.

(I will send you a PM about the other parts of the note.)
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  #19  
Old 08-31-2013, 05:13 PM
Alan Carruth Alan Carruth is offline
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I've done a number of H'burg shows, both of the Newport shows that were in Newport, and the Montreal shows. I've also shown at a more or less local (it was more local before I moved and it moved) folk festival nearly every year for more then thirty years, and more recently have begun to show at a large craft fair that is just down the road. Obviously, I must think it's 'worth it', but I do have reservations.

One thing that seems pretty obvious to me is that consistency counts. I missed one of those spring folk festivals a few years ago, and the following year people were saying: "We thought you'd died!". In a sense,you don't get points for going to shows, but you lose points when you don't.

I never plan on selling something at a show. In that sense I see them far more as 'brand establishment' than as actual venues for sales. I do think that establishing one's bona fides by consistently attending a particular show helps in regard to sales, though. I've made a few sales at, or after, Montreal, I think, in part, because people have seen me there several times. I'm not a 'regular' at Healdsburg, and the lower level of attention I got from customers there was not a surprise.

The show that works best for me is the folk festival; the one I've been to most, and that costs the least. I know a lot of folks there, and have a very good idea of what's likely to sell. In some cases, I've been able to target particular people with a build. There are also folks who come by every year to try out particular kinds of instruments, and they will buy one when it's 'right'. I've sold perhaps a dozen five-string folks fiddles there, for example. I also get calls from people who have seen me there, sometimes several years later.

There seems to be an inverse relationship between the cost, size, and effort of going to a show and the payoff. Again, this may in part have to do with consistency of attendance: it's difficult to justify going to a distant show where you have not made many sales, and the resultant spotty attendance hurts your prospects. There's probably an element of 'last war' thinking involved: tastes change, and it's too easy to make the instrument that people wanted three years ago.

Each show has it's own character, and does some things better than the others. Healdsburg is the 'big one': as has been said, anybody can claim to be the 'best' but only one is the 'first'. It seems to draw the biggest crowds, and generate the biggest buzz. For us east coasters, it's a long haul. Montreal is still, to my mind, the best place to go to hear a guitar. As a builder who concentrates on 'sound' that's important to me. Montreal also partakes a lot of the character of the city it's in: a draw in itself. The legal/border hassles are getting to be more and more of a drag for US luthiers, and add a lot of uncertainty to the cost of doing the show. You can get hit with an unexpected fee that will be equal to the cost of the table or the hotel, seemingly at random. Newport, alas, didn't last long enough to get it's sea legs. I understand why, but regret the fact. Woodstock is said to be a very good show, but limited space restricts the number of luthiers who can show.

Every show I do proves once again that I am no longer the party animal I never used to be. The 'schmooze' part of these things is a major element, and those of us for whom that's a chore for whatever reason tend to be at a disadvantage. It's always nice to connect up with some of my peers, though, however briefly.
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  #20  
Old 08-31-2013, 05:33 PM
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Thanks Alan for sharing your perspective.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Carruth View Post
I've done a number of H'burg shows, both of the Newport shows that were in Newport, and the Montreal shows. I've also shown at a more or less local (it was more local before I moved and it moved) folk festival nearly every year for more then thirty years, and more recently have begun to show at a large craft fair that is just down the road. Obviously, I must think it's 'worth it', but I do have reservations.

One thing that seems pretty obvious to me is that consistency counts. I missed one of those spring folk festivals a few years ago, and the following year people were saying: "We thought you'd died!". In a sense,you don't get points for going to shows, but you lose points when you don't.

I never plan on selling something at a show. In that sense I see them far more as 'brand establishment' than as actual venues for sales. I do think that establishing one's bona fides by consistently attending a particular show helps in regard to sales, though. I've made a few sales at, or after, Montreal, I think, in part, because people have seen me there several times. I'm not a 'regular' at Healdsburg, and the lower level of attention I got from customers there was not a surprise.

The show that works best for me is the folk festival; the one I've been to most, and that costs the least. I know a lot of folks there, and have a very good idea of what's likely to sell. In some cases, I've been able to target particular people with a build. There are also folks who come by every year to try out particular kinds of instruments, and they will buy one when it's 'right'. I've sold perhaps a dozen five-string folks fiddles there, for example. I also get calls from people who have seen me there, sometimes several years later.

There seems to be an inverse relationship between the cost, size, and effort of going to a show and the payoff. Again, this may in part have to do with consistency of attendance: it's difficult to justify going to a distant show where you have not made many sales, and the resultant spotty attendance hurts your prospects. There's probably an element of 'last war' thinking involved: tastes change, and it's too easy to make the instrument that people wanted three years ago.

Each show has it's own character, and does some things better than the others. Healdsburg is the 'big one': as has been said, anybody can claim to be the 'best' but only one is the 'first'. It seems to draw the biggest crowds, and generate the biggest buzz. For us east coasters, it's a long haul. Montreal is still, to my mind, the best place to go to hear a guitar. As a builder who concentrates on 'sound' that's important to me. Montreal also partakes a lot of the character of the city it's in: a draw in itself. The legal/border hassles are getting to be more and more of a drag for US luthiers, and add a lot of uncertainty to the cost of doing the show. You can get hit with an unexpected fee that will be equal to the cost of the table or the hotel, seemingly at random. Newport, alas, didn't last long enough to get it's sea legs. I understand why, but regret the fact. Woodstock is said to be a very good show, but limited space restricts the number of luthiers who can show.

Every show I do proves once again that I am no longer the party animal I never used to be. The 'schmooze' part of these things is a major element, and those of us for whom that's a chore for whatever reason tend to be at a disadvantage. It's always nice to connect up with some of my peers, though, however briefly.
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  #21  
Old 08-31-2013, 05:59 PM
runamuck runamuck is offline
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Thank you, Alan Carruth.
I appreciate your articulate honesty, and not only because we share a
common personality type.

Jim McCarthy
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  #22  
Old 08-31-2013, 09:38 PM
cpabolting cpabolting is offline
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I said what I meant, Murray.
Howard...I just love your wit!
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