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  #31  
Old 10-07-2011, 12:04 AM
BusterBFan BusterBFan is offline
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Old Mailorder Archtop in Playable Condition- $100-$200
'Perfect Nut' Slide Extension- $6
Decent Glass Slide- $15
Open Tuning- Free

Best sounding acoustic slide-blues machine you'll ever hear: Priceless.

Here's my favorite. 1930's Kay (plain headstock).



It was busted up into splinters and falling apart when I got it. Took 'er apart, reglued the innards (bracing, kerfed lining, various cracks, etc) then reshaped the warpage with sponges soaked with hot water and a heat gun. Also sanded off the flaking finish on the sides and repainted the back, but left the top original. Put it back together with an old bridge w/ steel bar insert and wooden nut from a turn of the century Lyon & Healey Parlor Guitar, the thing sounds so choice. Zero collector value, but wouldn't trade it for the same one in 100% condition. Something about that rehab/reglue/reshaping process completely changed the tone of that thing for the (way) better.

Last edited by BusterBFan; 10-07-2011 at 12:23 AM.
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  #32  
Old 08-25-2013, 08:21 AM
louparte louparte is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by disguiseglasses View Post
Just curious to see if anyone is utilizing an acoustic archtop in a genre other than traditional jazz. If so, what genre, why the preference for an archtop, etc.?

Input is greatly appreciated.
Yeah, Surf, New Age, orchestral, show-tunes. It's all on my youtube page.
Here's a Surf song I play my archtop on.

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=HL0ItVXin8I

Here's a show-tune song I use my archtop on - plugged in.
I also have flat-top w/Nashville tuning on it.

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=fgZjhmWcsUc
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Last edited by louparte; 08-25-2013 at 08:35 AM.
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  #33  
Old 08-25-2013, 08:56 AM
RobertForman RobertForman is offline
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here is a clip of me on my archtop http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q0ypDnBfG08
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  #34  
Old 08-25-2013, 09:19 AM
HHP HHP is offline
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You see a lot of them in music that involves yodeling.
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  #35  
Old 08-26-2013, 02:07 AM
Doctor Jug Doctor Jug is offline
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Archtop works a treat for jug band music.
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  #36  
Old 08-26-2013, 08:28 AM
rpguitar rpguitar is offline
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I enjoy playing what I can only call "eclectic acoustic" music on my archtops. I accompany singer/songwriter types and "decorate" their typically simple arrangements; i.e. strummed flattop playing usually. The punchy archtop tone blends beautifully with a flattop, especially for melodic accents.

I also play what can loosely be described as chord-melody not only for jazz standards, but for 70's and 80's pop music and folk or Americana type songs. This is typically done solo but can also involve a singer (either myself and/or with a partner).

Basically there are NO musical limits, and I would love it if guitarists would eventually get over the stereotypes. Although I sense the narrow-minded cliches will exist basically forever (you need flatwounds; you need heavy strings; you need thick picks; archtops are just loud and designed for swing rhythm playing like Freddie Green).

How can the cliches evaporate when jazz guitarists themselves continue to perpetuate them?
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  #37  
Old 09-05-2013, 06:27 AM
WordMan WordMan is offline
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I have a 1938 Kalamazoo KG-31, built by Gibson. I think it is a pressed-wood top. Sounds amazing for slide, with a heavy brass slide. The neck angle and ergonomics are perfect and the bridge let's me do all the palm-muting I need.

I really am surprised that this type of archtop isn't used for slide more - just wonderful.
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  #38  
Old 09-05-2013, 06:55 AM
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fazool fazool is offline
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Decades ago, I found and restored a 1956 Gibson ES-225T, single P-90 semi-hollow electric, dual f-holes, floating adjustable wooden bridge, trapeze tailpiece.

I was a Gibson devotee and it was beautiful to look at but I never liked playing it so it sat in it's case. Decades later, I sold it and to fund my return to acoustic-land.

Since then I have always wondered if a semi-hollow electric would be interesting. That got me wondering about archtops. I find them to be the most beautiful of all guitar designs. I played a 5th Avenue at GC and was suprised at the difference in tone.

I had exactly *ONE* experience playing an archtop and have *NO* clue what I am talking about. This was the impression it engraved on me:

The volume astounded me (I was thinking of an unamplified hollow-body electric but its nothing like that. But its nothing like a flat top either. Its got serious volume and clarity of single notes with no overtones.

Its the antithesis of a cedar flat top: there are no harmonics, no sympathetic resonances.

On a resonance and "chorus-like scale, a 12-string is a 10. A cedar 6-string is an 8. A spruce flat top is a 6. An archtop is a 2. Its the opposite end of the spectrum.

It's clarity does not equate to trebly. It's not tinny. Actually, it seemed "thick" without being muddy.

But each note is so articulate, playing a chord seemed "wrong". Strumming didn't sound like one guitar playing a chord. It sounded like six separate guitars playing individual notes.

I liked it considerably. It was just so different from a flat top it astonished me.

I might consider one for finger-picking or for solo-style plectrum picking. I, personally, would never get one for strumming.

I totally get the gravitation toward blues and rockabilly.

I'm still strangley drawn to trying one. I just can't figure out where it would fit in my own limited playing.
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  #39  
Old 09-05-2013, 07:33 AM
rpguitar rpguitar is offline
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Fazool,

A lot of your tonal observations are dead accurate. Thanks for that. When you started talking about an ES-225, I thought "Here goes another thread mixing up archtop electric guitars with ACOUSTIC archtops." But I was wrong.

Thick without being muddy - yes. Actually, typically it's the midrange that is accentuated rather than the "hi fi" sound of a flat top. It cuts through all kinds of things, and has a punchy sound that really works for certain types of music.

Articulate notes - yes. That's why they excel for jazz, with its complex chords and single note runs. An archtop busts out the melody or a solo and floats over everything else in the ensemble. And even a dominant 7th b5b9 chord rings clear. So it's not that you NEED to play jazz on an archtop, but if you like jazz, an archtop is a suitable tool.

Less harmonic complexity - yes. Although some modern archtops succeed very well at being quite rich in harmonics. Not usually the "sparkle" that a flat top gets; it can be a deeper ringing sort of sound. If you've ever played a top notch classical guitar, the ring is similar to that. Lighter built (carved) archtops get more harmonics than the heavier built rhythm cannons, by and large. Bracing matters, too (it's all about top stiffness).

They are just another kind of acoustic guitar, and like flattops, there are many subcategories worth exploring.
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  #40  
Old 09-05-2013, 09:26 AM
RobertForman RobertForman is offline
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real carved guitars are harmonically richer than flattops, as the sound waves are reflected off the carved back - the arch in the back imparts a sound that has greater dimension as compared to the sound of a note bouncing off a flat backed guitar. the arched/carved top and bridge system on an archtop tend to restrict the movement of the top, so you don't get the immediacy and blending of notes like you do on a flat top.

bottom line, archtops are not less complex, they don't have less bass, they don't have less sustain. They do excel at highlighting each note rather than a blending of all the notes.
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  #41  
Old 09-05-2013, 11:03 AM
ronbo ronbo is offline
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Since I don't really play any jazz, and just got into archtops a few weeks ago, I am definitely playing everything other than jazz . My Eastman carved hog AC610 seems to work for just about anything so far, really like it for finger-picked blues as well as flatpicked. It is true about the articulation of each string, but this one also strums quite nicely, has some overtones, but not as rich as my hog/adi dread or hog/englemann grand concert. It also has a little quicker decay than either my Dread or GC, which is nice and works well for blues and country stuff. Tuned it down to D and started playing some slide on it and will agree that it has a great tone, especially with the quicker decay, really get's that old-time slide-blues feel. Also tried it in Dm and attempted a couple of Skip James things, most notably Hard Time Killing Floor Blues and it really sounded great...even better than my RK Maple-bodied Nick Lucas L00 knockoff (I miss that guitar!) Gonna take it to a local bluegrass/old-timey jam tonight and see how it works...there are usually at least 3 guitars and a couple of banjos in attendance, as well as the usual dobro/fiddle/mando, so I expect it will hold it's own in terms of volume... looking forward to hearing how it sits in the mix. These folks a great and don't care what you play, as long you're in tune and don't stomp all over someone else's leads or vocals. Might have to watch my occasional vigorous strumming, since it does seem pretty loud and I don't want to get the evil eye!
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  #42  
Old 09-05-2013, 12:24 PM
upsidedown upsidedown is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ronbo View Post
Since I don't really play any jazz, I am definitely playing everything other than jazz .
What he said. After playing my new archtop almost exclusively for the past 3 weeks, I pulled my mini-jumbo (or large-lower-bouted om) out of its case. Played a few songs and immediately missed "that sound." This is a whole new world.
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  #43  
Old 09-05-2013, 03:11 PM
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In a recent performance I played my hollow body Gretsch. It was the first time I ever performed with an electric as I have played only acoustic and resonator guitars until recently. It was strange to pull the Gretsch out at a performance, but I really enjoyed it and plan to try it again for some performances. For certain songs, I like the sounds I get out of the electric better than my acoustic or resonator. Also, it is nice to know that I can get a good sound at any volume I need. I still haven't found a plugged in acoustic tone that gives me what I consider to be a natural sound, or just a very pleasing sound, so the electric is a nice addition when higher volumes and good tone are what I'm after. That Gretsch has a beautiful tone when played squeaky clean. We play mostly a wide range of blues styles.
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  #44  
Old 09-21-2013, 07:54 AM
Pvee Pvee is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fazool View Post
Decades ago, I found and restored a 1956 Gibson ES-225T, single P-90 semi-hollow electric, dual f-holes, floating adjustable wooden bridge, trapeze tailpiece.

I was a Gibson devotee and it was beautiful to look at but I never liked playing it so it sat in it's case. Decades later, I sold it and to fund my return to acoustic-land.

Since then I have always wondered if a semi-hollow electric would be interesting. That got me wondering about archtops. I find them to be the most beautiful of all guitar designs. I played a 5th Avenue at GC and was suprised at the difference in tone.

I had exactly *ONE* experience playing an archtop and have *NO* clue what I am talking about. This was the impression it engraved on me:

The volume astounded me (I was thinking of an unamplified hollow-body electric but its nothing like that. But its nothing like a flat top either. Its got serious volume and clarity of single notes with no overtones.

Its the antithesis of a cedar flat top: there are no harmonics, no sympathetic resonances.

On a resonance and "chorus-like scale, a 12-string is a 10. A cedar 6-string is an 8. A spruce flat top is a 6. An archtop is a 2. Its the opposite end of the spectrum.

It's clarity does not equate to trebly. It's not tinny. Actually, it seemed "thick" without being muddy.

But each note is so articulate, playing a chord seemed "wrong". Strumming didn't sound like one guitar playing a chord. It sounded like six separate guitars playing individual notes.

I liked it considerably. It was just so different from a flat top it astonished me.

I might consider one for finger-picking or for solo-style plectrum picking. I, personally, would never get one for strumming.

I totally get the gravitation toward blues and rockabilly.

I'm still strangley drawn to trying one. I just can't figure out where it would fit in my own limited playing.
I have an ES 225T that I bought from a USAF friend in1958.

In those days you played what you had, for any style of music. I played that guitar into the 70"s but I now play a Telecaster with a humbucker and a gretsch 6120.
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  #45  
Old 09-23-2013, 10:23 AM
nobo nobo is offline
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Pierre Bensusan's got a custom hybrid Greenfield one (The Altiplanos) that he's using for fingerstyle. I've heard him play it and it sounds fantastic (Pierre can make anything sound fantastic, but it's an amazing sounding guitar to boot). The only footage/recording I've been able to find is the one of him picking up the guitar from the Michael: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UiVr89I7_0E, which is pretty jazzy though!
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Last edited by nobo; 09-23-2013 at 10:37 AM.
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